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    Thread: Hatchback. Seats at least 4. Practical. Oh and RWD

    1. Member 2.0T_Convert's Avatar
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      Facehugger twofitty
      07-12-2012 02:58 PM #1
      Do such cars exist and if not why are there not more RWD cars with some utility in mind?

      Post any examples past & present.

      Past rides:
      Volkswagen GTI
      Honda CR-Z
      Honda Civic Coupe
      Your mom's Ford Windstar

    2. Member Aperture's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:01 PM #2
      318ti, C230 coupe? The 996 and 997 Targas are hatches and have rear seats. 924, 944, 968 as well.

    3. Member 2.0T_Convert's Avatar
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      Facehugger twofitty
      07-12-2012 03:04 PM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by Aperture View Post
      318ti, C230 coupe? The 996 and 997 Targas are hatches and have rear seats. 924, 944, 968 as well.
      Do they have adult sized rear seats and plenty of storage space?
      Past rides:
      Volkswagen GTI
      Honda CR-Z
      Honda Civic Coupe
      Your mom's Ford Windstar

    4. 07-12-2012 03:09 PM #4
      Generally speaking Hatchback and RWD are incompatible. The point of the hatch design is for utility, but a RWD drivetrain (transmission, differential, rear suspension/axles, and the heat generated from all that) start to eat away at the available interior space in order to accommodate it.

      Look underneath a GTI and check out how minimally intrusive the rear suspension is. In particular a MKIV w/ the beam axle. Then, go have a look at pretty much any RWD car and compare that; the differential housing/heat pretty much make it a non-starter for most hatch designs.

    5. Member Aperture's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:10 PM #5
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      Do they have adult sized rear seats and plenty of storage space?
      It sounds like you want a wagon.

    6. Member ThreadBomber's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:11 PM #6
      Probably need to look at wagons

      Edit - rammed by a minute
      Teefy Buna

      Quote Originally Posted by Sump View Post
      I'm sure a lot of these guys went home after the carwash and played a little hans solo.

    7. Member emmettlodge's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:11 PM #7
      Future Chevy Colorado buyer.

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      07-12-2012 03:13 PM #8
      ae86?

      [IMG]http://http://api.ning.com/files/OFkSdwL-FfqN*sv9AoCKAv4mLnCPnHVR0DrtYm-fI73*J-E*UaO3HorcjDQg-3sfFDqVXcLbeAIveH*Sofihpf-JeAtTIwsY/IMG_2901_corollavi.jpg[/IMG]

      http://api.ning.com/files/OFkSdwL-Ff..._corollavi.jpg

    9. Member 2.0T_Convert's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:14 PM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by Aperture View Post
      It sounds like you want a wagon.
      I don't want one.

      I just wonder why we don't have many RWD hatches.
      Past rides:
      Volkswagen GTI
      Honda CR-Z
      Honda Civic Coupe
      Your mom's Ford Windstar

    10. Member emmettlodge's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:15 PM #10
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      I don't want one.

      I just wonder why we don't have many RWD hatches.
      it was explained above.
      Future Chevy Colorado buyer.

    11. Member Excathedra's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:16 PM #11
      1st Gen Toyota Starlet is a bit of an oddball classic imho.


    12. Member VwG60Kid's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:18 PM #12
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      I don't want one.

      I just wonder why we don't have many RWD hatches.
      becuase once you have a spare tire, a rear diff, suspension that would support a rwd config.. folding rear seats... a gas tank... and an exhaust system under there... all your cargo space is gone.... there is a reason most rwd hatches are 2 seaters

    13. Member Dr. Woo's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:20 PM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      Hatchback. Seats at least 4. Practical. Oh and RWD
      ├┼┤2003 S2000 | ├┼┘2012 Focus SE Sport | 2009 Pontiac G8 (2011-2011) | 2008 VW R32 (2007-2011) | 2006 VW GTI (2006-2007) | 2001 Audi A4 (2002-2006)
      SAVETHERING

    14. Member Mike!'s Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:21 PM #14
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      Do they have adult sized rear seats and plenty of storage space?
      The C230K / C320 coupes, yes. The Porsche 928, also yes.

      The C-coupes get ragged on primarily based on the early, supercharged cars with the muddy gearboxes. The later cars with the turbocharged or V6 engines and the new gearbox and interior are quite nice.









      The 2005+ models got a newer gauge cluster with a properly sized tachometer, and a revised, much-improved transmission.

    15. Member nickthaskater's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:24 PM #15
      Quote Originally Posted by emmettlodge View Post
      Should have been a hatchback a la Scion tC, but no, it has a traditional trunk, not a hatch or liftback.

      It's the one thing about that car that disappoints me

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      07-12-2012 03:24 PM #16
      RWD makes this tough. I can only think of...
      5 series GT

      5 series wagon.... though not really a hatchback in the strict definition I suppose....


      AWD could open it up to Audi wagons, but they aren't offered in the US anymore as I recall....
      Current: 2013 Volt | 2002 S2000 (#8029) |+| 2006 Pilot
      Past: 2007 Passat Wagon 2.0T 6MT | 2000 GTI VR6 | 2002 S2000 (#6343) | 1999 Miata | 1992 240SX |+| 2005 Accord | 1995 Accord | 1988 Civic

    17. Member Aperture's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:26 PM #17
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      I don't want one.

      I just wonder why we don't have many RWD hatches.
      Because if they did then The Car Lounge would run out of things to whine about every other week.

    18. Member choochoo's Avatar
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      nothing to see here
      07-12-2012 03:27 PM #18
      There's a bunch of older japanese rwd hatches.
      Mk2 Supra
      3rd gen celica
      E70 corolla sr5
      s12 200sx
      DSM Starion
      Rx7

      but again, the reasons why there arn't many are explained above.

    19. Member Uk in NY's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:27 PM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by Excathedra View Post
      1st Gen Toyota Starlet is a bit of an oddball classic imho.

      Damn, beat me to it.

      How about one of these?

      Vauxhall Chevette HS



      Or,

      "You live more for five minutes going fast on a bike like that, than other people do in all of their life." - RIP Marco Simoncelli.

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      07-12-2012 03:28 PM #20
      3rd generation Camaro/Firebird came in 4 seat hatchback form for about 10 years. First generation 240Z-280Z also came in 4 seat hatchback form. I'm sure there are plenty more examples. The Ford Mustang also comes to mind.

      All are "semi-practical."

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      07-12-2012 03:29 PM #21
      The E36 and E46 Compacts


    22. Member E CODE's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:30 PM #22
      5 series all day long for me.
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      07-12-2012 03:35 PM #23

    24. 07-12-2012 03:35 PM #24
      No such cars exist in 'merica based on strict definition. There are only fastbacks and wagons.

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      07-12-2012 03:38 PM #25
      It generally costs more to develop a RWD platform than a FWD platform, and so by extension, all else equal, RWD cars cost more.

      Hatchbacks = Econocars, at least in the United States. There ARE some exceptions (A3), but by and large, the demographics of RWD car buyers (i.e. will pay a premium for performance) is not the same as hatchback buyer demographics (i.e. don't want to pay a premium for anything).

      Could you take a Quattro A3 and somehow hack it up so that it's RWD? I have no idea how Quattro works, I know you can do this with Subaru AWD.
      http://sixsylinder.blogspot.com

      Quote Originally Posted by stacman View Post
      Top gear recommended it, so I bought it.

    26. Member Boosted03GTI's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:44 PM #26
      I still love the Starlet. I miss seeing them light up the dragstrip! If they could do a economical RWD hatch back then, they can do it now. But will anyone buy it? I know I would.

      After owning an E90 M3 and now owning a Mk6 GTI, I think a RWD hatch can be practical. There would be some compromises, but every sports car makes compromises. The M3 had a taller hump in the floor vs the GTI, but room was very simlar. Making the trunk a hatch would only add to the utility. I do wonder if there is a market for RWD economy cars that are practical with sporting intentions. I know there is the BRZ/FRS but I'm talking about something like a 5 door GTI/Focus. I know when I bought my last car, I needed something fuel efficient, seats 4-5, and has decent cargo area. I looked hard for rwd, but that put me back into BMW, Mercedes area. Not only are they pricey but, they aren't that fuel efficient either. I had no choice but to shop FWD. If there was a RWD choice, it most likely would've been my first option. I shopped the AWD choices, which were basically Subaru, and loved the WRX/STI performance and non FWD layout, but the gas mileage was terrible, the dealers weren't exactly trying earn my business, and the WRX is starting to become dated. 5-speed trans, dated interior(tech and switches), and silver dollar sized bluetooth buttons on the steering wheel were damn near deal breakers.

      In the end I ended up with a nice GTI, but do wish for something similar in RWD. This is my first FWD in years, and still have to drive my 944 often to recover what I'm missing in the GTI.

    27. Member Dinosaurius's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:51 PM #27
      Panamera?

      Rover 3500?
      -Dino

    28. Member MAG58's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 03:54 PM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      The C230K / C320 coupes, yes. The Porsche 928, also yes.

      The C-coupes get ragged on primarily based on the early, supercharged cars with the muddy gearboxes. The later cars with the turbocharged or V6 engines and the new gearbox and interior are quite nice.
      All the six speeds were based on the same gearbox, fwiw. Albeit GL270, GL320, GL370, or GL400.
      There was never a gasser turbo-4 W203 and the M271 was an equal pile to the M111K, just with less displacement.

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      07-12-2012 03:59 PM #29
      I know the MKII that this is (loosely) based on sat four. Does this one still have rear seats?
      I have always wanted one of these.
      it's not a photoshop, I checked the pixels.
      But have you seen a few photoshops in your time?
      • ) ) )

    30. Member Jordan 191's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 04:01 PM #30
      Is this a wagon or a hatchback?


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      07-12-2012 04:01 PM #31
      Why does the argumentwork that there are no RWD hatches due to packaging issues fit with the handful of hot AWD hatches? They have the same packaging issues under the rear end.
      Lately I have been testing "tip-in events". Just the tip-in. Just to see how it feels. Response time is typically on the order of 2-3 seconds. Sometimes the injection timing is a little off...

    32. Geriatric Member AKADriver's Avatar
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      07-12-2012 04:02 PM #32
      The E36 318ti or W203 C-class coupe is probably the closest modern thing to being both commonly available and a true four-seater. Most of the cars mentioned are 2+2s, the rear seats are for emergencies only. Though having owned both, I'll grant that the S12 Nissan 200SX was roomier than the S13 240SX and is barely usable.

      The Toyota Corona was offered as a 5-door liftback in its last generation before it was finally replaced in the US market by the FWD Camry. It was roomier and bigger than a Corolla (which offered 3-door liftbacks going back to the mid-'70s). Here's a US-spec '79:



      The late '70s Datsun 510 offered a 3-door.



      Both of these were true midsize 4-seater cars. There were tons of compact/subcompact RWD hatches, but these two were family cars with decent back seats.

      I love the assertion that RWD and a hatchback are "incompatible"; no one bats an eye at the existence of an AWD Golf or Impreza. These cars have just as much stuff in the back competing for space as they would if they were RWD. Why aren't they made in bigger numbers? Well they are (euro-spec 1 series, 5-series GT), but that aside, it costs more, most buyers don't want it or don't care.
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    33. 07-12-2012 04:04 PM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by Aseras View Post
      I got the (RX8) engine replaced at 112K miles not because it failed but because I hit a pig on the interstate.

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      07-12-2012 04:12 PM #34
      Panamera S


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      07-12-2012 04:14 PM #35


      I saw one once... silver paint job, massive tailpipe... and that distinct rasp of a rotary.
      Quote Originally Posted by alleghenyman
      Let's just say I like my women like I like my cars - fast, cheap, kinda ugly and beaten up, unreliable, dangerous, unwanted....
      4 coilpacks, 2 gearboxes and counting...

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