Need advice: Rav4 with a blown engine

[IsraelGT]

My friend drives a 4 cyl. 2007 Rav4 Sport, with 45,000 miles.
Two days ago, the car started making noises, along with his stop engine light. He towed the car to the Toyota dealer, where they said he had no oil in his engine.
The car is under powertrain warranty, but they are not willing to cover the repair claiming he was late by 1000 miles to his oil change.
I find it all strnage, since he had no leaks, and no smoke indicating any problems...
They are offering him 10% discount.
Should he accept their offer or fight this?

[GolfVIDriver]

My friend drives a 4 cyl. 2007 Rav4 Sport, with 45,000 miles.
Two days ago, the car started making noises, along with his stop engine light. He towed the car to the Toyota dealer, where they said he had no oil in his engine.
The car is under powertrain warranty, but they are not willing to cover the repair claiming he was late by 1000 miles to his oil change.
I find it all strnage, since he had no leaks, and no smoke indicating any problems...
They are offering him 10% discount.
Should he accept their offer or fight this?

When was the last oil change? Who did it, and can he prove it with a receipt?

Climb under the car to see if there are any leaks due to wrong/misperformed oil change.

[urogolf]

call Toyota Customer Service.. they will most likely cover it!

[oh noes! cars!]

1k over...yea ok toyota

[clutchrider]

My friend drives a 4 cyl. 2007 Rav4 Sport, with 45,000 miles.
Two days ago, the car started making noises, along with his stop engine light. He towed the car to the Toyota dealer, where they said he had no oil in his engine.
The car is under powertrain warranty, but they are not willing to cover the repair claiming he was late by 1000 miles to his oil change.
I find it all strnage, since he had no leaks, and no smoke indicating any problems...
They are offering him 10% discount.
Should he accept their offer or fight this?

Personally I'd fight it. No way going 1k over on an oil change is going to cause an issue. And I would hope your friend would have noticed any oil spilling, leaking, smoking from the car otherwise.

Also, why wouldn't the low oil lamp have gone off before the engine one? And for that matter did his Maintenance lamp go off or MFD say he needed service? Cars are preset with intervals and my 2005 Matrix even had a maintenance light that went off every 5k.

[IsraelGT]

I know he services his car at the Toyota dealer, thus they claim he was late for his oil change. I justdon't understand how being late makes a 45,000 mile car lose its oil.

[Juiced6]

no leaks
no oil
and only 1000 miles past its oil change interval


something does not add up

Is the drain plug in the oil pan?
Filter on tight?
Oil ever changed?

call Toyota with a complaint - the dealership will bend over backwards

[DISI 2.3T]

Go straight to Toyoda.

[Egz]

Please don't tell me they are basing the "1,000 miles late" based on 3k oil changes.

[too_slow]

Call Toyota, and have the repair conducted at a different Toyota dealership

[tomjava]

Call Toyota HQ to complain, what caused the damaged, no oil?

[rimtrim]

From the customer's perspective, I would say it can't hurt to spend some time fighting with Toyota, especially if he has clear records of the oil changes and mileage.

That being said, many manufacturers consider it "within spec" for a car to burn as much as a quart every 1500 miles. Unless the car has an automatic oil level sensor (not oil pressure or oil life monitor) it's the customer's responsibility to check the oil once in awhile. The fact that most people don't do this is partially a fault of the manufacturers, who like to give the impression that everything in a modern car is "lifetime" and "maintenance-free". But if you want your engine to last, check the oil.

-Andrew L

[caj1]

The "industry standard" for oil consumption in a vehicle with under 50K miles is 1 quart per 1000 miles. Whether or not it's realistic, not checking your oil every few fill ups is asking for trouble.

[GolfTango]

I blame the stop engine light.

[Aonarch]

Go straight to Toyoda.

This.

[Non_Affiliated]

I know he services his car at the Toyota dealer, thus they claim he was late for his oil change. I justdon't understand how being late makes a 45,000 mile car lose its oil.

Hmmmmm. Toyota Dealership taking the same business model as a VW Dealership?

[Fe2O3]

I blame the stop engine light.

Where can I find these parts?

[SchnellFowVay]

Um, he should fight the hell out of this.

First step is to take it up with the manager of the dealership (if he has not alrady done that).

Then go to Toyota.

If the engine died from sludging (takes wayyy more than 1,000 miles), then I could MAYBE see them blaming the late oil change.

But the fact that htere was ZERO oil in the pan? That doesn't just happen. If the engine was burning tons of oil, that's a manufacturer's warranty issue. Of they dealership screwed up at the last oil change, that's a dealership issue. None of it is your firend's problem.

[GolfTango]

Where can I find these parts?

These parts can be obtained via overnight from Japan.

[gonzo08452]

They will probably open up the motor. If there is sludge, then you may have to provide some service history. Good luck though.

[Old Windy]

I know the 1998 to 2002 Corolla's are known for more than average Oil Consumption. Not sure if the same applies to RAV 4, but 1,000 miles and no oil. Something does not add up.

[O2VW1.8T]

My friend drives a 4 cyl. 2007 Rav4 Sport, with 45,000 miles.
Two days ago, the car started making noises, along with his stop engine light. He towed the car to the Toyota dealer, where they said he had no oil in his engine.
The car is under powertrain warranty, but they are not willing to cover the repair claiming he was late by 1000 miles to his oil change.
I find it all strnage, since he had no leaks, and no smoke indicating any problems...
They are offering him 10% discount.
Should he accept their offer or fight this?

Fight it these engines are known to burn oil and some times they burn a lot. 1000 miles is nothing, if it was our dealer it would get covered 100% as long as he had proof of changing the oil.


EDIT

Just noticed it was a 2007 does he know when the car was build might be out 5 years/60k miles. I would still call toyota and they might just charge him labor or goodwill it

[caj1]

Fight it these engines are known to burn oil and some times they burn a lot. 1000 miles is nothing, if it was our dealer it would get covered 100% as long as he had proof of changing the oil.

So it's no longer the owners responsibility to check oil level occasionally?

I'm not understanding how the oil change matters if the engine is burning oil within spec..

[SchnellFowVay]

So it's no longer the owners responsibility to check oil level occasionally?

I'm not understanding how the oil change matters if the engine is burning oil within spec..

Nobody said that. We've had this debate before (and I think you may have been in on it) in the thread about modern BMWs/Minis without dipsticks.

At any rate, the point is that the 1000 miles over the oil change limit is totally irrelevant here.

If the engine really burned enough oil so that it was "empty," it was clearly a product defect (covered under warranty). If the oil spilled out because of a crappy oil change job done by the dealer, then it is the dealer's fault. If the drain plug broke, then it's the manufacturer's problem.

The bottom line is that this is either the dealer's, or Toyota's, problem.

Disclaimer: I am basing this only on the facts presented. These sorts of issues almost always have "additional" facts that are conveniently left out of the version of the story that we are presented with.

[Spell Check Desk]

1k over...yea ok toyota

I thought Kia was bad for refusing a customer warranty on a broken timing belt because the customer was 3000KM over their last oil change

I'd seen one Kia customer denied warranty on a failed transmission because he did the oil changes himself.

[IsraelGT]

The dealer isn't claiming it is his fault, but rather that he was late to his oil changes thus broke the warranty, since it says the owner has to service the car in the stated milage.

[stuvy]

3SGTE swap time..

[SchnellFowVay]

The dealer isn't claiming it is his fault, but rather that he was late to his oil changes thus broke the warranty, since it says the owner has to service the car in the stated milage.

What country do you live in?

It is illegal for the dealer to claim this in the USA (although that does not prevent dealers from trying).

[thenick]

Call Toyota Consumer Affairs IMMEDIATELY!
Dont be nasty, but do express your displeasure and belief that you are being taken advantage of by the dealer. Toyota will bend over backwards for you, provided you can produce legitimate oil change reciepts.

Source: Dealership Employee, and Ive seen similar occurrences with my brand.

[IsraelGT]

What country do you live in?

It is illegal for the dealer to claim this in the USA (although that does not prevent dealers from trying).

I live in the WA, two hours from Canada, but still USA

He has all the paperwork that the car has been serviced at the dealership with a few late services (none more than 1000 miles over!).
Also the car is still has powertrain warranty left.

He was ready to give up and tow it to a different shop that will charge him less than $2K to open the engine and $6-8K to replace it! but I told him to call Toyota and if needed to call a lawyer and ask his opinion.

He drives two Toyotas, this way they are about to lose a very loyal customer.

[BRealistic]

I live in the WA, two hours from Canada, but still USA

He has all the paperwork that the car has been serviced at the dealership with a few late services (none more than 1000 miles over!).
Also the car is still has powertrain warranty left.

He was ready to give up and tow it to a different shop that will charge him less than $2K to open the engine and $6-8K to replace it! but I told him to call Toyota and if needed to call a lawyer and ask his opinion.

He drives two Toyotas, this way they are about to lose a very loyal customer.

So instead 5k miles, it went 6k miles a few times?

Have them contact Toyota directly.

http://www.toyota.com/help/contactus.html

After the oil sludge issue ten years ago (and related PS hassle)- there is not way Toyota is going to let 1k miles over void the engine warranty.

[caj1]

After the oil sludge issue ten years ago (and related PS hassle)- there is not way Toyota is going to let 1k miles over void the engine warranty.

1K over the change interval aside, Toyota would not be off-base in arguing that the customer failed to check their oil level as required, which led to little or no oil in the engine after 6K miles. While not typical, 1 quart consumed per 1K miles is within industry standard.

[Old Windy]

3SGTE swap time..

HOLY TORQUE STEER!!!!!

[Chiropractor JW]

What is the interval he is changing the oil?

[8716vrocco]

I live in the WA, two hours from Canada, but still USA

He has all the paperwork that the car has been serviced at the dealership with a few late services (none more than 1000 miles over!).
Also the car is still has powertrain warranty left.

He was ready to give up and tow it to a different shop that will charge him less than $2K to open the engine and $6-8K to replace it! but I told him to call Toyota and if needed to call a lawyer and ask his opinion.

He drives two Toyotas, this way they are about to lose a very loyal customer.

The dealer he is working with clearly doesn't know how to treat customers. Mine would fix it under warranty no problem like the guy who posted earlier. Have him call Toyota customer service and complain. Toyota bends over backwards for their customers, I've replaced a short block on a Sienna with 120k miles before. I am certain it will get covered. Best of luck to him.