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    Thread: Insideline Track Tested: 2013 BMW M5

    1. Member
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      09-27-2012 11:13 PM #1

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      09-27-2012 11:37 PM #2
      I couldn't even consider this thing unless you could completely disable that ridiculous engine sound through the radio garbage.

    3. Banned Fritz27's Avatar
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      09-27-2012 11:44 PM #3
      Compare the sound of the F10 to the sound of the E60.



      I'm pretty disappointed that M didn't make the V8TT more vocal for the M application. It sounds really bland.

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      09-27-2012 11:44 PM #4
      The big news over on the BMW boards is there is a stop sale and stop driving recommendation out for the M5 and M6 for a failing oil pump. They're halting production too to get new pumps out to dealers asap.
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      09-27-2012 11:52 PM #5
      Quote Originally Posted by Fritz27 View Post
      I'm pretty disappointed that M didn't make the V8TT more vocal for the M application. It sounds really bland.
      I did not find that when driving the M6...but I had very low expectations.

      Do both cars play the fake engine sounds?

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      09-27-2012 11:59 PM #6
      I can't believe they have to play engine sounds on a vehicle equipped with a V8, let alone one so expensive.

      One something like my GTI, I think it's silly...but I understand.

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      09-28-2012 12:09 AM #7
      It's two-fold. One is that cars are getting more and more sound-deadening, isolating the driver more and more, but it's also got to be partially that so many cars are coming with turbo-chargers which inevitably muffle the exhaust note. My T5 855 doesn't sound anything like the NA 850's (which sound surprisingly good stock).

      I still think it's silly though. Every car has a sound, and I want to hear what it really sounds like, because that's a big sensation telling me everything is OK.
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      09-28-2012 01:17 AM #8
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      It's two-fold. One is that cars are getting more and more sound-deadening, isolating the driver more and more, but it's also got to be partially that so many cars are coming with turbo-chargers which inevitably muffle the exhaust note. My T5 855 doesn't sound anything like the NA 850's (which sound surprisingly good stock).

      I still think it's silly though. Every car has a sound, and I want to hear what it really sounds like, because that's a big sensation telling me everything is OK.
      It's beyond silly. They should be embarrassed to stoop to something so hacky. If they weren't BMW, the mags would be all over them for it. I can't believe they turned the plot of that horrendous Vince Vaughn movie into a 90k product.

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      09-28-2012 01:17 AM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by curvedinfinity View Post
      The big news over on the BMW boards is there is a stop sale and stop driving recommendation out for the M5 and M6 for a failing oil pump. They're halting production too to get new pumps out to dealers asap.
      Pumps, of any kind, are just not BMW's forte.

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      09-28-2012 01:22 AM #10
      I think the engine will sound much better with a less restrictive exhaust. Definitely a car I'd love to drive, but couldn't afford to own.


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      09-28-2012 04:10 AM #11
      Quote Originally Posted by zhenya00 View Post
      but it's also got to be partially that so many cars are coming with turbo-chargers which inevitably muffle the exhaust note.
      I keep hearing that, but then how does one explain why the AMG V8TTs sound like they do?

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      09-28-2012 04:21 AM #12
      Quote Originally Posted by SVTJayC View Post
      I couldn't even consider this thing unless you could completely disable that ridiculous engine sound through the radio garbage.
      Im positive a 3rd party will have a device that will disable it. I would hate to have to pay money for something like that, but not as much as I would hate the fact that there is FAKE ENGINE NOISE IN THE SPEAKERS!

      Someone will probably find a easier way to remove it, maybe find the module in the car and rip it out. However for all we know that will just end up throwing a code
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    13. 09-28-2012 04:41 AM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by venom600 View Post
      I keep hearing that, but then how does one explain why the AMG V8TTs sound like they do?
      You keep hearing it, because it's true. I cant explain why the merc sounds the way it does, but turbo cars can be plenty loud when you remove mufflers. But damn do those TTV8s sound amazing.

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      09-28-2012 08:34 AM #14
      Quote Originally Posted by venom600 View Post
      I keep hearing that, but then how does one explain why the AMG V8TTs sound like they do?
      This. I think BMW should stop taking the cheap way out and spend some more time getting real sound out of the exhaust.
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      09-28-2012 09:54 AM #15
      I don't know why, but this car does nothing for me.

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      09-28-2012 10:03 AM #16
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      I did not find that when driving the M6...but I had very low expectations.

      Do both cars play the fake engine sounds?
      I know for a fact the m5 does, and im 99% sure the m6 does as well. Im fresh off this months C&D where they review an M6, I cant remember off the top of my head if they mention it or not, but they were testing the Cabrio... BMW is not the only one who plays sounds through the speakers... the GTI does the same thing...
      Quote Originally Posted by MonsterM View Post
      I don't know why, but this car does nothing for me.
      Your not the only one... if I had 6 figures to drop on a car, give me v10 please? Like fuel economy matters in this segment, and like the improvement your going to see with this car is of significant importance anyways...
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      09-28-2012 10:42 AM #17
      That stock exhaust sounds pathetic. I hope it was just problem with the sound recording because there is nothing aggressive and intoxicating about watching that land barge launch.
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    18. 09-28-2012 11:16 AM #18
      its sad but like all the honda threads, I just feel BMW but more specifically M has lost its way. If you want a more powerful 5 series that is soft and luxurious, by a 550. If you want one that is sportier with more performance intentions, by an M5 that has less sound deadening that's more of a drivers car. Remember when they didn't make the M8 because they deemed it too heavy and too much of a GT car to me part of the M division? clearly they've changed their ways. Forgive me for not knowing, but do they sell a whole lot of these m5/m6's now? Ive seen a few E60 M5's around but not one of these.
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      09-28-2012 11:20 AM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by dyetrixy07 View Post
      Forgive me for not knowing, but do they sell a whole lot of these m5/m6's now? Ive seen a few E60 M5's around but not one of these.
      They just came out, but they've been selling the one's they've been getting in. There's currently a stop-sale in effect while the oil pump issue is resolved. You can guarantee this model will sell well, as it appeals to a broader market than the previous-gen. Then M division is clearly aligning itself more with AMG. BMW is in the business of selling cars so they will adjust their operations in order to do so. That being said, I love the E63.
      Quote Originally Posted by DamienR8 View Post
      in 2038 you will have the ability to think of a car, then your body will actually turn into a car, then you will die in an accident.

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      09-28-2012 11:25 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by dyetrixy07 View Post
      its sad but like all the honda threads, I just feel BMW but more specifically M has lost its way. If you want a more powerful 5 series that is soft and luxurious, by a 550. If you want one that is sportier with more performance intentions, by an M5 that has less sound deadening that's more of a drivers car.
      The difference between the M and non-M cars is still quite vast. There isn't anything tame about them.

    21. 09-28-2012 11:55 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      The difference between the M and non-M cars is still quite vast. There isn't anything tame about them.
      Agreed! Thats why I like them!

    22. 09-28-2012 12:06 PM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by Ross1013 View Post
      The difference between the M and non-M cars is still quite vast. There isn't anything tame about them.
      Oh no trust me I'm sure they're not tame by any means whatsoever, it just sucks they have to make fake engine noises but I guess like anyone else they want to adjust to move with what their audience wants. I've never driven an M5 but I completely agree that even the new one is quite wild compared to many things. Also, having never been behind the wheel I did not know there was still such a difference in feel between it and the more powerful non-M cars. I'll take your knowledge though, thank you for clearing it up
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      09-28-2012 12:07 PM #23
      Everybody who plays at this level (or above) uses some sort of trickery for engine noise. Porsche uses noise pipes in the Panamera, even.

      That's the price you pay for day-to-day refinement.
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      09-28-2012 12:35 PM #24
      Quote Originally Posted by SSLByron View Post
      Everybody who plays at this level (or above) uses some sort of trickery for engine noise. Porsche uses noise pipes in the Panamera, even.

      That's the price you pay for day-to-day refinement.
      I think people were complaining more about an actual speaker making fake noises versus sound pipes, which most people use. I agree though.
      Quote Originally Posted by DamienR8 View Post
      in 2038 you will have the ability to think of a car, then your body will actually turn into a car, then you will die in an accident.

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      09-28-2012 01:06 PM #25
      There is a perfectly logical explanation as to why they had to add some soundtrack artificially. This is due to the layout of the engine. If you remember, the intake and exhaust tracks are reversed on this engine with the exhaust manifold/turbos in the V and TWO separate plastic intake manifolds that run along the outside edges of each cylinder bank. Therein lies the problem:

      Most/all car manufacturers use induction noise to add a sporty flair to their cars, in fact whenever you listen to the car commercials you are hearing induction noises almost exclusively. People associate these sounds with sportiness and they are more pleasing to the general audience than a louder exhaust. Sure they could uncork the exhaust more, but people are much more broadly spaced with opinions on exhaust drone, boom, etc. BMW can't rely on this engine for essentially ANY induction noise because with the intake manifold divorced the way they are, it would sound like two funky 4 cylinders whacking away under there. Obviously this aural characteristic is completely unacceptable in the USA BMWs, much less a V8 M series. So no induction noises can make it to the driver, and they are limited on being fairly conservative on the exhaust note to appeal to as many customers as possible. Time to add some soundtrack using the speakers.

      I'm sure the aftermarket will more than address the exhaust note complaints. While turbos do muffle the note more than an NA setup, you can still make plenty of noise as you drop heavy mufflers and resonators.
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    26. 09-28-2012 07:02 PM #26
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      That stock exhaust sounds pathetic. I hope it was just problem with the sound recording because there is nothing aggressive and intoxicating about watching that land barge launch.
      Not an audio problem, on the motor trend comparo with the Panamera it sounded lifeless. Didnt know it was possible to muck up a v8 engine note.

      First M5 that is a bit dissapointing, I miss the V10 Snarl of the E60 M5

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      09-28-2012 07:06 PM #27
      Quote Originally Posted by Aguilar View Post
      I think the engine will sound much better with a less restrictive exhaust. Definitely a car I'd love to drive, but couldn't afford to own.

      With his license number. On the public road. On video. All wins.

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      10-04-2012 10:55 PM #28
      Here's the full article

      2013 BMW M5 Full Test
      More Power, Speed and...Isolation



      Underwhelming. The 2013 BMW M5 is underwhelming.

      We're shocked. No, we're disappointed. Is this really an M5 we don't love? An M5 we wouldn't sell our kids in order to buy? An M5 we don't just want to drive all day to go nowhere?

      It is. It absolutely is.

      Honestly, we never thought this day would come. We never thought there'd ever be an M5 we wouldn't kill to own. But here we are, behind the wheel of the all-new turbocharged 560-horsepower M5, undeniably one of the world's fastest and most capable sedans, and we are underwhelmed.

      It's All About the Engine
      Part of the problem is the BMW's new turbocharged engine.

      The heart of the new fifth-generation M5 is a direct-injected 4.4-liter twin-turbo V8 borrowed from the X5 M and X6 M. Reworked pieces for M5 duty include new cylinder heads, pistons, revised twin-scroll turbos and intercoolers. The compression ratio has been upped to 10.0:1, and it boasts the first use of Valvetronic variable valve control on an M engine.

      Despite the fact that every M5 buyer will be forking over a gas-guzzler tax before they drive off the dealer lot, BMW even has the misguided guts to mention EfficientDynamics in the M5's press kit. For the record, fuel economy has increased from 11 city/17 highway/13 combined mpg to 15 city/22 highway/17 mpg combined. We averaged 15.1 mpg.

      BMW also claims serious power numbers for the M5: 560 horsepower at 6,000-7,000 rpm, along with 500 pound-feet of torque spread from 1,500-5,750. And those claims proved believable during our dyno test. Torque measured at the wheels came on strong at 2,500 rpm and reached its maximum 475 lb-ft at 5,150 rpm.

      This is apparent out in the real world, where the M5 is fairly gutless below 3,000 rpm. Once past three grand, however, with twin turbos a-spinnin', the V8 revs like a turbine to its 7,200-rpm redline and begins to make power as if it's been lit with a fuse. On the dyno, power peaked at 514 hp at 6,250 rpm.

      Sounds of Change
      Once those turbos really start to make boost, the V8 doesn't only come alive, it also begins to sound right. Below 3,000 rpm the V8's off-kilter note sounds more like a flat-4 with a mild aftermarket exhaust than a throaty V8. That's not to say it sounds bad. Just different.

      Above 3,000 rpm, however, it's an aural sensation. Throaty with the most badass exhaust cracks this side of a Ferrari on full-throttle upshifts. And the sounds are real. There's real rumble from the exhaust. And real cracks on the upshifts. Watch the video of us track testing the car and you'll hear them.

      The problem is inside the car. The M5 is sealed so tight, it coddles you in isolation as if it's some boring luxo barge. Keep the M5's windows up, even during a full-throttle quarter-mile pass, and the engine's actual voice is unable to penetrate the sedan's interior.

      To solve this, BMW has decided to pipe artificial engine sounds inside the M5 through the speakers of the sedan's audio system. The company calls this Active Sound Design (ASD) and it allows it to make any engine sound any way they want it to. In other words, BMW is saying, "Trust us; your 1.5-liter diesel really does sound like a big-block Chevy."

      Yes, it's as lame as it...well...sounds, and yes there's something dishonest about it, but it does work. Honestly, if you didn't know the system was in place you'd never know it was doing its thing. And for you purists out there, ASD can be disabled with a simple fuse pull and the M5's windows will still go down.

      Paddle Shift or Manual — You Choose
      With the 2013 BMW M5 it's your choice of dual-clutch paddle-shift gearbox (M DCT) or the six-speed manual, as in our test car — no extra charge for either. With all that power on tap, launching the M5 without time-sucking wheelspin isn't easy, but once full traction is achieved, hold on, 'cause this thing is ready to run. Although you can jam the shifter home between the gates with utter impunity and never miss a gear, the throws are long and rather notchy.

      Gearbox gripes aside, 60 mph goes by in a blink at just 4.5 seconds (4.3 seconds with a 1-foot rollout like at a drag strip), with the quarter-mile hurtling by in 12.5 seconds at 115.0 mph. That's smoking fast. For reference, that's 0.3 second quicker to 60 than the old V10-powered M5 mated to the SMG paddle-shift system, and 0.1 second quicker than a manual-equipped Cadillac CTS-V.

      Figure on the M DCT M5 being several tenths quicker still, but without the man/machine symbiosis that only comes with a proper three-pedal setup.

      Like the Nissan 370Z, the M5 manual blips the throttle for you on downshifts when the mapping is set to either Efficient or Sport — you're on your own in Sport Plus. And in a blow to fragile drivers' egos everywhere, the system perfectly picks the exact amount of throttle blippage.

      Trouble With the Curves
      Question: What happens to the driving dynamics of one of the most revered sport sedans when you add 249 pounds to its curb weight?

      Answer: It requires a lot of engineering to keep it representative of the M brand.

      In truth, BMW did a damn fine job here, thanks in no small part to the car's three-mode electronically controlled damper system, which allows the M5 to be hustled around a track or back road with surprising speed and ability. Ultra-sticky Michelin Pilot Super Sport tires, 265/35ZR20 up front and 295/30ZR20 rear don't exactly hurt its cause, along with three-mode hydraulic steering that gives ample feedback through the thick-rimmed M steering wheel.

      But despite the right ingredients, the end result left an odd taste in our mouths. The front end can feel ponderous, and understeer is way too prevalent for an M car. At our test track, its average slalom speed of 68.9 mph is nothing to sneer at, but it's no better than the last M5 and a few mph slower than the CTS-V, which posted a 71.1-mph run.

      The two more aggressive steering settings — Sport and Sport Plus — simply make the steering heavier, not better, and thus changing directions quickly requires more effort. "Drives small," the new M5 does not.

      While transitional response hasn't improved, overall grip has, the M5 generating 0.93g around the skid pad versus the previous car's 0.88g and the Caddy's 0.92. Telling, though, was the way the M5 massively rolled over on its outside front tire, despite the suspension being set to its stiffest mode.

      Real Brakes
      Even if the 2013 BMW M5 is no longer pinpoint precise, it's still forgiving at the limit. In spite of the sedan's new veil of isolation, the M5 works with you rather than against. Whether you're drifting it around a track or ripping down a sinewy back road, getting it very wrong and backing this sedan off the road would be difficult.

      And as a daily commuter, the Comfort suspension setting should be plush enough for most on the highway and around town, although we certainly wouldn't label it as cushy.

      BMW scrapped the M5's sliding caliper front brakes for a set of six-piston fixed calipers clamping down on 15.7-inch rotors at the front and 15.6-inch rotors at the rear (still with sliding calipers).

      They do an admirable job of hauling down the M5's sizable mass, with a best stop of 111 feet from 60 mph. If we're quibbling, that's a foot longer than the last M5, and the new M5's distances were rather erratic, the worst stop a lengthy 117 feet. But pedal feel is superbly firm.

      Stealthy, Inside and Out
      The cabin is typical upmarket BMW, meaning fairly bland stylingwise but incredibly well made. The front sport seats are surprisingly wide, yet still offer appropriate lateral support and such a high level of comfort that you never even think about whether they're comfortable or not.

      Our test car was loaded and expensive. Just about every luxury and safety feature you can imagine had been thrown into the well-crafted cabin, including soft-close automatic doors, a power trunk and a power rear sunshade, all part of the $5,500 Executive package.

      All in, this a six-figure car. With options our test car went out the door at $107,695. The 2013 BMW M5 starts at $91,795, including $895 destination and a $1,000 gas-guzzler tax. That's just a grand more than the base price of a 2013 Mercedes-Benz E63 AMG but it's an incredible $26,000 more than a 556-hp 2013 Cadillac CTS-V.

      Where's the Thrill?
      Most likely this new kindler, gentler and yes, more boring version of the M5 will appeal to more people. And no doubt that's BMW's plan. The new recipe cranks up the luxury/tech/power/speed but keeps the flair and the mechanicalness low. It's all Dr. Jekyll and no Mr. Hyde.

      If this were an M7 not an M5, no doubt we'd be telling you this is the world's greatest 7 Series — which is exactly what it feels like. But while the new M5 might not be the ultra-precise weapon we had envisioned, it's still a super capable, ultra-fast machine with exotic-car thrust in the upper revs. And it's perfectly comfortable and subtle for everyday use.

      But it basically comes down to this: Somehow the white coats in Munich made the 2013 BMW M5 more powerful and quicker and they've given it more grip, but they forgot something — the emotion. Where's the excitement? Where's the visceral thrill? Where's the M5's sinister evil twin?

      Oh, that's right, it's down the street at the Cadillac dealer. It's called the CTS-V.
      http://www.insideline.com/bmw/m5/201...and-video.html

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