Timiing Issues - '84 GTI

[GeorgeM]

After lots of work (and time), I'm about to put the timing belt on before I re-install the engine.

I did my best to ensure everything remained lined up, including when I swapped out the clutch.

I found in the shop manual that the mark on the intermediate shaft pulley should line up with the notch on the crank pulley, but it does not.

Things moved around a bit when I was reinstalling the flywheel, but I thought I returned things back to TDC. Besides, the pins on the flywheel and clutch pressure plate only allow it to be installed the correct way, i.e. it can't be just slightly off or the pins won't line up.... right?

Any advice? Thanks.

[Gromel]

is that pulley the original?

[GeorgeM]

I don't know. It was on the car when I got it.

I blasted the rust off and painted it, so that's why it looks different.

Is there something else different about it?

[jedduh_]

looks like the crank is only a notch behind the intermediate shaft.pull the belt off and slightly turn the crank over by hand(until the marks line up)..then reinstall belt.

[GeorgeM]

It is a notch away, but when I adjust it, the flywheel marks go off TDC...

[jedduh_]

the flywheel should not be tdc. i belive it should be -3 degree tdc

[GeorgeM]

If you're referring to #1 cyl ignition timing, it's 3deg ATDC, but the amount of crank movement required to line up the pulley marks is alot more that 3deg. The flywheel marks completely dissappear from the sight hole in the tranny.

So, I guess what I'm asking is what is the actual crankshaft position that corresponds to the crank and intermediate shaft pulley marks lining up and the camshaft pulley mark at the edge of the drive belt rear cover? In the Bently book, this is where it says to line everything up to swap the timing belt.

Maybe I'm having a brain fart, but I assumed it would be TDC or 3deg ATDC, and it's neither in my case. Unless it is possible to improperly mount the flywheel to the pressure plate and I screwed that up.

[springer01]

I would recommend putting a wooden dowel or something in cylinder #1 and verify TDC. Then you would know which is incorrect... your flywheel or pulley mark. I'm thinking the flywheel cant be wrong. I used the mark on my crank timing belt pulley because I never found a mark on my alternator belt pulley.

[GeorgeM]

From eyeballin' the piston movement, the flywheel TDC mark appears correct.

Maybe the pulley isn't original, and the mark is off?

[Gromel]

http://www.cabby-info.com/Files/AdjustingTheTiming.pdf

[GeorgeM]

Thanks for the tips.

Here's where I am:

With the timing belt on, flywheel at TDC, cam timing mark at the top edge of the head (or rear TB belt cover), the distributor pointing at the #1 mark (and the intermediate shaft gear dot on the edge of the crank pulley), and the oil pump coupling lined up with the crankshaft - the only thing not lined up is the V notch on the crank pulley with the intermediate shaft gear.

So, without any other reason not to ignore it, I guess I'll ignore it....

On another note:

The Bentley book says timing should be 3deg ATDC, but according to Alldata:

The 6°BTDC mark on flywheel correctly aligned with pointer in timing check hole: applicable to all 1983 and 1984 U.S. cars with fuel injection engines and manual transmissions, and to 1983 Pickup Trucks sold in California with fuel injection engines and manual transmissions.

My flywheel jives with Alldata, so that's what I'm going with.

[springer01]

6 degrees BTDC is correct

[GeorgeM]

I guess it depends where you look in the book. On the procedure page, it says 3deg ATDC, on the specs page, it tells the truth... I should have looked there first.

[WackyWabbitRacer]

Static Engine Timing Procedure:

Make sure the number #1 piston is at TDC (top dead center). Remove the spark plug and use a plastic probe to make sure the piston is at TDC.

Now look at the timing mark on the flywheel. The pointer in the bellhousing should be pointing toward the "0" mark on the flywheel. The "0" mark and the pointer should be aligned for the static mechanical timing of the crankshaft.

The notch in the housing of the ignition distributor should be pointing toward the number #4 cylinder or approximately in that area. The center of the distributor rotor should be pointing at the notch.

I never worried about the orientation of the intermediate shaft as I always pulled the ignition distributor and reset it so the notch in the distributor housing was properly aligned toward number #4 cylinder.

The camshaft pulley has a centerpunch mark on the inside of its pulley toward the engine. This centerpunch mark is aligned with the top of the valve cover flange.

You can verify that the camshaft is properly aligned as both the intake and the exhaust lobes will be pointing upward at about a 45 degree angle which indicates both of the number #1 valves are closed.

Tip for you....use a white paint marker to "paint" the "0" timing mark on the flywheel.

Normally after replacing a timing belt, the ignition distributor needs to be re-timed. With the "0" timing mark being white, it is easy to see through the timing hole in the bellhousing.

For a little more zip, set the ignition timing to about 6 degrees BTDC (before top dead center). The factory setting for a 1.7L is 3 degrees ATDC (after top dead center).


Cheers, WWR