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    Thread: Curse the gods, I'm losing the ability to have self control (old timey British Coupe Content)

    1. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      01-18-2013 01:51 PM #106
      i definitely agree that they seem to work well once dialed in, but the dialing in process and knowing what/how much to adjust based on what youre seeing/hearing/smelling the car do is the part that requires skill.

      i can easily do that with a laptop, but i found it much more difficult with the carbs.



      i appreciate the input though, im definitely still learning my way around this thing.

      hopefully ill have some more concrete updates in the coming weeks as things start to get rolling

    2. Member WagonHatch's Avatar
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      01-18-2013 02:12 PM #107
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      a better out-doors shot from yesterday.
      drove it over to the folks place to get some miles on it... runs A LOT better after a few gallons of fresh gas

      God, I love these things. It's like Bangle designed it. In a good way.

      May we ask how much she cost you?

    3. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      01-18-2013 03:38 PM #108
      Not sure I see the Bangle-ness

      But I believe I paid $2400... It's been long enough now I don't remember exactly, but maybe I mentioned it earlier in the thread.

    4. Member geofftii2002's Avatar
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      01-18-2013 04:08 PM #109
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      Not sure I see the Bangle-ness

      But I believe I paid $2400... It's been long enough now I don't remember exactly, but maybe I mentioned it earlier in the thread.
      There's not nearly enough "Flame Surfacing" and lets hope it stays that way!
      Classicmotoringllc.com - my new brokerage and consulting business based out of a lavishly converted first floor bedroom in Allentown, PA. I am always looking for quality enthusiast cars to consign, research projects or consultation opportunities. Keep an eye on my page as you can see my blabberings about cars and other such junk in the blog section!

    5. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      02-17-2013 09:45 PM #110
      well the mg finally made it out to the shop... the teardown adventure should start soon

      snapped a couple pics while it was nice out today before it goes into hiding again





      and its obvious its a small car, but the sense of scale really becomes obvious when its parked next to the RR... the driver is almost eye level with the door handles of the rolls


    6. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      02-18-2013 01:16 PM #111
      no holiday weekend love for old british coupes?


      i guess i need to actually take pictures of some real work on this rather than just pictures of moving it around....

    7. Member geofftii2002's Avatar
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      02-18-2013 02:12 PM #112
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      no holiday weekend love for old british coupes?


      i guess i need to actually take pictures of some real work on this rather than just pictures of moving it around....
      I'm loving it!!
      Classicmotoringllc.com - my new brokerage and consulting business based out of a lavishly converted first floor bedroom in Allentown, PA. I am always looking for quality enthusiast cars to consign, research projects or consultation opportunities. Keep an eye on my page as you can see my blabberings about cars and other such junk in the blog section!

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      02-18-2013 07:19 PM #113
      Love it, will be picking up one of those once I graduate.

      I hope to have a car collection similar to yours within some time.

      Quote Originally Posted by efrie View Post

      I told him the car wasn't going to win any races, to which he responded was "chill".

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      02-18-2013 08:28 PM #114
      Love it.

    10. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      02-19-2013 12:13 PM #115
      Quote Originally Posted by mac dre View Post
      Love it, will be picking up one of those once I graduate.

      I hope to have a car collection similar to yours within some time.

      hardly a collection, and theyre both cheap cars. worth less than a used accord

    11. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-19-2013 01:26 PM #116
      so some more snooping around online it looks like the miata engine+trans swap is a good option for an easy to fit 4cyl that doesnt require hacking the car up (shifter even fits in the stock spot!) and comes with a nice 5spd trans.

      http://rebornco.com/1974mgbgtmiata.htm

      some throttle bodies and a different valve cover...




      ~130whp with a new ecu, headers, and a good tune, add some cams and things get even more interesting... plenty enough for one of these guys, and itll rev nicely and sound like a 4 cylinder still

      http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=455361

      seems like a no brainer, and the parts to do the ITB bits are cheaper than the equivalent for the original MG.

      ive got a friend at work whos big into miatas/gtxs and does great fab work (he did the exhaust on the RR and a lot of fab on my old turbo gti), so i think i can arrage something to get mounts made with some of his junk engines as mockup.

      in any case, it looks like minor fab work for new mounts



      and the shifter even pops out of the stock hole, with no firewall hacking






      looking like a promising budget swap. im a little surprised i couldnt find mount kits for these already (maybe i didnt look hard enough...) but they look easy enough to make anyway

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      03-19-2013 01:28 PM #117
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    13. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 01:36 PM #118
      posting this link more for my own reference later... but some interesting reading on miata ITB setups. both budget builds, and otherwise...

      http://clubroadster.net/vb_forum/59-...ld-itbs-2.html

      seems a 150-160whp goal is acheivable through a proper block/head mix yielding higher-ish compression, and a decent set of cams (and avoiding the later VVT heads, to keep cam costs down). exhaust work will obviously be custom given the fitment in the mg, so that part should be covered.



      also spoke to my coworker about fab stuff and it sounds like we can get started in a couple months when his shop is freed up. so i hope to be pulling the motor on the MG starting sometime around june and hauling it down there.

      the only other thing i have to double check, and maybe some of the MG folks in here would even know, if there are any significant firewall/trans tunnel/heaterbox differences between my '67 and the '74 that i linked to earlier. otherwise i think the pieces are slowly coming together.
      ill pull the original MG engine/trans and set it aside for any future swaps back to stock, but this is looking like itll be a great fit

      i guess need to start keeping an eye out for 99-00 miata engine/trans parts now...

    14. Member sicklyscott's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 02:03 PM #119
      Any chance you can make another set of mounts? I've been dying to do a swap on my B but can't bring myself to put a v6/v8 in there (doesn't seem right to me).
      '78 MGB for sale...contact me for details
      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...6#post82404306

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      03-22-2013 02:27 PM #120
      IIRC, the bespoke UK firm that builds the crazy custom GT's also uses a new Miata motor as its starting point. I could see the older motors being a nice swap for the GT--it'd likely result in weight loss over the front axle vs. the heavy-ass iron B motor.

    16. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 02:40 PM #121
      Quote Originally Posted by sicklyscott View Post
      Any chance you can make another set of mounts? I've been dying to do a swap on my B but can't bring myself to put a v6/v8 in there (doesn't seem right to me).
      yeah im sure that wouldnt be a problem. they look simple enough that there likely wouldnt be much jigging required to bang out a few more anyway.

      looking at the pics of the swapped '74 i posted, there doesnt seem to be much required other than the two front mounts, as the trans appears to line up... i guess it would make the most sense to base everything around the shifter location and trans mount lining up, and make the front mounts fit from there.


      Quote Originally Posted by Numbersix View Post
      IIRC, the bespoke UK firm that builds the crazy custom GT's also uses a new Miata motor as its starting point. I could see the older motors being a nice swap for the GT--it'd likely result in weight loss over the front axle vs. the heavy-ass iron B motor.

      thats another interesting point. the miata engine + trans isnt especially light, but it is a little bit lighter than the numbers ive seen quoted for the B motor + trans.
      from what i found online a B motor and 4spd with overdrive (which mine doesnt have) weighs just shy of 500lb. and the miata info i found online was saying the miata engine with all the dressing (both manifolds, alternator, a/c, p/s, etc) was about 350, with an 80lb 5spd trans. so maybe a ~50-70lb savings.
      not huge, but something...
      also not sure how much weight would be shed in this application as the miata engine would only have the alternator and no factory manifolds attached.

      it was hard to pin down exact #s on the miata, and im sure it varies by year anyway, so if anyone has a better source feel free to chime in

    17. Senior Member Iroczgirl's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 02:56 PM #122
      Great idea, the Miata setup never came to mind. I always figured a Toyota 22RE would be a great swap.
      Lots of VW stuff|Rare Scirocco parts!
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    18. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 03:02 PM #123
      Quote Originally Posted by Iroczgirl View Post
      Great idea, the Miata setup never came to mind. I always figured a Toyota 22RE would be a great swap.
      thatd be another interesting option, which i suppose may fit the lower reving torque character of the stock B motor... but im not generally a 22re fan (driven too many slow boring toyota trucks ). if i were doing a toyota motor i think one of the 20v 4AGE would be a fun time, with factory ITBs

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      03-22-2013 03:33 PM #124
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      re.

      the only other thing i have to double check, and maybe some of the MG folks in here would even know, if there are any significant firewall/trans tunnel/heaterbox differences between my '67 and the '74 that i linked to earlier.
      All chrome bumpered cars have the same firewall. They did change them with the rubber bumpered cars. They had a different shape to the pedal box (to accomodate for a power brake booster) and the steering linkage is different. The car in your link has the early style brake setup.

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      03-22-2013 03:33 PM #125
      I'd bet you would end up at least 100lb lighter on the front end vs. the iron block/head B motor and bigger trans.

      I wonder if you'd have to respring the front to accomodate the change?

    21. 03-22-2013 04:47 PM #126
      What about a more modern motor like the miata MZR / Ford Duratec? Or the Chevy Ecotec? Both are very popular in the Britsh tuning market so there are likely examples of the swap. All of the motors are all aluminum have big aftermarkets with lots of ITB setups available. All of the dressings for RWD.

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      03-22-2013 05:27 PM #127

    23. 03-22-2013 05:40 PM #128
      Quote Originally Posted by InternetMeme View Post
      Oh, well, Hey there! How are things?

    24. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 06:10 PM #129
      Quote Originally Posted by saron81 View Post
      All chrome bumpered cars have the same firewall. They did change them with the rubber bumpered cars. They had a different shape to the pedal box (to accomodate for a power brake booster) and the steering linkage is different. The car in your link has the early style brake setup.
      excellent, sounds like no major changes (i thought i had read somewhere they started modifying the front cross member, or rad support or something in the later cars...) if thats the case then ill expect it to fit about as well as it does in that '74

      Quote Originally Posted by Numbersix View Post
      I'd bet you would end up at least 100lb lighter on the front end vs. the iron block/head B motor and bigger trans.

      I wonder if you'd have to respring the front to accomodate the change?
      not sure, for another data point, it seems the miata motor is about on par weight wise with a rover v8 thats a popular swap, so i can use their spring rates/front suspension setups as an initial benchmark.
      im not really planning on this being a stifly spring track machine anyway, so some normal suspension (as close to stock as possible) with some decent antiroll bars to keep things in check oughta do it.
      the next major "what to do" will be picking appropriate tires/wheels... and ill do that before i make any major suspension choices.
      the only thing i know i want so far is to step up one size to 15s... and to get something thats period correct looking (or as much as possible), maintains the knockoff centers, and is wider than stock so i can fit somewhat modern stickier rubber.

      open to suggestions/links on that front...

      Quote Originally Posted by BigSandwich View Post
      What about a more modern motor like the miata MZR / Ford Duratec? Or the Chevy Ecotec? Both are very popular in the Britsh tuning market so there are likely examples of the swap. All of the motors are all aluminum have big aftermarkets with lots of ITB setups available. All of the dressings for RWD.
      yeah, that was a consideration as well, but given my proximity to a miata/mazda guru, and the low price and availability of those motors, i think im leaning toward the mazda. ive also tuned a few miatas on standalone before and am pretty familiar with the ins and outs of converting them to weird efi setups...



      ah, i see Mr. IM himself as arrived. hows the f40? moved in to the summer house yet?

      good show

    25. Senior Member Air and water do mix's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 06:36 PM #130
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      from what i found online a B motor and 4spd with overdrive (which mine doesnt have) weighs just shy of 500lb. and the miata info i found online was saying the miata engine with all the dressing (both manifolds, alternator, a/c, p/s, etc) was about 350, with an 80lb 5spd trans. so maybe a ~50-70lb savings.
      not huge, but something...
      also not sure how much weight would be shed in this application as the miata engine would only have the alternator and no factory manifolds attached.
      Well, with no power steering pump, A/C compressor and a header, I wouldn't be too surprised if you lost an additional 25 lb. or so. that gets you close to losing 100 lb., which ain't bad on such a light car.

      Of course, I don't know how they're weighed, so one could be measured wet and the other dry and that's a few pounds just for oil. In other words, it's only a guess based on incomplete information and you're going to have to actually weigh it to know.

      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      if i were doing a toyota motor i think one of the 20v 4AGE would be a fun time, with factory ITBs
      Yeeeeeaaaaahhhh. That would do. That would do just fine.
      Quote Originally Posted by Boyz in da Park
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    26. Member sicklyscott's Avatar
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      03-22-2013 07:28 PM #131
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      yeah im sure that wouldnt be a problem. they look simple enough that there likely wouldnt be much jigging required to bang out a few more anyway.

      looking at the pics of the swapped '74 i posted, there doesnt seem to be much required other than the two front mounts, as the trans appears to line up... i guess it would make the most sense to base everything around the shifter location and trans mount lining up, and make the front mounts fit from there.





      thats another interesting point. the miata engine + trans isnt especially light, but it is a little bit lighter than the numbers ive seen quoted for the B motor + trans.
      from what i found online a B motor and 4spd with overdrive (which mine doesnt have) weighs just shy of 500lb. and the miata info i found online was saying the miata engine with all the dressing (both manifolds, alternator, a/c, p/s, etc) was about 350, with an 80lb 5spd trans. so maybe a ~50-70lb savings.
      not huge, but something...
      also not sure how much weight would be shed in this application as the miata engine would only have the alternator and no factory manifolds attached.

      it was hard to pin down exact #s on the miata, and im sure it varies by year anyway, so if anyone has a better source feel free to chime in
      I just remembered since I have a RB car my cross member is different. Too bad, I've been looking for mounts for a while without luck.
      '78 MGB for sale...contact me for details
      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...6#post82404306

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      03-22-2013 10:25 PM #132
      Awesome pick up. Definitely on my list of attainable cars to own at some point.

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      03-22-2013 10:28 PM #133
      Quote Originally Posted by InternetMeme View Post
      He's Back!!!
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      03-22-2013 10:31 PM #134
      I want an MGB GT soooooo bad!
      I need to take a mechanics course so I'm not so afraid to buy such autos

    30. 03-23-2013 01:47 AM #135
      Quote Originally Posted by sicklyscott View Post
      I just remembered since I have a RB car my cross member is different. Too bad, I've been looking for mounts for a while without luck.
      I believe the only difference in the later crossmember are the pieces they added where it mounts to the unibody to raise the ride height.

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      03-23-2013 08:34 AM #136
      Quote Originally Posted by GRNWNV View Post
      I want an MGB GT soooooo bad!
      I need to take a mechanics course so I'm not so afraid to buy such autos
      Dive in head first, these cars are about as complex as an axe. That's the way I likes 'em.

      Just get one that isn't rusty and research before you do a particular job.
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    32. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-28-2013 04:43 PM #137
      doing some more browsing online and ran across this:

      http://forum.miata.net/vb/showpost.p...1&postcount=24

      Quote Originally Posted by miata forum
      Decide on a few things up front and it'll be easier for the rest of us to offer useful advice.

      -Autocross, what class?
      -Wheel to wheel racing or HPDE only, what class?
      -Street only?
      -Does it need to be emissions legal in any state? (what state)
      -Must it be able to run on pump gas and if so, what octane?
      -Must it run in a street car, (A/C, OEM alternator, col start driveability etc) ?
      -Actual budget for everything connected to engine/power making hardware?
      -Tuned by a pro or semi-knowledgeable amateur?
      -You cool with the additional tuning/set up hassles of an IRTB set up?
      -Does the car need to be quiet?
      -Do you have a shop in mind that is familiar with race BP series builds?

      Cost no object, I suspect someone could build a 300whp grenade that runs on exotic fuel. In the real world 150-190whp is doable within the budget of the most of us.

      150whp is bolt-ons and a good tune. Above that you need to go into the motor.
      160-165whp is just a little bowl work and compression.
      170whp requires more substantial head work or mild cams or lots of compression, pick one.
      185whp requires mild cams (still streetable in a VVT), compression, porting. Pick two.
      195whp full head work, lots of compression and mild to medium race cams.
      205whp+ is pretty much a full race engine with cams that would probably never idle for street use.
      225whp+ so and the life expectancy begins to shorten. Perhaps 15-30 race hrs and you're looking at a $15-20K long block.

      We have just touched 180whp on stock cams with an NB2 motor but it was not cheap. Based on the data from that experiment, I know 190whp on stock cams is possible with IRTB's, more compression and E85. At that point however, you should just feed it the cams it wants. We played with stock cams to gain a higher BFSC for endurance racing.

      For most guys, I think a stock-ish cam NB2 build makes the most sense. Run as much compression as your fuel will stand, get the best ECU you can, build a Honda B series manifold grafted onto the Mazda flange, RB/Maruha/Maxim works header, fully port and polish the head. Forged everything, SUB's and heavier valve springs. That should net and easy 175whp or so, be safe to 8000rpm sustained, idle like a stocker and last 100 race hours.
      seems to be a good estimate for outputs.. sort of confirming what i found earlier.

      im hunting for 1999-2000 wrecked miatas on copart now, and planning to go for a spin in a coworker's swapped miata thats running a 2000 motor with some bolt ons to get an idea of the feeling in a similar-ish weighted car.

      more planning/boring stuff, i know... but required

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      03-28-2013 05:03 PM #138
      I think this is a good plan. The 1.8L Miata motor doesn't like to rev, really, but MSnS might help in that department. And hey, that suits the character of the original motor, right?

      Wonder what an LSD costs for an MG?

    34. 03-28-2013 05:36 PM #139
      Quote Originally Posted by ValveCoverGasket View Post
      g



      tuned that a couple years ago for a local MG/brit car shop, that swap was in a convertible MGB, but just the right amount of power, and lighter if i remember correctly than the original motor.
      Is that a GM 3100 or 3400??

    35. Geriatric Member ValveCoverGasket's Avatar
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      03-28-2013 05:54 PM #140
      Quote Originally Posted by Numbersix View Post
      I think this is a good plan. The 1.8L Miata motor doesn't like to rev, really, but MSnS might help in that department. And hey, that suits the character of the original motor, right?

      Wonder what an LSD costs for an MG?
      i wasnt going to be that picky with suiting the original character, an s2k setup would have been lovely! but yeah sure... relatively lower reving and a 4cyl fits the bill. some guys online in my forum browsing were claiming 8k red lines with ITBs, cams, and good valve springs - maybe you can confirm/deny this - but 8k would be plenty high

      a nice LSD would be good, i havent really looked into that. the v6 gm setup we tuned was on stock (new) MG suspenion, and had the stock MG rear end, and honestly the only thing i felt like it needed was stiffer suspension. the miata motor will be making even less torque, so oughta be able to get by without an LSD... though it would no doubt be a "nice to have" item

      Quote Originally Posted by Jettavr666 View Post
      Is that a GM 3100 or 3400??
      its this guy
      http://www.bradleyrestoration.com/pr...v6-conversion/

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