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    Thread: 2013 Focus ST, worth it?

    1. Geriatric Member AKADriver's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 08:36 PM #211
      Quote Originally Posted by C4 A6 View Post
      I found it funny that they rated the ST higher in luggage space than the GTI, and that was the reason why someone on here decided to keep his GTI over getting an ST (despite the fact that the ST offers so much more than the GTI.)
      Er, if you're referring to Numbersix's thread, he said that the rear passenger space of the Focus was smaller, not the cargo space. And it is. The Focus has 2" less rear legroom.
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    2. Member worked_xr's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 10:42 PM #212
      I think it's notable that R&T used a 3 door GTI versus a 5 door. I don't know the weight difference, but assume there is one, and that it isn't insignificant. That would have effected performance data a bit more.
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      10-05-2012 11:18 PM #213
      I may end up buying one.. Either a ST or a MK7 GTI.

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      10-06-2012 12:37 AM #214
      Quote Originally Posted by AKADriver View Post
      Er, if you're referring to Numbersix's thread, he said that the rear passenger space of the Focus was smaller, not the cargo space. And it is. The Focus has 2" less rear legroom.
      That's only with the Recaros though. If you just had the regular seats (like the GTI has regular seats), then there would be no difference. I'm sure if the GTI hat Recaros as an option, then the same thing would happen.

    5. 10-06-2012 12:40 AM #215
      Quote Originally Posted by C4 A6 View Post
      That's only with the Recaros though. If you just had the regular seats (like the GTI has regular seats), then there would be no difference. I'm sure if the GTI hat Recaros as an option, then the same thing would happen.
      But the rear seat room with the focus has been a common compliant since the debut of the current generation and those dont have recaros either.

    6. Member MAGICGTI's Avatar
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      10-06-2012 12:43 PM #216
      How has 2012+ Focus reliability been? Projected reliability of the ST?
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      10-06-2012 01:12 PM #217
      My closest Ford dealer has 4 of these right now. I just walked around a white one and a blue one a few minutes ago. It might be the over cast day, but I did not like Performance Blue in person...it looked very purple.
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      10-06-2012 01:14 PM #218
      Quote Originally Posted by dcmix5 View Post
      My closest Ford dealer has 4 of these right now. I just walked around a white one and a blue one a few minutes ago. It might be the over cast day, but I did not like Performance Blue in person...it looked very purple.
      I test drove a blue one on Thursday. I agree, it has some purple in it, but i'm sure i would've been happy with the color. I test drove an ST1 (base), but also sat in an ST2 with the Recaros. I was very tempted to buy the ST2 (at XPlan pricing), but after i test drove a WRX, i was sold on that.

    9. Member MAGICGTI's Avatar
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      10-06-2012 02:40 PM #219
      Quote Originally Posted by SLC_Punker View Post
      I test drove a blue one on Thursday. I agree, it has some purple in it, but i'm sure i would've been happy with the color. I test drove an ST1 (base), but also sat in an ST2 with the Recaros. I was very tempted to buy the ST2 (at XPlan pricing), but after i test drove a WRX, i was sold on that.
      Interesting...based on performance? Close friend had an '09 WRX and I'm not sure I could live with the interior for that kind of money.
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      10-06-2012 08:40 PM #220
      Quote Originally Posted by SLC_Punker View Post
      I test drove a blue one on Thursday. I agree, it has some purple in it, but i'm sure i would've been happy with the color. I test drove an ST1 (base), but also sat in an ST2 with the Recaros. I was very tempted to buy the ST2 (at XPlan pricing), but after i test drove a WRX, i was sold on that.
      What was the cost with X-plan pricing?

    11. Geriatric Member AKADriver's Avatar
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      10-06-2012 08:43 PM #221
      Quote Originally Posted by C4 A6 View Post
      That's only with the Recaros though. If you just had the regular seats (like the GTI has regular seats), then there would be no difference. I'm sure if the GTI hat Recaros as an option, then the same thing would happen.
      No it's not. The Recaros don't affect measured legroom.
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      10-07-2012 10:21 AM #222
      Quote Originally Posted by TrackMagicWS6 View Post
      What was the cost with X-plan pricing?
      About X plan... a couple things to know: 1. dealerships are NOT REQUIRED to honor it. 2. X plan limits dealer fees to no more than $100 for doc fees. No other advertising, "market adjustment", "dealership" fees are allowed. 3. Dealers still make plenty on X plan sales, and typically receive commission from Ford on the sale. 4. Almost anyone can become X plan eligible.

      X plan pricing estimates for the Focus ST:


      ST1, base, no Recaros
      no add-ons: approx. $23,700 including delivery, fees, and doc fees
      w/roof, w/nav, w/Tangerine Scream paint: $25,650 inclusive


      ST2, includes leather/cloth Recaros and Sony stereo upgrade
      no add-ons: $25,800 inclusive
      w/roof/, w/nav, w/TS paint: $27,800 inclusive


      ST3, includes full leather Recaros, navigation, HID headlamps, interior lighting package,
      no add-ons: $27,650 inclusive
      ST3, w/roof, w/TS paint: $28,900 inclusive
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      10-07-2012 10:39 AM #223
      Quote Originally Posted by MAGICGTI View Post
      Interesting...based on performance? Close friend had an '09 WRX and I'm not sure I could live with the interior for that kind of money.
      We test drove a WRX, Focus-ST, GTI, and MS3 all in one day. My wife and i agreed the interior was not that bad; not quite up to the GTI, but certainly not terrible. The GTI was by far the smallest, which i wasn't looking for (i have 2 kids). The ST had a decent hatch in terms of surface area, but it was really shallow. The WRX had a smoother clutch, a more linear power delivery, and just felt really solid and stable (grounded to the ground!). I'm sure i would have been happy with any of the 4 we tested (at least optioned the way i want them), but WRX won out for the driving feel, as well as the safety/security of having AWD in the winters. This will be my DD.

      Quote Originally Posted by TrackMagicWS6 View Post
      What was the cost with X-plan pricing?
      They quoted me $26,440+TTL for that exact one. I think it had a couple options/accessories above the ST2 package.

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      10-07-2012 03:19 PM #224
      I figure I'll be looking to replace my MKIV dd in a year or two. The ST, is a def on my list. I really like the jcw mini coupe also, but it's way pricey at the 40-45k range loaded. I feel like you get alot for your $ with the st. Is there any aftermarket support with coilovers, tuning etc...

      I'll keep my MKI forever as a weekend car, so I won't be turning my back on VW, but I'm going to wait for the MKVII GTI & by that time we should have the def specs on the next gen R if it has the new S3 motor I may jump in that? I don't want to rush my decision so I want to wait to see all my options, but the st is the only american car that I'm interested in, unless the RS came over which it may if the st is a good seller?
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      10-07-2012 03:42 PM #225
      Quote Originally Posted by kevin FaKiN spLits View Post
      Well, not really. I have two mkvs, my brother has a ms3, and I do want to get a new hatch to toy with.

      I was gonna trade the modified mkv for a s2k, but meh. Also looked at the BRZ as a fun summer car, but again the ST kills it in every way in my eyes.

      I hate the mk6, and the Golf R is a joke.
      For $27k-$34k and with nav, great interiors & seats and way more car

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    16. 10-07-2012 07:34 PM #226
      Quote Originally Posted by Activ8 View Post
      For $27k-$34k and with nav, great interiors & seats and way more car

      Jaguar XF Supercharged:



      [TROLL]Best of all its still a Ford.[/TROLL]

    17. 10-07-2012 10:23 PM #227
      Quote Originally Posted by Activ8 View Post
      For $27k-$34k and with nav, great interiors & seats and way more car

      Jaguar XF Supercharged:



      I wonder why they are so cheap used? Are they that unreliable?

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      10-07-2012 10:43 PM #228
      Quote Originally Posted by WhistlerYOW View Post
      [TROLL]Best of all its still a Ford.[/TROLL]
      lol

      But here is a great example of how hidden costs in vehicle ownership stack up for some cars...

      XF's TCO is $69k based on a $31k buy price
      http://www.edmunds.com/jaguar/xf/200...tyle=100956694

      Focus Titanium's TCO is $36k based on a $24k buy price
      http://www.edmunds.com/ford/focus/20...tyle=101364750

      A car's value is not equal to it's financial liability.
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      10-08-2012 09:46 AM #229
      Quote Originally Posted by dcmix5 View Post
      My closest Ford dealer has 4 of these right now.
      My local dealer had 0 and did not know when they were getting any in They did say they will have a 2013 Fusion soon though, so I may at least check that out.

      Quote Originally Posted by livingVoice View Post
      I wonder why they are so cheap used? Are they that unreliable?
      I have wondered the same thing, they look really nice both inside and out, but the prices drop like a stone on them.
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    20. Member panzer 2.3's Avatar
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      10-08-2012 11:00 AM #230
      Quote Originally Posted by naiku View Post
      My local dealer had 0 and did not know when they were getting any in
      A few local ford dealers to me have a few st's on the lot. Seems all are red? Also I haven't scene any with recaro's or hid's seems the dealer ordered up the cheaper package. I'm def a fan of the one color leather recaro's:

      That would be a must for me, but I'm waiting for a good year or two till I purchase a new car. I want to see the mk7 gti & find out the specs on the next gen R before I make up my mind. LOL, I'm in a tdi dd with only 100k on it so I have plenty of time
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      10-08-2012 11:11 AM #231
      Quote Originally Posted by panzer 2.3 View Post
      Also I haven't scene any with recaro's or hid's seems the dealer ordered up the cheaper package. I'm def a fan of the one color leather recaro's:
      The reason you haven't seen any of the ST3s with the full leather and HIDs is because there was a delay due to a problem with the HID lens design. ST1 and ST2s went into production in late July, but ST3s have been delayed until last week (first week of October). In addition, dealers' ST3 orders were cancelled so that Retail Customer ST3s would receive priority when production did start, so it may still be a while before you see one sitting on a dealer lot for sale. Customer order cars should begin landing in the next week or so.

      BTW, I love the solid black leather Recaros on the ST3, which is one of the reasons I chose to order an ST3 back in May... 152 days ago. Sigh...
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      10-08-2012 11:17 AM #232
      Quote Originally Posted by WhistlerYOW View Post
      [TROLL]Best of all its still a Ford.[/TROLL]
      I can't tell the level of sarcasm here but just for clarification, Jaguar is owned by Tata Motors now.

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      10-08-2012 11:21 AM #233
      Quote Originally Posted by worked_xr View Post
      The reason you haven't seen any of the ST3s with the full leather and HIDs is because there was a delay due to a problem with the HID lens design. ST1 and ST2s went into production in late July, but ST3s have been delayed until last week (first week of October). In addition, dealers' ST3 orders were cancelled so that Retail Customer ST3s would receive priority when production did start, so it may still be a while before you see one sitting on a dealer lot for sale. Customer order cars should begin landing in the next week or so.

      BTW, I love the solid black leather Recaros on the ST3, which is one of the reasons I chose to order an ST3 back in May... 152 days ago. Sigh...
      Thanks for the info, makes sense now. Maybe when I'm ready to buy in a year or two they'll have it all sorted? I would also go with the full leather recaro's, the partials just look clownish to me. Any aftermarket parts on the horizon for them like coilovers? I doubt I'd mess with the engine tuning wise, but I wouldn't mind being lower on one.

      That's the only advantage of buying another vw for me all the aftermarket support, but I've been a fan of the RS as sonn as they came out & this is as close as I'll prob ever get
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      10-08-2012 12:04 PM #234
      Quote Originally Posted by panzer 2.3 View Post
      Any aftermarket parts on the horizon for them like coilovers? I doubt I'd mess with the engine tuning wise, but I wouldn't mind being lower on one.

      That's the only advantage of buying another vw for me all the aftermarket support, but I've been a fan of the RS as sonn as they came out & this is as close as I'll prob ever get
      There will be epic amounts of aftermarket development for the ST. While the ST is new to the North American market, it's an extremely popular and established performance brand in Europe. And because Ford is producing essentially the same vehicle (chassis, engine, suspension) in all of their world markets, aftermarket developments done in the UK or Europe or Asia or the US will all be applicable to the US based ST. A good example is that the UK tuner company PumaSpeed already offers a -20mm spring set for the ST and their website includes USD pricing and US shipping costs ($300 shipped to the US, if it matters: http://www.pumaspeed.co.uk/product-F...ring_15622.jsp).

      Even better is that there are a ton of US based aftermarket companies already actively developing performance and suspension stuff for the ST... Steeda, Cobb, Buschur, Saleen, Roush, KW, and of course, Ford's own Ford Racing Performance Parts division. Expect a full range of engine, exhaust, turbo, brake, suspension, chassis upgrades over the next 6 months. In fact, I suspect quite a few will be debuting at SEMA. I'm hoping to be there to witness it myself actually, but who knows...

      In any case, there is no need to be concerned about aftermarket support for the ST. Ford's commitment to global cars, especially global PERFORMANCE cars, means the ST will be around for a long time to come. And since Ford also uses the Ecoboost 2.0 in everything from the Focust to the Fusion to the C-Max to the 2014 Mustang means that there will be a ton of support for it, and all the cars that carry it.
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      10-08-2012 01:24 PM #235
      Quote Originally Posted by worked_xr View Post
      There will be epic amounts of aftermarket development for the ST. While the ST is new to the North American market, it's an extremely popular and established performance brand in Europe. And because Ford is producing essentially the same vehicle (chassis, engine, suspension) in all of their world markets, aftermarket developments done in the UK or Europe or Asia or the US will all be applicable to the US based ST. A good example is that the UK tuner company PumaSpeed already offers a -20mm spring set for the ST and their website includes USD pricing and US shipping costs ($300 shipped to the US, if it matters: http://www.pumaspeed.co.uk/product-F...ring_15622.jsp).

      Even better is that there are a ton of US based aftermarket companies already actively developing performance and suspension stuff for the ST... Steeda, Cobb, Buschur, Saleen, Roush, KW, and of course, Ford's own Ford Racing Performance Parts division. Expect a full range of engine, exhaust, turbo, brake, suspension, chassis upgrades over the next 6 months. In fact, I suspect quite a few will be debuting at SEMA. I'm hoping to be there to witness it myself actually, but who knows...

      In any case, there is no need to be concerned about aftermarket support for the ST. Ford's commitment to global cars, especially global PERFORMANCE cars, means the ST will be around for a long time to come. And since Ford also uses the Ecoboost 2.0 in everything from the Focust to the Fusion to the C-Max to the 2014 Mustang means that there will be a ton of support for it, and all the cars that carry it.
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      10-08-2012 02:04 PM #236
      Quote Originally Posted by SLC_Punker View Post
      We test drove a WRX, Focus-ST, GTI, and MS3 all in one day. My wife and i agreed the interior was not that bad; not quite up to the GTI, but certainly not terrible. The GTI was by far the smallest, which i wasn't looking for (i have 2 kids). The ST had a decent hatch in terms of surface area, but it was really shallow. The WRX had a smoother clutch, a more linear power delivery, and just felt really solid and stable (grounded to the ground!). I'm sure i would have been happy with any of the 4 we tested (at least optioned the way i want them), but WRX won out for the driving feel, as well as the safety/security of having AWD in the winters. This will be my DD.
      Sedan or hatchback? Base, Premium or Limited?

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      10-08-2012 02:15 PM #237
      Quote Originally Posted by chuckster1 View Post
      Sedan or hatchback? Base, Premium or Limited?
      We test drove a base sedan, with SPT exhaust. I ordered a Limited 5-door, with a few options (but not the exhaust...). It's going to be a long 8 week wait...

    28. Member MAGICGTI's Avatar
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      10-08-2012 02:53 PM #238
      Any pics of the ST3 rear seat? Apparently it's slightly bolstered...
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      10-08-2012 06:39 PM #239
      Quote Originally Posted by MAGICGTI View Post
      Any pics of the ST3 rear seat? Apparently it's slightly bolstered...
      leather:

      partial leather:

      Just like vw's looks like the eu gets the better seats:
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      10-08-2012 06:45 PM #240
      Drove one today.
      it's got a monster engine and that symposer thing makes it sound awesome when you punch it.
      The car I drove had the st2 (?) package and was about $28k.

      The Recaros are really nice, but I'm not sure they are worth $4k.

      The steering is really tight, the torque steer no more pronounced than my regular ole mazda 3's. It was tremendously confidence inspiring to drive hard. I didn't like the battlestar galactica looking dash, prefering the GTI's by far.

      I wasn't expecting the car to feel so solid. I was sort of expecting something like my Mazda, a general step up in refinement from the SVT focus, but the ST felt super tight.

      This is a serious car and it was a blast to drive. The thing is, at 28k I would rather spend another 6k for the golf R or try to score a deal on a leftover GTI.

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      10-08-2012 06:57 PM #241
      Quote Originally Posted by Dan92SLC View Post
      The thing is, at 28k I would rather spend another 6k for the golf R or try to score a deal on a leftover GTI.
      So would I. But that's because we really enjoy the VW brand and see value in VW products.

      Objectively speaking, thought, this Ford is a better car than the GOlf R, for cheaper. Yeah, it may lack AWD, but otherwise, it's faster, sportier, newer platform, etc.

      Ford really has a success on their hands with this thing. I agree that they should have perhaps somehow made a package with the Recaro's a bit less pricey, but overall, this car destroys the current GTI on all objective tests.

      I still like the GTI better, but I am also a VW nerd. For 95% of buyers, this car is a no-brainer in the market segment.
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      10-08-2012 06:58 PM #242
      I also want to add in that if they ever release an AWD version, I may actually be pursuaded to purchase one.
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    33. Member MAGICGTI's Avatar
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      10-08-2012 07:42 PM #243
      Thanks for the post on the seats, panzer. Disappointing on all counts.
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      10-08-2012 08:04 PM #244
      Quote Originally Posted by MAGICGTI View Post
      Any pics of the ST3 rear seat? Apparently it's slightly bolstered...
      Unfortunately, the North American market doesn't get quite the same seats as offered in the UK and Europe. Their front seats have an adjustable thigh extension, and the rear seats are also made by Recaro, which do have some slightly improved bolstering. Here's a pic of the Recaro rear seat:




      About...
      Quote Originally Posted by Dan92SLC View Post
      The Recaros are really nice, but I'm not sure they are worth $4k.
      The ST2 package comes with the color'd insert leather/cloth Recaros and is $2500 more, not $4k. It should be noted that the Recaros that are in the ST appear to be based on Recaro's aftermarket Style XL seats, which retail for between $1500-$2400 PER SEAT. $2500 for the ST2 package (which also includes the Sony 10 speaker stereo upgrade) seems a bargain comparatively.
      - Wyatt
      co-founder North American ST Owners Club || www.NASTOC.org
      '13 Focus ST || '89 Merkur XR4RS || '70 Mustang Mach 1

    35. Member worked_xr's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 28th, 2008
      Location
      Sarasota, FL
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      Vehicles
      2013 Focus ST3, '89 XR4RS, '70 Mustang Mach 1
      10-08-2012 08:07 PM #245
      BTW, better pics of the euro ST Recaro interior in leather: http://www.recaro-automotive.com/us/...-focus-st.html
      - Wyatt
      co-founder North American ST Owners Club || www.NASTOC.org
      '13 Focus ST || '89 Merkur XR4RS || '70 Mustang Mach 1

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