Lexus IS300 vs B6 A4 1.8T

[baljet]

lol it looks like no else caught it but i'm guessing CA, since you mentioned the 320i and not the 330i. Since it appears you care about the image that owning a german car would project just go with the lexus.

No just the Mercedes. The grill and hood ornament on the C-class are a bit too in your face. I prefer more subtlety.

[Zed You]

Definitely the IS300

[20VT*J4]

Owned an 03 B6 A4 Avant 1.8tq for a while and it was a decent car but bored me to ****ing tears. Had a nice interior but it didn't hold up well at all, peeling soft touch plastic all over the place just like my VW. Only driven an IS briefly but it gets my vote without a doubt.

[S4cabriofox]

How is the reliability on the 1.8T? Any major issues? The turbo part makes me wary, but a newer car with AWD, better fuel economy, and more modern interior for potentially less money has its attractions.



In my price range I can only get a 2002-2003 9-3 with less than 90k miles.



I like 9-3s but reliability is a concern and the brand is defunct (future resale?). Wear and maintenance on a post-GM SAAB is also a concern. It's also FWD.

How can you afford a 2004 A4 1.8Tq and not a newer 9-3 Is the resale that bad for B6s? WORSE than the forgotten small sedan from a defunct niche carmaker?

Also... can you afford an early A3 2.0T? A lot more fun than the B6/B7 to drive, with better mpg. Reliability can be spotty just like the B6.

[czykvw]

Have known two people that have owned a is300. They both no longer do.
Instrument panel and shift knob are
But all I can say is it has good looks, but its an average car with below average fuel economy.

Make up for that bad fuel economy and try to get the super duper rare is300 wagon..
so atleast you wont feel bad wasting gas since your driving something so rare

[hipster.]

Have known two people that have owned a is300. They both no longer do.
Instrument panel and shift knob are
But all I can say is it has good looks, but its an average car with below average fuel economy.

Make up for that bad fuel economy and try to get the super duper rare is300 wagon..
so atleast you wont feel bad wasting gas since your driving something so rare

I like the way you think, except didn't the wagons only come in A/T ?

[baljet]

Have known two people that have owned a is300. They both no longer do.
Instrument panel and shift knob are
But all I can say is it has good looks, but its an average car with below average fuel economy.

Make up for that bad fuel economy and try to get the super duper rare is300 wagon..
so atleast you wont feel bad wasting gas since your driving something so rare

I'm suspecting that if you drive with a light foot fuel economy won't be too bad (24-26mpg). I don't like the looks of the wagon and prefer the sedan, which is still quite rare anyway.

Maybe fuel economy is so bad because the power and torque on the engine happens at lower RPMs.

[BODH1]

Have known two people that have owned a is300. They both no longer do.
Instrument panel and shift knob are
But all I can say is it has good looks, but its an average car with below average fuel economy.

Make up for that bad fuel economy and try to get the super duper rare is300 wagon..
so atleast you wont feel bad wasting gas since your driving something so rare

Yeah, my brother is starting to make a very similar decision. A4 Avant or a is300 wagon.

[baljet]

How can you afford a 2004 A4 1.8Tq and not a newer 9-3 Is the resale that bad for B6s? WORSE than the forgotten small sedan from a defunct niche carmaker?

Also... can you afford an early A3 2.0T? A lot more fun than the B6/B7 to drive, with better mpg. Reliability can be spotty just like the B6.

The latest decent 9-3 that I can afford will be a 2004, and still more than a 2004 B6. 2007+ 9-3s will command $18k-$22k. I can't afford an A3 and I don't really like the look of the older models before the refresh.

[VierSpeed]

I'm suspecting that if you drive with a light foot fuel economy won't be too bad (24-26mpg). I don't like the looks of the wagon and prefer the sedan, which is still quite rare anyway.

Maybe fuel economy is so bad because the power and torque on the engine happens at lower RPMs.

Across all my fill ups my maximum has been 27.2 mpg and my lowest has been 23.5 mpg. I have no doubt that the manual transmission will regularly post better numbers than the automatics, but I've hardly been 'behaving' with mine to see what I can really get out of it.

Highway driving at ~70mph, the engine is turning 3000rpm - no need to change down to overtake, and it's not drony or uncomfortable, but it's not nearly as efficient as it could be.

The IS is a great option if you want something smaller that comes alive when you're in a spirited mood, but is comfortable and refined when you're not. Those complaining of low power must not have had enough time to grow used to how to use what power is available; I have yet to find it lacking and would argue it's far better balanced in the power/tq area than some give it credit for. There's still enough car there to get you into serious trouble, but not so much that you can't exploit 80-90% of it in a reasonably confident fashion.

[Acedia]

Given your list of priorities, why these two cars? Why not something that will check your high priority boxes better but still be more fun to drive than a regular family sedan, like a Maxima or a 1st gen TSX?

[quattro B6]

Given your list of priorities, why these two cars? Why not something that will check your high priority boxes better but still be more fun to drive than a regular family sedan, like a Maxima or a 1st gen TSX?

Those ARE regular family sedans...

[AHFlynn]

id get the is, my friend in high school had a 3.0 b6 a4 and the maintenance was a nightmare.

plus, you know...

[Acedia]

Those ARE regular family sedans...

By your definition an Audi A4 is as well

[KICKINGTI]

Late Model 2006 Infiniti G35 with a 6 speed.

Do it. Shop and you can probably find one cheaper:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2006-...#ht_500wt_1151

[quattro B6]

By your definition an Audi A4 is as well

I don't necessarily agree... All Wheel Drive, and a Turbo with a lot of cheap tuning potential sets it aside from a regular Front Wheel Drive sedan. I'm not saying it's extremely exciting, but I wouldn't call it regular. If someone sees you pull up in an Audi, they'll be a lot more impressed than if you pull up in a Maxima. Same goes for the Acura, but to a lesser extent.

[NoXenons]

By your definition an Audi A4 is as well

Last I checked the A4 wasn't fail wheel drive only.

[craigsaid]

Having had both, I can say that this is very accurate. The Audi gets FAR better gas mileage... about 5 mpg better. Although it is less powerful than the IS, with about $700 in upgrades, it will be about equal acceleration. The IS is more fun in the corners then the A4, but I feel like the A4 is actually faster through them. One thing that everyone here is leaving out, is INSURANCE COST. The A4 is very cheap to insure, but an IS300 is absurd. A friend of mine sold his IS300 and bought an 02 Porsche 911. His insurance went DOWN when he bought the Porsche.

I ran into the same thing when I cross-shopped these same cars; insurance on the IS300 was going to be INSANE. I have no idea why but you should at least get a quote before you buy anything. The raging debates about maintenance costs are going to be moot if the Lexus costs an extra $1000/yr just to keep on the road.

[Samson]

Was she an '01? Your headlights look remarkably clean, most I've seen have started to fog up/yellow. Why did you sell her? I'm considering one in that exact color.

Yep, '01. I forgot that I replaced the headlights a couple years before I sold it. There was a TSB about condensation on early '01s that I missed, and mine developed it after 90k miles or something. They were ~$400 or thereabouts (buy Toyota parts as opposed to Lexus parts). As far as yellowing lenses are concerned, my originals never did, but the car was garage-kept and I waxed the lenses.

I sold it because my brother moved out of the country and gave me his '07 Outback Sport. I already had the IS and a Boxster, and the IS had the most miles and was going to need shocks relatively soon... stupid decision. It was also the best, by far, out of those three cars.

[Acedia]

Last I checked the A4 wasn't fail wheel drive only.

Ah yes, I forgot the important rule: Passat + AWD = SPORTSCAR

[seadoo2006]

All the silver/grey cars are like that. The bumpers on B6s never took to paint well because of the material they were made from and they always came out looking different.

Like so:

Hey! That's my car!

Anyways, yes, the silver/grey B6s all had the bumper match difference. Sort of a drawback to those colors, but the white/black/blue/reds didn't have as noticeable an effect.

As for which car to buy, well, I wrote this up earlier this year regarding my experiences with my B6 ... good car, recently let it go at 150k mile, but it's a solid daily for someone who lives in an area with a winter snowfall.

I'll be frank on a couple things:

1. I drive an ass-crap number of miles (~40k/year)
2. My B6 has some sort of maintenance issue about once a month
3. It's a 1.8t, with a Unitronic Stage 1+ tune, but it's still crappy on gas mileage
4. I bought it with 98,000 miles, so my maintenance costs have been slightly higher than most.

That being said, I love the car, no scratch that, I adore this car. I love the ride, I love the way it drives, I love quattro in the winter, and I love the looks.



So, a few things I dislike about the car:

1. It's a boat ... it feels every bit of its ~3600 some pounds
2. The 5-speed has pretty short gears ... I'm around 3800rpm at 75mph
3. My car has the infamous seat heater fire problem (Audi of America graciously replaced everything for FREE at 108,000 miles and I was the 3rd owner)
4. The OEM HIDs are pricey to replace ... both my ballasts are starting to go and even if you get Chrysler ballasts and bulbs (same product), they are around $200/headlight
5. The Climatronic tends to have issues ... Mine acts up only when both passenger and driver are set to high. It reverses and sends full heat A/C to both vents in an alternating pattern
6. The non-Bose system is good for Audio (what I have), but the Bose system is typical Bose (no highs, no lows, it must be Bose)
7. Gas mileage ... I had envisioned getting better from this car, but the combination of an underpowered motor for the car and quattro makes your averages suck

Now, for what I love about this car:

1. quattro ... I can't say enough about it. If you've never owned an AWD car, this system is just superb. In conjuction with the ESP, this car is nearly impossible to put sideways unintentionally ... like, if the system even starts to see your ass-end swing out, it automatically straightens itself out
2. Boost ... well, the stock k03s might be an underpowered turd of a turbo, but throw a Stage 1+ tune at it to 18psi and the car wakes up ... sounds like a bat out of hell at full boost (even if you aren't going very quickly)
3. RNS-E ... well, if you splurge like I did and installed an OEM Audi RNS-E, you get the benefits of the integrated cluster with Navigation. The early 2002s with Navi came with the color FIS, but all the rest of them came with the red FIS which requires a quick off/on cycle of the RNS to get it to appear. This is extremely awesome for directions to have it in the cluster.
4. 2002 Cold Weather Package - the 2002s, as an introductory year, came with rear heated seats. These are more of a novelty than anything else, but it was cool showing that off to the girlfriend's parents when I drove them around for the first time.
5. 2002 Sport Package - again, the MY2002s came with the lowest OEM suspension of any Audi ... look at the pictures of my car ... it sits at about 1-1.5 finger gap around on the stock springs and shocks

So, as for the costs of ownership, well, as I said, I drive a crap ton of miles. Here's a quick breakdown of my costs since buying this car last May:



It's pricey, but remember, most of those costs are fuel and mods. The actual repairs aren't too terribly expensive. My car is repaired at an independent shop @ $60/hour, so compare your own local labor to that if you need a more apples-to-apples comparison.

Here is my gas mileage over the last 10 months, approximately 32,000 miles of driving (93oct solely):



In the end, I love this car, even if it does cost me a bit of money. Well worth it for the benefits in my opinion.

[chickenium]

I would have bought another IS300 if they didn't screw up the looks (IMO) with the IS250/IS350. I loved and miss mine.

That I6 was so quiet that you'd forget the car was running at idle.

Build quality was excellent, the only problems I ever had was rust from a bad repair and a squirrel that managed to gnaw on some electric cables.

I got 24-25mpg regularly.

The trunk was small though and the seats don't drop in the sedan.

[PsyberVW]

I want to know how you thought a 2004 A4 1.8T Tiptronic met any of the criteria you laid out?

Lol!

I vote IS. Used cars are a gamble anyway- and Audis aren't the most durable vehicles. I have no qualms with the 1.8t engine, but everything around it seems to need constant maintenance or repair.

For a drive to work, low-hassle beater, the lighter, RWD, Lexus IS300 sounds more fun, more reliable, lower risk- a better value.

[DUBLUV401]

IS300 if you can find one unmolested