Want to know what it's like to drive one of the APR Stage III TTRS Development Vehicles? [Video]

[Poverty]

Pardon my ignorance since I only know enough about cars to be dangerous and stage III tuning is a new concept to me but I have some questions:

Does changing the turbo affect the lagginess? The guy in the video said this car experienced turbo lag until 3,500 rpm but I've seen reviews of the OEM version and they said there was virtually no lag since the turbo was bolted directly on. Why does that make a difference and why aren't all turbos designed that way if it eliminates/minimizes lag?

Is the 2.8 second 0 to 60 time from running pump gas or race fuel? Was this on a car with the manual transmission or DSG? And if the turbo doesn't really kick in until 3,500 rpm, how can a car accelerate that fast with so much lag?

TIA

Turbo kicks in same way as OEM and hybrid turbos but with just alot more on top. Ive seen all 3 dyno sheets and the low rpm are identicle, apart from that where the hybrid and oem torque levels start to flatten out, the stage 3 keeps climbing. I think this is what gives the lag impression. Trust me though it drives like a OEM turbo car still, amazing.

The 2.8 sec time was done on road tyres, on a normal road, not a drag strip. The run was timed via a gps v-box.

[Poverty]

Forgot to say, manual car.

[Dan.S]

^^^^^^^^ (fingers held point to point; sheepish grin). Excellent, very excellent! (evil laugh)

[Marty]

Turbo kicks in same way as OEM and hybrid turbos but with just alot more on top. Ive seen all 3 dyno sheets and the low rpm are identicle, apart from that where the hybrid and oem torque levels start to flatten out, the stage 3 keeps climbing. I think this is what gives the lag impression. Trust me though it drives like a OEM turbo car still, amazing.

The 2.8 sec time was done on road tyres, on a normal road, not a drag strip. The run was timed via a gps v-box.

I'm going to have to call BS on that one. There is no way that you can shove a big enough turbo on the car to push enough air / exhaust at high RPM to take a 2.5L from 360 HP up to 600 HP without creating some additional lag to spool up relative to stock.

If APR (or anyone else) wants to dispute that, then post some videos showing the tachometer and a boost gauge while driving around for stock vs. stage 3, and show the actual time lag to generate boost in different conditions.

[Arin@APR]

Does changing the turbo affect the lagginess? The guy in the video said this car experienced turbo lag until 3,500 rpm but I've seen reviews of the OEM version and they said there was virtually no lag since the turbo was bolted directly on. Why does that make a difference and why aren't all turbos designed that way if it eliminates/minimizes lag?


TIA

The driver of the car has never driven a TTRS stock so he doesn't have a good comparison to compare the lag between a stock and stage 3 car.

He's use to v12 supercharged engines... The only measured lag on one of those engines is the amount of time it takes to put your foot all the way down to the floor.

[canuckttrs]

just want to also point out that that time/hp number is very likely not with regular pump fuel. would be interested to know the difference in performance between 91/94/100 octane.

[joneze93tsi]

post some videos showing the tachometer and a boost gauge while driving around for stock vs. stage 3, and show the actual time lag to generate boost in different conditions.

This really isn't a end all comparison.
You are assuming that PSI for PSI , turbo to turbo you can compare something you call LAG.

You are comparing a unified manifold OEM K16 to a hyper efficient GTX series turbo. You can't compare just the raw boost number and say, well ****, it's laggy.

Lets say the stock turbo makes 300wtq @ 3000rpm @ 18psi.
If the aftermarket turbo is still making 300wtq @ rpm, but at only 15psi, you have lost nothing and only have an extended power band.

Absolute PEAK (500wtq+) may be later than the 300wtq stock, but who cares?

[joneze93tsi]

just want to also point out that that time/hp number is very likely not with regular pump fuel. would be interested to know the difference in performance between 91/94/100 octane.

I don't see why not....
Probably not 27psi+ but I'd imagine at 22-23psi on 93 should be possible.

[canuckttrs]

This really isn't a end all comparison.
You are assuming that PSI for PSI , turbo to turbo you can compare something you call LAG.

You are comparing a unified manifold OEM K16 to a hyper efficient GTX series turbo. You can't compare just the raw boost number and say, well ****, it's laggy.

Lets say the stock turbo makes 300wtq @ 3000rpm @ 18psi.
If the aftermarket turbo is still making 300wtq @ rpm, but at only 15psi, you have lost nothing and only have an extended power band.

Absolute PEAK (500wtq+) may be later than the 300wtq stock, but who cares?

lol at the complaints for the torque onset. the TTRS already has amazing low end torque, compare it to an RS4, E92 M3, R8V8 and it's way better down low stock! some people complain just to hear themselves talk.

[dubbinitmk6]

I would say close to $10,000 to be safe...


Intercooler is a must, why would you even ask with a kit pushing double the stock power?

Expected, but worth it for such gains.
And that was a leading question for Arin to answer.

[R5T]

Why not develop a nice downturn for the OEM set up as well, and then a 100mm downpipe all the way up to a nice 100 cell cat.
After that back to 90mm all the way to the rear axle and then the back box like in the picture of the blue one.

[O2VW1.8T]

I don't see why not....
Probably not 27psi+ but I'd imagine at 22-23psi on 93 should be possible.

27psi on 93 is doable its all in the tune, but i dont think apr will release the kit to run 27psi just because of the difference in gas and probably not risk anything, race file will be a different story if its a 3071 it will probably be maxed out on pump gas.

Why not develop a nice downturn for the OEM set up as well, and then a 100mm downpipe all the way up to a nice 100 cell cat.
After that back to 90mm all the way to the rear axle and then the back box like in the picture of the blue one.

Probably dont need the turn down as the cat-back flow plenty, why have a loud car its annoying. Been there with my GTi and hated how loud it was.

[Poverty]

I'm going to have to call BS on that one. There is no way that you can shove a big enough turbo on the car to push enough air / exhaust at high RPM to take a 2.5L from 360 HP up to 600 HP without creating some additional lag to spool up relative to stock.

If APR (or anyone else) wants to dispute that, then post some videos showing the tachometer and a boost gauge while driving around for stock vs. stage 3, and show the actual time lag to generate boost in different conditions.

The Turbo on the car is a GTX3071. Its not a massive turbo for this engine at all. People are fitting this turbo to GM's 1.6 turbo motor as fitted in the corsa vxr. Spool on those come on at 4200rpm, and we have a whole extra cylinder and liter of extra capacity!

I know whats coming next, but I'll let APR release the info as and when they feel.

In the mean time you will just have to take my word for it untill they release the kit

[Arin@APR]

just want to also point out that that time/hp number is very likely not with regular pump fuel. would be interested to know the difference in performance between 91/94/100 octane.

He used Shell V-Power pump fuel in the UK.

[Marty]

The driver of the car has never driven a TTRS stock so he doesn't have a good comparison to compare the lag between a stock and stage 3 car.

He's use to v12 supercharged engines... The only measured lag on one of those engines is the amount of time it takes to put your foot all the way down to the floor.

I could see that... my stock TT-RS isn't as fast to spool up as I would have expected.

[Arin@APR]

I could see that... my stock TT-RS isn't as fast to spool up as I would have expected.

Our downpipe will make a big improvement in spool.

[joneze93tsi]

Our downpipe will make a big improvement in spool.

What downpipe?

[JohnLZ7W]

What downpipe?

Probably the one posted on page 1 of this thread.

[joneze93tsi]

Probably the one posted on page 1 of this thread.

Yes, but that won't work for people with stock everything else..

034 has one out soon that will do the trick.

[4RingFanatic]

Turbo kicks in same way as OEM and hybrid turbos but with just alot more on top. Ive seen all 3 dyno sheets and the low rpm are identicle, apart from that where the hybrid and oem torque levels start to flatten out, the stage 3 keeps climbing. I think this is what gives the lag impression. Trust me though it drives like a OEM turbo car still, amazing.

The 2.8 sec time was done on road tyres, on a normal road, not a drag strip. The run was timed via a gps v-box.

The driver of the car has never driven a TTRS stock so he doesn't have a good comparison to compare the lag between a stock and stage 3 car.

He's use to v12 supercharged engines... The only measured lag on one of those engines is the amount of time it takes to put your foot all the way down to the floor.

Thanks...can't wait until it's released.

[Poverty]

Yes, but that won't work for people with stock everything else..

034 has one out soon that will do the trick.

i cant work out the advantages of that downpipe over oem?

[joneze93tsi]

i cant work out the advantages of that downpipe over oem?

Its minus the cat....which is the big point.

Probably minimal, if any gains over say a gutted stock part, but some of us want to hold onto them in case the pollution police get ansy.

[tdi-bart]

how soon is that 034 dp out

if you have decat and sports exhaust how will the sound change going with this dp?

[Arin@APR]

Yes, but that won't work for people with stock everything else..

How so? it connects to the stock catback or to the APR RSC catback exhaust.

[joneze93tsi]

How so? it connects to the stock catback or to the APR RSC catback exhaust.

Will there is obviously a piece missing.

With it's single outlet..





Without an adapter it will certainly not connect to the 2 OEM secondary or delete pipes.

Arin is being hilarious this evening.

[JohnLZ7W]

Yes, but that won't work for people with stock everything else..

034 has one out soon that will do the trick.

Any chance we'll see a downpipe like this but with a high flow cat and O2 sensor moved to further down the pipe? Some of us want to stay at least semi-environment friendly (and not smell horribly) and the killer issue IMO is that the stock downpipe has the cat way too close to the turbo.

[Marty]

Any chance we'll see a downpipe like this but with a high flow cat and O2 sensor moved to further down the pipe? Some of us want to stay at least semi-environment friendly (and not smell horribly) and the killer issue IMO is that the stock downpipe has the cat way too close to the turbo.

Too close to the turbo says who? Audi engineers, or the bench tuner peanut gallery? Maybe there's some non-intuitive reason that closer to the cat is beneficial? Dunno...

[JohnLZ7W]

Too close to the turbo says who? Audi engineers, or the bench tuner peanut gallery? Maybe there's some non-intuitive reason that closer to the cat is beneficial? Dunno...

Actually there's a reason that you'll love, it's for emissions But generally with turbochargers having that much heat trapped that close is not so good for EGTs.

[joneze93tsi]

Any chance we'll see a downpipe like this but with a high flow cat and O2 sensor moved to further down the pipe? Some of us want to stay at least semi-environment friendly (and not smell horribly) and the killer issue IMO is that the stock downpipe has the cat way too close to the turbo.

It's the smell of awesome...Cats are the devil.

[Arin@APR]

Will there is obviously a piece missing.

With it's single outlet..





Without an adapter it will certainly not connect to the 2 OEM secondary or delete pipes.

Arin is being hilarious this evening.

If you buy just the downpipe, it comes with all the important bits.... just hold your panties and I'll post up all the info in due time!

[joneze93tsi]

If you buy just the downpipe, it comes with all the important bits.... just hold your panties and I'll post up all the info in due time!

My panties are in a permanent state of hold, thank you very much.

Thanks for posting the pic, nice to see what you guys are towards.

[Arin@APR]

I was sure I'd have it launched before waterfest but I need to finish the website and video.

[joneze93tsi]

I can't wait to go completely catless and get the Stage2 flash.
Curious how much louder she'll become. I really don't mind drone, nor what most would call "too loud".

[Arin@APR]

I can't wait to go completely catless and get the Stage2 flash.
Curious how much louder she'll become. I really don't mind drone, nor what most would call "too loud".

Hmm, not sure. I haven't tried it fully catless.

[joneze93tsi]

Hmm, not sure. I haven't tried it fully catless.

I'll post updates once done. Should only be a couple weeks more hopefully.