Porsche 914 or BMW 2002?

[Jrod511]

Found a nice 1973 Porsche 914 that is a great driver; looks good, some nice upgrades. Not a perfect car, but pretty sharp. 2.0 motor.

Also found a 1974 BMW 2002 owned by the owner of the body shop I use. The interior is in great condition, and according to him all the mechanicals are sorted out. The car has all of the trim off and has had the body prepped and is in the paint booth but not painted yet. I asked about the car and if I could basically choose a color, to which he said yes. I will go see that car this Monday.

But between the two I'm looking for insight and advice. I know, rust, rust, rust, look out for rust. But in general has one aged better than the other? I'm smitten by the 914's more exotic look and targa top, but the thought of getting a good running 2002 right out of paint in my choice of colors is pretty tempting also.

Figure either or; the price is about the same (5-6k range)

[Uberod]

I can't comment on the 914 since I've never had one, but my 2002 was probably the most fun and direct car to drive that I've ever had. There is a lot you can do to the motor performance -wise and visibility is excellent (probably why some people said its like being in a fishbowl). Lots of room on the inside for being such a small car. Rust was really only a problem on the rear strut towers, but a/l/a you know what to look for--you will be okay. Just do your research and legwork no matter what you choose.

Maintenance is super easy on the BMW and probably has easier access too. Its very balanced and would make an excellent auto-cross or weekend fun car. Parts were fairly cheap and there is a huge following for them. I let the one I had go a year or so back, and regret it to this day.

I'll let you chew on this for a while:

BTW--this is Schwarz Black

[spockcat]

I've had a number of 914s. Is the car a FL or Southern car only? They tended to rust in the rockers, B pillar (sail panel), and under the battery tray in the engine bay from battery overflows.

The rocker rust will cause chassis flex. The battery box rust can cause rear pickup point suspension failure. B pillar rust just looks crappy.

[Maxvla]

Look how small those pillars are in the 2002! Great visibility, but surely not all that safe.

[Bullethead]

Is the 2002 a Tii, and the 914 correct OG 2.0? Both are great cars with huge followings, ready club support and parts availability. Assuming neither has been modified and are in good mechanical condition, the BMW is less fussy to use daily, while the 914 offers top-off motoring and stellar handling. Both are subject to serious rust issues so inspect carefully... also for any accident damage. Aside from personal tastes there's market interest and values, which may be part of your decision. If they're both #3+ or better cars (and it sounds like the BMW will certainly be #2 with your choice of paint) here's a comparo...

'73 914 2.0: http://www.hagerty.com/valuationtool...ort?vc=1330735

'74 BMW 2002: http://www.hagerty.com/valuationtool...ort?vc=1330793

So even though I own a couple of 914s as well as BMWs (E9s), the deal you've described points to the 2002. Especially if it has a sunroof... if it was a roundie there'd be no question. BTW, color makes a difference in resale value with either of these. Factory Porsche shades like Ravenna or Tangerine are desirable. If that BMW is a good color, don't change it! Good luck, drive what you like best.

[C4 A6]

Thread is useless without a poll.

2002.

[Bullethead]

Look how small those pillars are in the 2002! Great visibility, but surely not all that safe.

I drive nothing but vintage, from a '64 VW bus to a '67 911S and the truth on using ANY old car for transportation is that they're ALL unsafe. That tall greenhouse is a good thing, see everything going on around you... drive vintage like you'd ride a motorcycle.

[Jrod511]

The 914 has been a Northeast car for at least the past, say, 10 years. It looks to have been cared for and the owner claims to have gone through the car after it had a paintjob and POR'd the unseen bits; no rust. (Have not seen). The 914 the owner claims was a 1.7 taken out to a 2.0 (no details yet on how this was done; swapped to a 2.0, or a stroked 1.7, or what exactly).

The '02 has been already stripped and prepped for paint; it's down to bare metal. The previous color (don't know it was original or not) was an orangey-red. Honestly, I'd prefer a light/bright silver or white.

[not_a_chick_car]

The only way to know if the teener is worth buying is to look it over yourself. All 914s have either had rust fixed or need rust fixed.

Pull the passenger side outer rocker cover and go after the longitudinal with a screwdriver. look under the battery tray and area below it, clear down to the rear suspension console for evidence of rust or shoddy repair.

If the 914 is good it would be my preference. But with the 2002 being bare naked it will be easier to check.

Have fun

[Air and water do mix]

The 914 has been a Northeast car for at least the past, say, 10 years. It looks to have been cared for and the owner claims to have gone through the car after it had a paintjob and POR'd the unseen bits; no rust. (Have not seen). The 914 the owner claims was a 1.7 taken out to a 2.0 (no details yet on how this was done; swapped to a 2.0, or a stroked 1.7, or what exactly).

on the 914, the cases are the same, so if it's been taken to 2 liters, then the thing to look for is heads. 2.0 Bus heads have 4 intake studs while 914 2 liter heads have 3. If the Bus heads are on there, it won't perform as well as it should, as those have smaller valves and ports, also raising the temp. If it has the 1.7 heads, it would likely run better than Bus heads, but I don't remember how to identify them. I believe they have 4 studs like the 2.0 Bus, but you'd better double check that.

I've never had a 914, but I did own a 2002. As stated, they're really simple to service, as you can easily get to the starter, alternator, distributor, carburetor, valve cover... Almost nothing is in the way of anything else. It's fantastic! Certainly the 914 has a handling advantage, but serviceability? That goes to the 2002 hands down.

Both cars are excellent choices. As far as I'm concerned it's like choosing between Raquel Welch and Ann Margaret. You simply can't go wrong.

[urbancynic]

I've never owned either, but my dad rallied a 2002 in Africa, and he worked on more than a few 914's.

He would say 2002 because the 914's are a pain to work on, and he has a sweet spot for the 2002's.

I like them both, but would love a 914.

[Jrod511]

Both cars are excellent choices. As far as I'm concerned it's like choosing between Raquel Welch and Ann Margaret. You simply can't go wrong.

Thanks for the useful engine info; that will help me clarify what I am or am not looking at.

I'm glad to hear that the '02's are simple cars. I'm not entirely surprised by that, but I do like simple. I had an MGB-GT and while it was simple it was miserable also. I admit, I'm pretty stoked to go see the BMW at the paint shop and see what is what with it.

I'm kind of a Jeannie Shrimpton man though. Am I out of my league here?

[Bullethead]

I'm kind of a Jeannie Shrimpton man though. Am I out of my league here?

Absolutely not. And if you're gonna keep her, choose any color you like.

[Air and water do mix]

Thanks for the useful engine info; that will help me clarify what I am or am not looking at.

I'm glad to hear that the '02's are simple cars. I'm not entirely surprised by that, but I do like simple. I had an MGB-GT and while it was simple it was miserable also. I admit, I'm pretty stoked to go see the BMW at the paint shop and see what is what with it.

I'm kind of a Jeannie Shrimpton man though. Am I out of my league here?

Glad to help.

She's verry pretty, but a little thin for my tastes.



I'll take Raquel any time.



Yowza! Remember, this is after she had her two kids!

[Uberod]

Absolutely not. And if you're gonna keep her, choose any color you like.

I second this.

Either would be a great car to get your knuckles dirty with. As prev posted, there is tons of engine room to work on the 02--and lots of aftermarket too if u want to go that route--prob just as much for the 914.

My example had a 292 schrick cam, dual Weber DCOE 45 carbs, petronix ignition, etc. It ran great and was probably putting out somewhere near 165-170hp--for a 2200lb car it was awesome!

Just buy what you like and enjoy it. Tons of resources and forums out there for both as well. You have to live with it. Buy what you like!!

Keep us posted!!

[Air and water do mix]

My example had a 292 schrick cam, dual Weber DCOE 45 carbs, petronix ignition, etc. It ran great and was probably putting out somewhere near 165-170hp--for a 2200lb car it was awesome!

Mang! That sounds sweeeeeeeeeet. Why would you ever get rid of one like that? Another project? A woman? What?

[Jrod511]

OK, so I got to see the 2002 in person. ALL trim is off the car (including windshield and back glass) and it is in the shop taped up for paint. The owner removed the tape and paper so I could (just barely) see the inside and he fired it up on jackstands for me; sounds like it runs healthy. Car is completely stock from what I can tell. The original color is Verona Red and as much as I'd like white I'd probably end up going with the stock color so everything matches in the jambs and underhood, floors, etc.

I've been getting information on the 914 slowly; I am also trying to find out about transportation on the car because that's a real cost to consider.

[flytech78]

Love my 914 had experience with a 2002 its a totally different feel.
It all depends on what you really want. The 914 will be lower to maintain aka no water or drive train and i think super fun to drive. They are really starting to go up on price and you will be buying it before the big price jump. The 2002 is a easier day to day car because its easier to get in and out of, there is more storage so going to the grocery store is easy and you can pick a friend up at the airport with it but, it dose not drive the same.
Ill be selling this car to one lucky guy here soon just need to replace all the front end components, almost done. It has new high compression 2.1l motor with duel webers a new 6k paint job with no rust ,new interior, new front and rear suspension bushings rods control arms.

[Air and water do mix]

I think that's a good decision on the color. Red is solid, but if I were to change it, it would probably be Inka orange.

[Bullethead]

^^^^ +1, Inka & Golf are favorite BMW shades. But Verona is a pretty red (if you like red). Jrod, is it a tii, and sunroof or no? Those make a big difference.

BTW, how far does the teener need to be shipped?

[PoorHouse]

I've had a couple 2002's and still love them.

I'm leaning toward the 914 though as it is the best year with the best engine. Hopefully it still has the original fuel injection.

The big bumper 2002 is IMO less appealing than the early cars.

This is assuming that both are in comparable condition.

[flytech78]

I've had a couple 2002's and still love them.

I'm leaning toward the 914 though as it is the best year with the best engine. Hopefully it still has the original fuel injection.

The big bumper 2002 is IMO less appealing than the early cars.

This is assuming that both are in comparable condition.

Actually the best 914 years were 75,76 they had the transmission upgrades the 2.0 motor the guage cluster and the better rust inhibiter coating. And lets hope the original fuel injection is gone because its a nightmare.

[BostonB6]

I vote for the 2002. As for the color, are you getting a full respray including engine compartment and jambs, etc. If yes, choose any color you want. If no, I would stick to the original color. IMO Nothing looks worse than a repainted car where the "collar & cuffs" don't match and it does severely impact resale value.

[Chris_V]

Actually the best 914 years were 75,76 they had the transmission upgrades the 2.0 motor the guage cluster and the better rust inhibiter coating. And lets hope the original fuel injection is gone because its a nightmare.

I thought the best years were the '73-74 2.0, as they were still small bumper cars and the 2 liter was the better unit (it was technically the replacement for the 2 liter 6 in the 914-6 that was discontinued in '72). The trans should be the same from '73-76 (side shifter vs end shifter of the '70-72).

I've had 914s and a 2002. I'll choose the 914 every time, though you can't really go wrong with either.

[slirt]

doubt i can offer any real practical advice, but i've considered both those cars in the last few years and driven a couple examples of each; i love them both fairly equally, so as most of us agree, it'd be hard to go wrong with either.

the thing that struck me about both was how heavy the manual steering was; i drove a non-PS '85 GTI for 8 years so i thought it wouldn't matter (esp since they're both lighter) but boy was i wrong! the 2002 was especially tough, but i felt how both would be fine/great once up to speed.

you know all the pertinent factors already (rust, etc.), so really it comes down to subjective wants: you've owned a few BMWs (and maybe even P-cars?), but have you ever owned a mid-engined and/or aircooled car? or a targa? that does meet your earlier open-air criterion; and on that note, i second a sunroof on the 2002 being a perk (it's pretty good-sized). also, if you go with the 2002: it is one of the rare exceptions where i think the US-spec "diving board" bumpers actually kinda work, but if you wanted, after paint you could always do the Euro-spec bumpers. and i know roundies are preferred, but the rectangle taillights have grown on me recently, too.

good luck we're all looking forward to the next Jrod adventure!

[jmj]

The 2002 is my all time favorite car. I owned a '76 but it had an automatic, the rings were shot and it needed a center bearing on the drive shaft. An old lady in a Grand Prix hit me head on and killed the car, which was just as well because at the time the last thing I needed was a money pit.

Mine looked pretty similar to this one:



In my mind it looked like this one, though!

[PoorHouse]

I thought the best years were the '73-74 2.0, as they were still small bumper cars and the 2 liter was the better unit (it was technically the replacement for the 2 liter 6 in the 914-6 that was discontinued in '72). The trans should be the same from '73-76 (side shifter vs end shifter of the '70-72).

I've had 914s and a 2002. I'll choose the 914 every time, though you can't really go wrong with either.

That is my understanding as well.