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    Thread: It's just me... evolving smartphone standards... what do you need?

    1. Member dragonfli_x's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 12:06 AM #1
      I've got a soap box...

      Big A$$ screens

      i've no idea why having a 4+" screen is worth anything in the phone realm... it's ginormous! once I start carrying a man-purse will I ever dream of getting a piece of glass that's 4+"... Just doesn't seem to fit in my pockets at that size... and I laugh at those people who've manage to get those 5"+ smartphones out of their pocket... and yet it's awesome and so portable... some don't even bother putting it away, they'll just hold it like a girl holding a strapless purse... i guess those tablets don't really do anything anymore since my phone screen is as big as one.

      720p+ resolutions!

      I'm still not certain why high display resolution is sooo sought after... it's a phone first as it always should be. Makes calls, sends text, plays quick games on the go...you don't need massive resolution to get mobile entertainment... unless it's only to see a picture of who's calling in 720p+ ...

      It has to be because the I need to see my e-mail...

      I'm not to go get a phone with a 1080p resolution because I absolutely need it to watch movies on it while... wait... it's not meant to truly do that (power consumption experience says so) ... I also do not feel that the individual screen pixels SHOULD NOT be seen!! whoever came up with that as a standard should be shot/hung/and dismantled limb by limb by an android looking for spare parts. To me, it's more pixels to power and change... yay, just what I've always wanted.

      smaller screen works better for me - a 3-4" is sufficient, anything larger is not the way to make it a mobile anything IMHO. Display my data as quickly and as efficiently as possible so I can get back with my life. the way I see it, less pixels = less power consumption = better battery performance.

      Dual and QUad cores...

      What in tarnation do I need quad cores for? is it because the OS's require all these hardware adjustments or else it won't run? geee... sounds like a certain bloated PC OS that ran like backed up sphincter unless your PC was decked out to the nines with a....huh? a quad core system with more memory than the average PC ever had... just to run decently... (Vista anyone?)

      is it for a web browsing experience? Seriously, I am not one to EVER get a phone or choose an OS simply because I can have my webpage render faster than yours... could care less about how fast it takes for me to look up a restaurant or movie times or buying car parts from amazon... pick a need, it's never worth it.

      no, it's for 3d gaming and playing my facebook/zynga games with friends
      no, it's for running autocad on it because all that power is needed to do my drafting on my 4+" screen because I'm on the road so much my laptop is now obsolete...
      it's to show off on a high def video capturing 200 fps that I can scroll through my apps list 10 frames faster in my quad code than your stupid dual core... nice

      why does faster/more cores make a better smartphone?

      and we pay for all these things we only have numbers for proof... and perhaps a HD stopwatch.

      I'm still under the premonition that more cores mean more power consumption.. unnecessary for a completely much longer cordless solution. And if the technology inside is able to throttle back processors speed and power when it's not being walled, then it's only good plugged in.

      Gripes with the Android

      because the OS built in has gotten so bloated that it requires those specs to run correctly? and shame on those who got last era version... Gotta get that updated OS so that we can be mo-betta! Yeah, and if your phone's hardware is lacking, then you must get the new one or else you're on the short bus... your smartphone just got jacked in the knees by a thug who's holding brand new knees in front of you if you're willing to pay for it. Awesome that it has smooth transient transparent transferring capabilities and your background is "alive" and all your widgets on your 7+menu screens are a necessity in your life... new options to resize, fine... the world doesn't need the newest diabetic induced vernacular to function... it's the government way of saying: Hey! If we can feed Candy to the Masses... they'll shut up and be happy! oh, new candy's coming out next month everyone!

      For some reason, according to the populous, the only way to really enjoy Android is to root it... holy mother of st. bernards, really?! without rooting it, it's just another walled in OS? the navigation system is decent unless you start downloading the entire ecosystem just to boast that there's a super large ecosystem... and then what? it's chaos theory in effect... the UI becomes a hindrance, an atrocity, but it's open and you can change it to whatever you want because it's ANDROID!!! only recently there has been the addition of grouping apps together in ... a folder?! big light bulb there...Navigation? sure... we'll give navigation and GPS - but only if you have a data plan... no preloading maps or planning anything in advance (until recently)
      What else? apps to take notes, apps to chat, apps to send notifications to have notifications? doesn't matter all mobiles do those things...

      I like Google...

      iOS
      it's the original "let's throw all your apps into a single place so you can swipe through the entire library of apps just to find what you're looking for." UI is nice initially till you start using it... seriously, for me... I'd much rather setup e-mail accounts INSIDE the e-mail app! ... why the fart do I need to go into the settings, then find accounts, then add the account. Why can't apps have their own setting button built into their application? Seems more intuitive initially instead of proprietary software setting being forced into the Settings, then Apps, then hunt through them all just to change the color of a background... yeah...

      For some reason, according to the populous, the only way to really enjoy iOS is to root it... holy mother of st. bernards, really?! without rooting it, it's just another walled in OS? the navigation system is decent unless you start downloading the entire ecosystem just to boast that there's a super large ecosystem... and then what? it's chaos theory in effect... the UI becomes a hindrance, an atrocity, but it's open and you can change it to whatever you want because it's iOS!!! only recently there has been the addition of grouping apps together in ... a folder?! big light bulb there... Navigation? sure... we'll give navigation and GPS - but only if you have a data plan... no preloading maps or planning anything in advance (until recently) (see what i did there? LOL)

      I'm a mac fanboy


      Ultimately, to me the only thing I've liked in cell phones and their evolution is a good camera and video recorder, good music player and simply watching a downloaded movie... good audio/video recording capabilities and a flash that lets me grab footage of my little 4 year old being a diva. I seriously can't think of anything else i'd NEED in a smartphone... she can watch movies perfectly on my phone when the need arises, she can play the kids games I've downloaded for her at a moments notice - we don't need speed to play, we don't need HD to enjoy angry birds, or counting games, I've got all her kids songs on mp3 in it and we can broadcast without bluetooth or wifi, but on any FM radio... without any add-ons... better yet I can stream it to my PS3 at home with a slight delay if I'm wirelessly streaming HD footage. I can download youtube vids in any available resolution and throw those up on the TV without cables... I can take 12MP photos with a xenon flash and then put them all on a thumbdrive without touching a computer or tablet. I didn't need to jailbreak or root the phone to be as happy as I can with it. All done with a phone that came out in 2010, with a 600mhz processor (with dedicated GPU), a 3.5" screen which is perfect for me ... and no other phone right now can do that or beat it IMO... except the Nokia 808 Pureview.

      ONLY way you can change my mind:

      unless there's an underpowered android that's better on battery without getting a bigger battery, if it get's a really good camera sensor and lens with lossless zoom, a xenon flash, and stereo recording, an FM transmitter, and USB OTG along with all the other things most people use (bluetooth, a dedicated camera, call, end buttons) then I might go with the more bloated OS simply because it's the "in" thing to do...closest thing that android has is the SGS3 ... and even then I feel it is inferior in terms of hardware I want.

      /rant
      VRalliance #146

    2. Member TwoLitreVW's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 10:36 AM #2
      stop wearing skinny jeans.

      just pick a phone you like, and stop worrying about what somebody else is into.
      shut your mouth. sh sh shut your mouth.

    3. Member dragonfli_x's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 02:50 PM #3
      I hate skinny jeans... whoever came up with those needs to be shot - it's not flattering, it's tight, can't breathe right... and it's LOLable when you aren't the right body type to be wearing such atrosity.

      I know I can choose whatever phone I deem "right" but wondering why do the traits bring such need? why is bigger screens, higher resolution and more cores and more power suddenly the only thing that matters in a smartphone? Who can I point a finger to? It's Apple, isn't it... and what overall benefit does one have over a lower spec'd phone... the ecosystem doesn't concern me, just like it never concerned me before a market was even around. must be ... marketing ploy

      thoughts?
      VRalliance #146

    4. Member SSj4G60's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 05:41 PM #4
      I can kinda agree screen sizes are getting a bit out of hand, but they are selling so most people don't seem the have the same problem. Would be nice to have a high-end 4" screen. Otherwise...




      Last edited by SSj4G60; 07-12-2012 at 06:02 PM.

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      07-12-2012 06:46 PM #5
      I agree with some of what you said, but there are some ways in which I'd like my phone to serve as a convergence device. First of all, I view a phone from the perspective of a long distance hiker that's out of towns at least 3 days at a time, but up to 10 days.

      I want to read on it. Maybe I have guidebooks, first aid books, or just a novel. I don't want reflow. I want whatever document I view to be displayed crisply in full page view. That means a lot of resolution. A few phones finally have the resolution to do a decent job of this. I haven't tried out a lot of phones, but I don't believe a huge screen size is required because I can read small books just fine so a small e-book screen should be fine too.

      A lot of processing power is okay with me, BUT it better be damn good at conserving power too.

      I usually don't care for web browsing, especially at home, but it's damn useful when I'm travelling and need to pull up a map (Google maps) or find some information. Being able to pull up my email is an alternative to texting. I prefer texting when I'm in a place where the signal is only good enough to text. I usually do this to request a weather report, or request supplies or food be mailed to my next town.

      Since I mentioned maps, GPS is something I've wanted for a long time, and some phones and apps are starting to do a good job of doing this without a cell phone signal, but some cell phones still waste power with the cell phone antenna when I only want/can use GPS.

      I've long wanted a nice digital camera on a phone, the problem is that so many phones make it a hassle to take a picture quickly, and the standby airplane modes use too much power. This leads into...

      I want replaceable batteries. I can't emphasize this enough. If I'm really going to use my phone as a convergence device while away on long trips, I need extra batteries. I don't want them to be big and heavy either since I have to carry them for hundreds of miles on my back. Hell, I'd love it if it used AA batteries so I could share them with my headlamp or buy new ones in town instead of waiting around to charge batteries.

      I don't care so much about slimness if it does the things above very well, especially if it used AA batteries.

      A very low power mode for listening to music would be great too.

      I think this phone is very close to existence. It could exist right now. Nokia would only need to create a Windows Phone version of their Pureview 808 and put a higher resolution screen on it. That would essentially be my dream phone. The only other thing I'd wish for is IPX8 (rugged, waterproof), but I don't see that happening for at least another 3 years.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

    6. Member DenCo's Avatar
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      07-13-2012 12:04 AM #6
      What bothers me, if anything, is the increasing emphasis on mobile entertainment and gaming: I have computers for that; a laptop and tablet(s). This means that I really do NOT need my phone to have a quad core processor nearly as powerful as the i7 in my Macbook Pro, a gig of RAM, a power hungry 4.5" screen that's brighter than the sun and runs at 1080p. Shockingly, what I want from my phone is for it to be a communication device, first and foremost. Internet browsing (ability to look stuff up), apps to post/share stuff on go, etc. are all nice too, but that's really as far as it goes...

      More than that and I have my Xoom or MBP.

      I'd rather take a small drop in performance and graphics capabilities and have a phone that can actually last more than a day one a battery charge. There's nothing worse than being out and about and having your phone (lasting all of 18 hours on a charge, should you actually use it) go battery critical mid-day...

      Also, PHYSICAL QWERTY KEYBOARDS, please: I message and email a fair bit and I find that an on screen keyboard just slows me down and/or causes a lot more typos than I care to have if I'm going too fast.

      Some of these needs/wants of mine have me looking at BlackBerry these days, as a current Android user.

    7. Member dragonfli_x's Avatar
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      07-13-2012 12:11 AM #7
      aww... SSj... how sad... you probably wouldn't be able to comprehend after drinking the kool-aid.

      leaftye:
      I get ya, but reading a book/guide/map/whatever the case may be, everything is draining battery life. An extra battery would be awesome in any scenario... but all seriousness... text is text... the only way you wouldn't be able to read text clearly on a smaller resolution screen is if it was in complex cursive... and even then you wouldn't be reading that anyway if it was supposed to be informative. Completely subjective case, I don't ever want to do extensive reading on my phone... even if I had the best Retina Display resolution... tablets are more built for moments like those... NFC those together and that would be awesome.

      I suppose I'm stuck on the idea that something as portable as a cellphone/smartphone should be for communicating and recording... the idea of mp3/video/photo recorder and player was an awesome concept in a phone... and a way to quickly view pictures ... but never would I have imagined that I HAD to have a super high resolution just to enjoy those (check that you got the footage and share or save, or hook up the HDMI to it (as most smartphones do) and display it on a real HUGE res tv. "Garmin/tom tom/etc did very well with 3-4" screens with low resolution screens and displayed coordinates, locations, nearby attractions, and everything in between that had to deal with geospatial locations... I don't feel you need a high resolution to find your way... I don't see value added aside from it's pretty.

      All that aside - I think you need a Mil-spec Satnav phone... that's almost everything you'd want in the phone sans the camera and reading novels...

      Certain things have their place in a smartphone... in depth, submersive reading is not one of those things just like I feel concentrating on a 4+ even 5" screen for more than 30 minutes is more of a health detriment... just like someone might feel a camera should never be in one, but to me this concept feels right.
      VRalliance #146

    8. Member dragonfli_x's Avatar
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      07-13-2012 12:17 AM #8
      Quote Originally Posted by DenCo View Post
      Also, PHYSICAL QWERTY KEYBOARDS, please: I message and email a fair bit and I find that an on screen keyboard just slows me down and/or causes a lot more typos than I care to have if I'm going too fast.

      Some of these needs/wants of mine have me looking at BlackBerry these days, as a current Android user.
      I've grown very accustomed to swyping ... I LOVE IT!!! It's so much faster... my next fastest would be the t9 typeset with 9 keys to create your words... then qwerty single keys...

      If only there was a t9 swype, it would be even faster!

      IMHO, a barebones onscreen keyboard sucks unless you can introduce the swyping technique.
      VRalliance #146

    9. Member DenCo's Avatar
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      07-13-2012 12:40 AM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by dragonfli_x View Post
      I've grown very accustomed to swyping ... I LOVE IT!!! It's so much faster... my next fastest would be the t9 typeset with 9 keys to create your words... then qwerty single keys...

      If only there was a t9 swype, it would be even faster!

      IMHO, a barebones onscreen keyboard sucks unless you can introduce the swyping technique.
      Swype is pretty damn awesome, I have to admit... My only gripe with swype is when it interprets a word improperly and you end-up with something like "I think this is the best approach: we won't be going over our allocation for hoes..." being sent to one's boss... or "Sire" instead of "Sure," at the start of a paragraph.

      -- Posted from my Motorola XOOM (MZ604) using Tapatalk 2 --
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      07-13-2012 01:13 AM #10
      Quote Originally Posted by dragonfli_x View Post
      leaftye:
      I get ya, but reading a book/guide/map/whatever the case may be, everything is draining battery life. An extra battery would be awesome in any scenario... but all seriousness... text is text... the only way you wouldn't be able to read text clearly on a smaller resolution screen is if it was in complex cursive... and even then you wouldn't be reading that anyway if it was supposed to be informative. Completely subjective case, I don't ever want to do extensive reading on my phone... even if I had the best Retina Display resolution... tablets are more built for moments like those... NFC those together and that would be awesome.
      Brightness can be adjusted. Since I'd usually be reading with it at night in the mountains, I need very little light to see the screen well.

      It's not just about text. As I said before, I don't want reflow. There's a simple reason for this. I scan some of my books with only OCR in the background and the scanned image in the foreground, so reflow is impossible. I am quite sure that the books can look fine as I have a tablet pc with a 5.6" screen and 1280x800 resolution. I read with it all the time, been doing it for years, and I'm sure I'll be able to read nearly as well if the screen were 4" too. I have years of experience scanning and reading on tablet pc's. I know what kind of resolution I need to be happy, and I think I have enough experience with a 5.6" screen that a 4" screen will work just fine.

      I'll harp again on power conservation settings. While I'd like to be able to read books with a phone, I'd be pissed if I fell asleep and the phone didn't significantly reduce or completely stop power consumption. That's another reason why I want an OS that will get more use and support because if I decide to develop my own power app, I'd like a reasonable chance at making my time coding it worth it by selling it to others.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

    11. Member DonL's Avatar
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      07-15-2012 04:21 PM #11
      Quote Originally Posted by leaftye View Post
      ... While I'd like to be able to read books with a phone, I'd be pissed if I fell asleep and the phone didn't significantly reduce or completely stop power consumption. That's another reason why I want an OS that will get more use and support because if I decide to develop my own power app, I'd like a reasonable chance at making my time coding it worth it by selling it to others.
      I'd like to see an app that integrates the g-force sensors in phones with power control timers. If you put the phone on your nightstand or on your desk or something, and the phone doesn't sense movement in, say, an hour, it puts the phone into ultra-low power consumption mode. Sort of a super-sleep mode. Why should your phone be syncing with the mother ship, having texts and emails pushed, logging your GPS, reminding towers where you are, etc. when it's 3 am and you're cuttin' hard z's?
      It seems the government is currently saying, "While we're conducting this unspecified, unwarranted surveillance, we're totally thinking about how to not violate the 4th Amendment that we're currently violating. Because terrorism."

    12. Senior Member SchrickVR6's Avatar
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      07-15-2012 05:48 PM #12
      NFC tags are perfect for what you're describing, Don.
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    13. Member TwoLitreVW's Avatar
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      07-15-2012 07:40 PM #13
      Yep nfc would do that.

      Also, if its a motor razr, it has smart actions that are also triggered just as you described.

      So it already exists in at least 2 variations.
      shut your mouth. sh sh shut your mouth.

    14. Senior Member SchrickVR6's Avatar
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      07-16-2012 01:23 PM #14
      And there's also Tasker if you're stuck with a non-NFC or non-Moto device.
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      07-16-2012 02:20 PM #15
      Quote Originally Posted by dragonfli_x View Post
      I've got a soap box...

      Big A$$ screens

      i've no idea why having a 4+" screen is worth anything in the phone realm... it's ginormous!
      I would voucher that using both iPhone 4S and the SGS3, the bigger screen makes typing easier and emails easier to read especially when you need to see numbers. I still think that iPhone touchscreens are still better than Android even with JellyBean 4.1.

      once I start carrying a man-purse will I ever dream of getting a piece of glass that's 4+"... Just
      The 4" phones are not a big deal if the screen format is 16:9. It's just slightly longer such as the prototype iPhone 5 leaked pics.


      720p+ resolutions!

      I'm still not certain why high display resolution is sooo sought after... it's a phone first as it always should be. Makes calls, sends text, plays quick games on the go...you don't need massive resolution to get mobile entertainment... unless it's only to see a picture of who's calling in 720p+ ...
      Retina display is just a resolution under 720p, the higher the resolution at the 4" size the denser the pixel and sharper the picture. The iPad 3 is a great example that high resolution improves image quality.

      smaller screen works better for me - a 3-4" is sufficient, anything larger is not the way to make it a mobile anything IMHO. Display my data as quickly and as efficiently as possible so I can get back with my life. the way I see it, less pixels = less power consumption = better battery performance.
      For most pros that are still on Blackberries with a 3.6" or less they are fine for what they need it and it's true the bigger the screen the more power it uses until Apple uses a new screen that uses less energy.

      [quote]
      Dual and QUad cores...

      What in tarnation do I need quad cores for? is it because the OS's require all these hardware adjustments or else it won't run? geee... sounds like a certain bloated PC OS that ran like backed up sphincter unless your PC was decked out to the nines with a....huh? a quad core system with more memory than the average PC ever had... just to run decently... (Vista anyone?)

      is it for a web browsing experience? Seriously, I am not one to EVER get a phone or choose an OS simply because I can have my webpage render faster than yours... could care less about how fast it takes for me to look up a restaurant or movie times or buying car parts from amazon... pick a need, it's never worth it.
      [quote]

      I don't think quad-cores are worth it since nobody has used a real Quad-core CPU design based on ARM's reference designs. Every Quad-core out right now are just 2+2 and they're not efficient. Which is why most of them have ways to disable the 2 extra cores when the device does not need the power. In the case of Tegra 3, they can disable all 4 cores and use the extra 1 smart core thread.

      Right now it's the S4 Krait dual-core getting design wins as majority of the phones use theirs.


      why does faster/more cores make a better smartphone?
      PC mentality in people makes they want bigger and faster things and not think about efficiency and actual usage.

      Majority of PC users today do not need a PC more than 1.2GHZ and 8GB of RAM. Most Mac users do not need more than more than 4GB of RAM as OSX runs fine with 2GB for basic machine.

      Gripes with the Android

      For some reason, according to the populous, the only way to really enjoy Android is to root it... holy mother of st. bernards, really?! without rooting it, it's just another walled in OS?
      The same iOS principles applies to Android, carriers want control. They don't want people using it as 24/7 hotspots. Since Android revenue is based on incentives such as advertising a lot of apps are forced installed to sell ad-space similar to bloatware on PCs. Profit margins too thin for carriers without them.

      For some reason, according to the populous, the only way to really enjoy iOS is to root it... holy mother of st. bernards, really?! without rooting it, it's just another walled in OS? the navigation system is decent unless you start downloading the entire ecosystem just to boast that there's a super large ecosystem... and then what? it's chaos theory in effect... the UI becomes a hindrance, an atrocity, but it's open and you can change it to whatever you want because it's iOS!!! only recently there has been the addition of grouping apps together in ... a folder?! big light bulb there... Navigation? sure... we'll give navigation and GPS - but only if you have a data plan... no preloading maps or planning anything in advance (until recently) (see what i did there? LOL)
      iOS needs jailbreak, it is way too locked down. The notification system was based on a jailbreak app and entire Appstore concept was also borrowed from Cydia. Apple didn't even wanted to do an Appstore. Apple is just a shop manage by big whigs that wants control (See itunes ecosystem) The only reason they are where they are today because at times they take risks by doing some market research and being different on some elements to draw the "think different" crowd. So many cool things Apple produce could be even bigger than what they marketed if they listened to the community and that's why jailbreaking is important it allows the community access to features that Apple had not approved.

      And as what others have said, buy the device that matches your usage and not get caught up in the specs battle.

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      07-17-2012 08:14 AM #16
      I'm enjoying the read from those who aren't holding up a fanboy flag. The inputs are well said, and the reasons behind the fluff seem slightly more justified.

      Denco: Look up Sony Experia Pro or the Mytouch Q (Android Flavors) and the Motorola Admiral or HTC Cha Cha (Vertical keyboards), definitely check out Nokia E7 (including the dying but healthy platform)

      If there was an Android version that could be completely streamlined into using a single-core system and GPU, great camera hardware with at least a 8MP capabilites and an excellent sensor, (at least with Xenon Flash and (possible) lossless-zoom feature, FM transmitter, USB OTG, Bluetooth, 720p+ video shooting, stereo audio recording, removeable battery, let's me record youtube videos, and videochat, GPS without a dataplan, it might be worth looking into.

      As it sits, my current phone is on a 200MB plan, has a 360x640 (and that resolution is just right for my needs), 600Mhz processor, lasts a decent 18-20+ hours if I'm not goofing around with it too much and taking 80+ photos at 12MP. Games really drain my battery (angry birds, puzzle games, and word games)... GPS wastes less energy. it was underpowered in 2010, and now it's gap has been tripled... but it works well still and I wait patiently for my apps to open

      Only android phone to be able to do USB OTG is the newest GalaxyS3, the iPhone could kinda do it with cameras (with a adapter and maybe a jailbreak?), but Nokia had it back in 2010 or even earlier with their n800... my N8 served much purpose for when tranferring data from USB to my phone, could grab pics off a camera, get songs from someone's mp3 player (non ipod), and transfer documents from drive to drive when a computer was not available. The USB OTG is a near priceless tool that should be on more phones!

      I use my FM transmitter to pipe music into my 91 MB 300TE, my wifes 05 Passat TDI wagon, and my 01 Jetta... that doesn't have the latest and greatest radio and I can take over any radio at work if I want to listen to my tunes ... in stereo with no input jack required

      ability to text and talk was always an option, even back in 2009 with my old Nokia n85

      I've heard about android apps that would allow you to stream phone data to TV or game console, but I haven't had any luck in seeing it effective in where I live. iPhone had this capability with apple TV I think with it's own macs, but I thoroughly enjoy being able to overtake my wifi TV and stream music/pictures/videos wirelessly when I want to show family our vacation pics when they come to visit.

      Justifying a phone upgrade is difficult especially if I want the upgrade to be the Nokia 808 Pureview. $700... yikes!

      Does the android or apple world fullfill all your needs as a phone/mobile device? is it the hardware that completes you? or is it the necessary software apps that make you whole?
      VRalliance #146

    17. Member SSj4G60's Avatar
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      07-17-2012 01:40 PM #17
      Quote Originally Posted by dragonfli_x View Post
      aww... SSj... how sad... you probably wouldn't be able to comprehend after drinking the kool-aid.
      No Kool-aid just a realist, You're looking for quite the niche phone and the majority have spoken. I'd almost recommend a Nokia N9 but the battery is not replaceable, same with the HTC One V and it's battery life isn't great. And also who is forcing you to buy these phones you have such disdain for? I was holding out on replacing my Nexus S, ideally the replacement would be the same size just thinner and with a higher res screen but that doesn't appear to be happening. I don't know what else to say besides your rants on Android and iOS are pretty much incoherent gibberish of someone that doesn't seem to have much experience with either.

    18. 07-17-2012 11:07 PM #18
      I'm still not certain why high display resolution is sooo sought after... it's a phone first as it always should be.
      Pretty much stopped paying attention here.

      This is basically old person reasoning. "But I just want something that makes calls!".

      In this day and age, my phone is basically a phone last. I spend way more time browsing, watching videos, texting and sending pics/vids, chatting, navigating/GPS, e-reading, and listening to music than I do calling anyone or taking calls.

      The calls are almost an annoyance that get in the way of something else I am doing with the phone.

      What you need sir, is a Jitterbug and some prune juice.


    19. 07-17-2012 11:13 PM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by DenCo View Post
      What bothers me, if anything, is the increasing emphasis on mobile entertainment and gaming: I have computers for that; a laptop and tablet(s). This means that I really do NOT need my phone to have a quad core processor nearly as powerful as the i7 in my Macbook Pro, a gig of RAM, a power hungry 4.5" screen that's brighter than the sun and runs at 1080p. Shockingly, what I want from my phone is for it to be a communication device, first and foremost. Internet browsing (ability to look stuff up), apps to post/share stuff on go, etc. are all nice too, but that's really as far as it goes...

      More than that and I have my Xoom or MBP.

      I'd rather take a small drop in performance and graphics capabilities and have a phone that can actually last more than a day one a battery charge. There's nothing worse than being out and about and having your phone (lasting all of 18 hours on a charge, should you actually use it) go battery critical mid-day...

      Also, PHYSICAL QWERTY KEYBOARDS, please: I message and email a fair bit and I find that an on screen keyboard just slows me down and/or causes a lot more typos than I care to have if I'm going too fast.

      Some of these needs/wants of mine have me looking at BlackBerry these days, as a current Android user.
      If you are on Rogers, look at the Motorola Defy Pro which they will start selling this summer. It basically looks like a Blackberry hardware wise, but runs Android and is also IP67 certified to resist drops, scratches, water, dust, etc.



      PLEASE don't look at a Blackberry... I was a long time Blackberry user and supporter, they are too far gone. You will be the only person trying to get ON the Titanic, after the iceberg.

    20. Member dragonfli_x's Avatar
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      07-17-2012 11:42 PM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by SSj4G60 View Post
      No Kool-aid just a realist, You're looking for quite the niche phone and the majority have spoken. I'd almost recommend a Nokia N9 but the battery is not replaceable, same with the HTC One V and it's battery life isn't great. And also who is forcing you to buy these phones you have such disdain for? I was holding out on replacing my Nexus S, ideally the replacement would be the same size just thinner and with a higher res screen but that doesn't appear to be happening. I don't know what else to say besides your rants on Android and iOS are pretty much incoherent gibberish of someone that doesn't seem to have much experience with either.
      point taken... no one is forcing me to buy or not buy anything... really posted here just questioning the mass market. To me the thinner the phone, the harder it is for me to handle, or place it in a position (without speakerphone or bluetooth) for hands free use (aka, cricking the neck to shoulder combo move. Yes, it's so thin to put in the pocket, but when it's got a 4"+ screen or 4.7" it's odd to stuff it in a pocket. if it's for people with skinny jeans or whatever, it's still silly that the market caters to "it's gotta be thinner, but bigger!" mentality. The resolution again - null, although I don't think I'd like a 320x240 screen.

      The many different android shells to make one company different, but the same seems like silly ploy and most people I know simply buy the phone (not to enjoy it for what it is, but) just to root it so they have full access to... but the hardware itself doesn't stand out to me (that's probably why i have such disdain for the android hardware market)

      I read a lot, I deal with android phones and iphones at work a lot in terms of just helping people with issues here and there... my wife has a mytouch 4G and she likes it because the camera has a flash and she can facebook/email on it, I tinker with it and optimize it to the best of my ability and am familiar with the android layout... co-worker has a HTC w/ Beats Audio and I taught him how to use it as an intro level user. I've been somewhat of iPhone support for my area from setting up email/social networking accts, changing network settings, setting up office based apps, etc. I'm not a power user for any of the two main OS's, but I'm familiar with them enough to have gripes and likes. Now the only thing I haven't done is unlock the system so it can be better... that wasn't supposed to be the case to tout such a wonderful phone in any flavor, but as it happens, you gotta do it if you want to really be the badonkadonk.

      The N9 is pretty awesome, I like the OS flow and the UI is spectacular, it's fast and efficient, the apps available are small but ties extremely well with the overall feel (from what I've seen) but alas, it doesn't have what I'd like out of a smartphone.

      I was supposed to throw this out earlier today but got rushed and forgot... my bad
      VRalliance #146

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      07-18-2012 12:19 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by WhistlerYOW View Post
      Pretty much stopped paying attention here.

      This is basically old person reasoning. "But I just want something that makes calls!".

      In this day and age, my phone is basically a phone last. I spend way more time browsing, watching videos, texting and sending pics/vids, chatting, navigating/GPS, e-reading, and listening to music than I do calling anyone or taking calls.

      The calls are almost an annoyance that get in the way of something else I am doing with the phone.

      What you need sir, is a Jitterbug and some prune juice.
      point also taken - originally I was feeling that way, only because I knew if it was simplified, it would last a work week on a full charge... so I stand to take that proverbial slap-in-the-face...

      but as you mention in your "this day and age" I completely agree that I'm doing more texting, sharing, navigating, reading, listening to music, etc... but I didn't feel that the companies that are using the android ecosystem were winning me over with 2-4 cores, superb screen sizes and their crammed resolutions, animated backgrounds, 7+ widget screens, 3d rendering for games, and an ecosystem that could fit in the titanic to keep it afloat. The UI was nice, but all frills/bells/whistles and complexity was tiresome. and the fragmenting every 4-6 months feels like a waste. Why couldn't the manufacturers of the world create phones with crazy variations of hardware? to set them apart from the monotonous drone... but it sells, right? majority of consumers want this?

      wouldn't the experience be far more enjoyable if you could take a pic with an awesome flash? or a video with exceptional sound and share your experiences with accurate recording devices that existed in the camera, but in a phone? What about listening to music in stereo through a simple medium such as a car radio? Download a youtube video to share with later (if you're a data miser like me) and do it all using a regular battery and an efficient OS?

      I keep seeing the Galaxy S3 commercials and see all the functionality it can do and i'm impressed that it's now here... but existed before... didn't it?
      VRalliance #146

    22. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      07-19-2012 09:32 AM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by leaftye View Post
      I agree with some of what you said, but there are some ways in which I'd like my phone to serve as a convergence device. First of all, I view a phone from the perspective of a long distance hiker that's out of towns at least 3 days at a time, but up to 10 days.

      I want to read on it. Maybe I have guidebooks, first aid books, or just a novel. I don't want reflow. I want whatever document I view to be displayed crisply in full page view. That means a lot of resolution. A few phones finally have the resolution to do a decent job of this. I haven't tried out a lot of phones, but I don't believe a huge screen size is required because I can read small books just fine so a small e-book screen should be fine too.

      A lot of processing power is okay with me, BUT it better be damn good at conserving power too.

      I usually don't care for web browsing, especially at home, but it's damn useful when I'm travelling and need to pull up a map (Google maps) or find some information. Being able to pull up my email is an alternative to texting. I prefer texting when I'm in a place where the signal is only good enough to text. I usually do this to request a weather report, or request supplies or food be mailed to my next town.

      Since I mentioned maps, GPS is something I've wanted for a long time, and some phones and apps are starting to do a good job of doing this without a cell phone signal, but some cell phones still waste power with the cell phone antenna when I only want/can use GPS.

      I've long wanted a nice digital camera on a phone, the problem is that so many phones make it a hassle to take a picture quickly, and the standby airplane modes use too much power. This leads into...

      I want replaceable batteries. I can't emphasize this enough. If I'm really going to use my phone as a convergence device while away on long trips, I need extra batteries. I don't want them to be big and heavy either since I have to carry them for hundreds of miles on my back. Hell, I'd love it if it used AA batteries so I could share them with my headlamp or buy new ones in town instead of waiting around to charge batteries.

      I don't care so much about slimness if it does the things above very well, especially if it used AA batteries.

      A very low power mode for listening to music would be great too.

      I think this phone is very close to existence. It could exist right now. Nokia would only need to create a Windows Phone version of their Pureview 808 and put a higher resolution screen on it. That would essentially be my dream phone. The only other thing I'd wish for is IPX8 (rugged, waterproof), but I don't see that happening for at least another 3 years.
      Honestly, the iPhone has done everything you want except for the rechargeable batteries for years now. The screen is high enough resolution to read very small text. Tons of GPS apps are available that can pre download the map data for you. You can even turn the phone functions off and the GPS on to conserve power. Well coded apps now use very little power on GPS. If you are conservative about how you use the phone (ie. turning off the phone part when you don't need it), an iPhone would last a week no problem. For music it will last 40-50 hours when the phone is disabled. The camera is available now from the lock screen with volume buttons used as the shutter release, and gives recent point and shoots a run for their money.

      Shot with my iPhone 4:





      You'll never see a serious phone based off AA batteries because the batteries themselves are so large the phone would be 2-3x as thick as what people are used to. What you need instead is a spare external USB battery. They cost about $25, are about the size and weight of a pack of cards, and will charge any USB device; something like a phone 2-3x on a single charge. If you need more capacity than that, add a solar charger that sits on the top pocket of your pack during the day. Add rechargeable AA batteries for your headlamp and you'll end up saving weight by not having to carry so many extras.
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      07-19-2012 05:28 PM #23
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      Honestly, the iPhone has done everything you want except for the rechargeable batteries for years now.
      Quote Originally Posted by leaftye View Post
      I want replaceable batteries. I can't emphasize this enough.
      Nonreplaceable battery is a deal breaker.






      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      You'll never see a serious phone based off AA batteries because the batteries themselves are so large the phone would be 2-3x as thick as what people are used to.
      I'm thinking the back would be replaceable to allow the normal thin lithium ion battery or AA's. Or even CR123's or 18650's. Those should be easier since the voltage is the same.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

    24. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      07-20-2012 09:12 AM #24
      Quote Originally Posted by leaftye View Post
      Nonreplaceable battery is a deal breaker.
      I'm thinking the back would be replaceable to allow the normal thin lithium ion battery or AA's. Or even CR123's or 18650's. Those should be easier since the voltage is the same.
      It's never going to happen on a serious phone.

      Really, the modern answer is the one I gave above. With replaceable batteries the phone is significantly bigger and heavier, AND you still have to carry spares. It seems stubborn to insist that the spare must be internal and ignore all of the excellent external options available.

      Here's a combination solar charger/battery.

      http://www.amazon.com/Brunton-Restor...=brunton+solar

      Or just the standard solar charger. Both output standard USB. http://www.amazon.com/Brunton-Solari...=brunton+solar

      Add the awesome Eneloop rechargeable AA batteries and USB charger http://www.amazon.com/Sanyo-eneloop-...aa+usb+charger

      and you are no longer dependent on the grid or stores, ever.

      Here's a battery alone with 10,000 mAh capacity - enough to charge an iPhone 6-8 times, and it weighs under 10oz.

      If that's too much, this one is 5600 mAh and only 4 ounces. That's still enough for ~3 charges!
      http://www.amazon.com/5600mAh-Extern...ef=pd_cp_cps_1
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      07-20-2012 03:20 PM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      It seems stubborn to insist that the spare must be internal and ignore all of the excellent external options available.
      I hike. Long distance. Many days between towns. If you want to carry that bigger and heavier external battery on the many long hikes I do, then I'll happily get a phone with a non replaceable internal battery. Until then, stop telling me what I should desire in a phone.

      I do appreciate you trying to help, but I'm not an idiot. I can know what I want even if I don't know what models fulfill my requirements. I don't have to bend to use a phone that doesn't meet my requirements. When a phone doesn't meet all my requirements, it's just dead weight. I'd rather carry a smaller, significantly lighter and cheaper burner phone.
      Last edited by leaftye; 07-20-2012 at 03:27 PM.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

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      07-20-2012 03:36 PM #26
      Quote Originally Posted by WhistlerYOW View Post
      If you are on Rogers, look at the Motorola Defy Pro which they will start selling this summer. It basically looks like a Blackberry hardware wise, but runs Android and is also IP67 certified to resist drops, scratches, water, dust, etc.



      PLEASE don't look at a Blackberry... I was a long time Blackberry user and supporter, they are too far gone. You will be the only person trying to get ON the Titanic, after the iceberg.
      On Bell, actually... The only options we ever got were the XT860 and the Pro+. Both of those devices are now discontinued and stuck on gingerbread, even if I could find one... I also own an XT860, and the keyboard is giving me problems these days.

      Considering that I now have a mac for a laptop and intend to fully switch (Apple desktop someday), I just might go with an iPhone next time around anyway...

      ...and an iPad, eventually.

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    27. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      07-20-2012 03:50 PM #27
      No need for an attitude.

      I'm not trying to tell you what to do, I'm trying to point out that there are great devices on the market that meet your need, albeit in a slightly different way than you envision. (many people are surprised to learn these devices exist, or how small they are)

      Spare batteries take up space and add weight whether they are specific to the phone or not. Why carry spare batteries that are specific to the phone when for the same weight you can carry something with more capacity and flexibility? I'm a notoriously light traveler, but mine is always in my backpack for emergencies because it is so small as to go unnoticed and the charge lasts for months at a time. One of these plus cautious use of the phone signal, and you'll get through 10 days no problem.
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      07-20-2012 05:52 PM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      No need for an attitude.

      I'm not trying to tell you what to do, I'm trying to point out that there are great devices on the market that meet your need, albeit in a slightly different way than you envision. (many people are surprised to learn these devices exist, or how small they are)

      Spare batteries take up space and add weight whether they are specific to the phone or not. Why carry spare batteries that are specific to the phone when for the same weight you can carry something with more capacity and flexibility? I'm a notoriously light traveler, but mine is always in my backpack for emergencies because it is so small as to go unnoticed and the charge lasts for months at a time. One of these plus cautious use of the phone signal, and you'll get through 10 days no problem.
      I'm aware of those devices.

      External batteries don't make sense. With their weight and bulk, I could carry a couple spare internal batteries.

      Solar rarely makes sense for a hiker unless they're walking in a direction where the sun is at their back all day and they don't mind the solar panel hanging off their pack. I do usually have the sun at my back, but the panel is a hassle to deal with.

      I also intend on picking up a cottonpicker charger to save further weight and bulk. It will charge the cell phone batteries and the lithium ion batteries in my light. I want to gripe about how it wouldn't charge the nimh batteries in my gps, but I wouldn't even carry my gps if I had the phone I wanted...and I really don't need gps where I usually hike anyway.

      One thing to keep in mind is that electronics really aren't needed while hiking, so a charge should last a very long time. A spare battery is more like insurance, and also convenience when in town because one battery can be charged while the phone is being used. Of course that only works with an external battery charger, but I already got that covered. I brought an external charger on a trip earlier this year, and I loved having access to my phone while charging, so now the plan is to go with a smaller/lighter charger.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

    29. Member zhenya00's Avatar
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      07-20-2012 07:47 PM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by leaftye View Post

      External batteries don't make sense. With their weight and bulk, I could carry a couple spare internal batteries.
      Last thing then I'll leave you alone.

      The point is, that external battery is the capacity of ~4 spare phone batteries, yet only weighs 4 oz, and it could also charge AA's for you.
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      07-21-2012 08:15 AM #30
      Schrick and TwoLitreVW, thanks. I'm new to smartphones, and I hadn't seen these in the short searches I've done. I'll look them up.

      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      Last thing then I'll leave you alone.

      The point is, that external battery is the capacity of ~4 spare phone batteries, yet only weighs 4 oz, and it could also charge AA's for you.
      I was starting to think this as I was reading through the thread. The weight of several spare internal batteries vs. the weight of one external that charges the internal several times?
      It seems the government is currently saying, "While we're conducting this unspecified, unwarranted surveillance, we're totally thinking about how to not violate the 4th Amendment that we're currently violating. Because terrorism."

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      07-21-2012 08:37 PM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      Last thing then I'll leave you alone.

      The point is, that external battery is the capacity of ~4 spare phone batteries, yet only weighs 4 oz, and it could also charge AA's for you.
      A few big ifs.

      If I really need the capacity of 4 spare batteries, it starts to make sense.

      If the above was a requirement, and if that battery pack was honestly spec'd in terms of weight and power capacity, then it makes more sense.

      Unless I'm hiking and shooting LOTS of video, then I might need all those batteries. That would probably be a couple hours of video though. Let's say I did need all those batteries.

      This still presents a big problem, and one I hadn't disclosed previously because I haven't 100% decided on it, partially because it requires a support person.

      First, to save weight and time in town, I'm moving away from rechargeable batteries in my lights. It's so much faster to get CR123's or lithium AA's, and the lithium AA's weigh less and last longer than alkaline or nimh batteries anyhow. I don't need a spare set of these as having a dead light or gps is not a big deal.

      The phone battery is a little trickier. I insist on having a separate battery in case I happen to leave the phone on and completely drain that battery. I need the battery to text someone at home with what I need mailed to the next town or two. With a replaceable battery, I could have a spare that only weighs 1.1 ounces. Charging any battery in town sucks. Even small batteries take a while to charge. It'd be awesome to be in and out of town very quickly. I already have food and consumables mailed to me on long hikes, so I'd add disposable and phone batteries to the list. The old phone battery will be mailed back home for charging and sent back out in a later package. This removes the need to sit around for hours in a restaurant while my phone charges, and eliminates the few hours in a grocery store that hikers swear doesn't take that long but really does. Of course this doesn't matter if I spend the night in town, but that's something I try to avoid.
      Quote Originally Posted by apizzaparty View Post
      never thought once to use my lefty for the brake. sorry in my opinion it is dumb.

    32. 07-23-2012 10:00 AM #32
      I can kinda agree screen sizes are getting a bit out of hand .me too.

    33. 07-23-2012 11:13 AM #33
      Thought 4.3" screens were too big.. then I got a GNex, and realize I was stupid. Being thin does more to make a phone feel small in your pocket than screen size. GNex is less noticeable in my pocket than my original droid despire being much larger.. thanks to being very thin with round edges.

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      07-23-2012 05:28 PM #34
      the battery idea is a good one - I started using a backup battery (cheap as hell, good for maybe 2 recharges, but then I'm still kinda being all careful about it when moving it, because it's gotta be connected via wire and you can't just toss the thing in your pocket when it's attached to another thing with a charging cable... to me it's a higher chance for the micro USB plug to get bent or ruin the USB port on the phone which would be the worse of the 2... absolute care must be taken when charging the phone on a extended battery pack... Mr. Hiker Leaf (if you don't mind ) probably won't be making much use of that if he's mid day walking, his battery goes on low, or dies and then has to sit and wait for the battery to charge up unless he (or anyone) has a specific case to keep each component in their place so that you wouldn't need to worry about anything happening to the cable... If he's at night, sleeping, then it's perfect... I think extra external batteries is much more efficient in outdoor activities... that's why cameras all have replaceable batteries, if one dies, 30 seconds later, a fully charged battery can take it's place

      and then, try to get one of those things along with your phone up to your ear... , I've tried it... I felt like a got pushed off the short bus... just saying...

      After the massive love for larger-than-needed loses it's charm, perhaps companies will go back to creating an efficient product and leave those larger screens to mini-tablets and fullsized tablets. Being thinner makes it a great handheld device... does not MAKE a great phone... I'll give Samsung, HTC, etc. (Android phone manufacturers) credit they make a great portable computing device... but to me, it's really no longer a phone. Same Nokia... I have a computer, I'd rather not put it in my pocket... much rather have a chic tablet that I can put in to my leather coated european man-purse LOL

      Which reminds me... recently acquired a nice Asus Transformer, now THAT's mobile computing... i never want to do the mobile computing that i do on that Android device - on a phone... visual suicide... and this puppy weighs maybe 2.5 lbs and has a 16 hr battery, if I use it all the time!
      VRalliance #146

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      07-24-2012 01:32 PM #35
      They do make the portable battery chargers that use AAs for power, I got one for free from Newegg a few years ago. Has some in handy more than once.

      http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16875990056
      http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...9SIA0FU0B03838
      http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16875998697

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