My First Dasher!!

[xthechadx]

Well I have made it back from my 5 day road trip mostly unscaved. But picked up a new daily driver/project It's an 81 Dasher Wagon, with a 1z TDI swap! It's not perfect but its in pretty good shape. I'm making this post on my phone at work so can't post pics yet but will soon. She did good on the trip besides developing an electrical issue 130 miles from denver. The headlights just quit working, the high beams work when I hold the switch down.... Also the radio and blower motor don't work unless the lights are working.... So working on that tonight. Also the og 4speed is not conduciveto road trips, guess people in 81didnt need to drive faster then 55 mph lol. So plans are to fix issues first, then 5speed swap asap, then side mount IC, it is non intercooled currently. EGTs stayed pretty low when cruising but would raise fairly fast if I stayed on it. But anyways pics will come this afternoon

The mTDi, really needs an intercooler


The first stop in Ky, only used half a tank


The morning after my overnight stop in Pickneyville Il (some friends live there)


Traffic jam in St Louis (all 4 lanes shutdown from fatality accident) took 1.5hrs to drive 1 mile to next exit


Had to stop at the "Worlds Largest Gift Shop" got to love Mo


Nothing like being passed by a Vw Rialta...


made it to Pittsburg Ks


Breakfast at a Pittsburg stapel Otto's


Got passed by the Rose Hill High's bus....


Worlds largest ball of Twine


Made it home 1500 miles and 5days later (well 2 day stop in Wichita)

[Evdubs]

Looks solid...a lil rust but still looks strong.

[xthechadx]

yeah, i have a new fender for it, so eventually that is the plan. It really needs a 5 speed swapped into it. Just trying to do my research and see if an easier to find Fox 5 speed would be ok ( i know it bolts up but is the gearing ok with the mTDI) or if i really need to track down a Quantum TD 5 speed... any input on this?

[krautwhlz]

Nice Find; looks like a very solid car. Great color.

Have put quite a few miles on 1.5na Dashers with the ZV 0.968 final) and YT (0.882) 4-speeds, as well as 1.5na & 1.6na in my '80 Dasher wagon with the 2M (0.60) 5-speed. As expected the 1.5na with the 2M was frequently overwhelmed (especially pulling a trailer)! However, the 1.6na does 65mph @ a leisurely 2,350rpm. That might be turning just a bit low for a 1.6's torque peak, but it's right in the sweet spot for a 1.9TDi going for economical cruising.

It seems like it really comes down to what you want to do with your mTDi: with it's longer stroke than the either of the 1.5/1.6L combos, it will have plenty of torque (especially with the intercooler) to manage a VW Fox PSA (.68), while the Quantum 1.6TD's 3M/9Q (0.73) may limit your top speed, if that's an important concern (Bonneville Salt Flats?), or have you revving the motor above its torque peak just cruising on long trips. OTOH if you're anticipating autocrossing, the QTD's 3M/9Q is definitely a better choice.

IIRC using the the Dasher wagon vs. the Quantum TD wagon saves about 400lbs, and another 400lbs less than any of cars VW shipped here with a 1.9TDi. The Dasher's lighter weight certainly opens up your choices for gearing. You can always fine tune with changes in tire size. Really a personal choice.

J.R.
SoCal

[xthechadx]

Thanks for the info, i plan on just having a fun canyone carver/cruiser car road trips ect. I dont mind cruising at 70mph not the 80-85mph that most people do on I70 from Co to kansas. but doint 55mph on I70 is just scary, i took a back route to avoid getting rearended by so dump ass texting and driving on trip home with this car. Plus with the larger turbo this thing screams for a 5th gear lol

[dasherinoz]

Love the photos, great trip for you and the newest addition to your family! I love hearing about B1s being rescued.

[xthechadx]

yeah i Absolutely LOVE this car, just need to work on a few things... I.E. 5 speed swap! But I love the 70s/80s styling. I really like the dash. That is one of the things i dont like about Rabbits, is the dash. The MKI Jettas and Cabby's dash i like a lot, but the dash was a big factor in not buying a rabbit when i was looking for a car. I wanted an early water cooled car, and diesel... Im so glad i was able to work out the deal on this car. The PO actually decided to keep it, then i was able to convice him it was going to a good home Which it is lol.

Here is my to do list

1. Replace the ignition switch (99% sure its causing the head light issue)

2. Intercooler, the PO gave me an Ebay front mount but dont see how it will fit, so plan on using a stock side mount, looking into an MR2's, has both pipes coming off the back side, looks easier to plumb then a TDI/1.8t side mount

3. 5 speed swap, I will have to pay a shop to do this as i live in an apt in Denver, Back in Kansas i have access to several garages, but not here... the pains of living in a bigger city...

4. Suppension, the PO cut the springs, i like the stance, not too low, but no wheel gap, but it needs to be done Correctly, I want to try and find an extra set of strut housing and have a friend cut and re weld them to house some Ground Control coil over springs, then get some Bilstiens, it will be low ish and handle. Im not one of the those "Slam it to the ground just to look cool" i want performance with a sporty look

5. Swap back to ECU controlled TDI, I think the mTDI set up is nice becuase it makes it simple but i like the tunabilty of the ECU. It is going to take some time to get all the parts to go back...

6. Paint, I LOVE the factory paint, but when i replace the fender i will need to paint it, as the fender has rust, and the hood is completely shot paint wise

So i hope to have 1 and 2 done soon, 3 and 4 around the first of the year, 5 and 6 some time down the road lol I really want to make TDIfest next year, where ever it will be lol

[krautwhlz]

On the paint... yeah, the early clear coats did get brittle with age. My '80 Dasher wagon's color is very close to yours, and a heavy-but-quick hail storm in Oregon really trashed the clear coat on its hood & roof. Kinda crazy, since all the mostly vertical surfaces still look great! Almost re-paint time.

As to your headlight problem, I'd bet on a faulty headlight relay or a bad ground (check 'em all!). After frying the original headlight switch (90/130W H4 bulbs... my bad!) and replacing it, I wired up external relays to each of the headlight circuits; that gave much brighter lighting plus reliabililty. Somehow my factory headlight relay survived the abuse & now all it has to do is key a little power to the external relays, which do the real power switching to the Cibie headlights.

In reference to your intended cruising speeds, the 2M Quantum 5-speed and 195/60-14 tires on my Dasher spin the engine @ 3000rpm @ 83mph. The 0.60 5th gear ratios of the 2M, 5M & MV trannies are the highest I've seen listed that "bolt up" to these vehicles. (See Adam's list http://www.lunaticfringe.org/vwfox/m...wap-specs.html )


J.R.
SoCal

[dasherinoz]

Re the headlight issues - when I got my car his ignition switch had gone into meltdown. Someone had dodgily hard wired the headlights to it as a bypass, and the only way you could start the car was by turning the parkers on then turning the keys. I know, shonky.

Anyways, after a bit of farting about we discovered that the tiny switch is also a Porsche part, for a 924 of the era. So, keep that in mind when trying to figure out the issue. There's only a tiny copper element in this plastic housing, and the plastic had melted, preventing the element from connecting. I found a new switch on germanautoparts.com under Porsche 924.

[thecheesemannn]

If you ever need to find any porsche parts, go to the webpage www.pelicanparts.com

Its where I get all my parts. I bet you could find many similar parts that fit on the B1's

[Road Boss]

Looks to be in good shape.

[Haard]

Very clean start! Enjoy your build.

Mine's going to be getting a new look over the winter and early spring through summer.

[93wolfsburg]

glad you made it back ok, watch the redlights

[Moshua]

nice, very nice, i'm excited to see you do a transmission swap as i'm likely going to do the same thing. hopefully finding a fox 5 speed

[xthechadx]

that is the plan a Fox 5speed, but i wont be doing it myself, as i have no garage to do it, dont want to do it on the street in front of my APT... living downtown Denver kind of sucks for that, so i will pay a shop to do it.... i know....

[dasherinoz]

Have you thought about hiring some space, a shed or warehouse or garage, to work in?

[Iroczgirl]

Dasher looks great!

[yelloa3gti]

The first thing I wanted to do w my B1 was get a fox 5 speed. Thinking it would be hard to come by I pulled the first I found. Since then I have seen 4 or 5 in yards! To bad you aren't in VA! Was at a yard today that had 4 dashes and 2 Audi foxs. Gotta love B1s

[Moshua]

Great looking car. wish i could find a 5 speed

[QuantumSyncro]

Nice looking find, and while it might be fun to have exposed timing components it really is rather dangerous. If a bird hit the grill and broke something loose it could easily make its way into the timing belt / sprockets and that would be the end. I would seriously consider hunting down the timing belt cover for that.

A 5 speed trans will give you more gears to play with in town but all else equal only about 200rpm less at highway speed unless you do further modifications to the 5 box gearing.

steve

[krautwhlz]

Nice looking find, and while it might be fun to have exposed timing components it really is rather dangerous. If a bird hit the grill and broke something loose it could easily make its way into the timing belt / sprockets and that would be the end. I would seriously consider hunting down the timing belt cover for that.

A 5 speed trans will give you more gears to play with in town but all else equal only about 200rpm less at highway speed unless you do further modifications to the 5 box gearing.

steve

As to the timing belt cover... Yah, have to agree with that (and plead "guilty" to running w/o mine for the last 25K miles!).

But re. the "only about 200rpm less at highway speed" statement relative to the to the 4-speed to (oem-geared) 5-speed swap... gotta say "no way"/ time to replace the calculator batteries!

At 60mph: the '79 Dasher's oem 4-speed YT trans (0.882 fourth gear) had the engine @ 3000rpm @ only 60mph, while the replacement 2M (0.778 fourth gear & 0.60 fifth) puts engine speed @ roughly 350rpm less, just in the 2M's fourth gear, with fifth still left to come @ about 2040rpm. Furthermore, that's only @ 60mph, not up at the more common cruising speeds of 65-70mph... or commuting @ 75-90mph (almost 1300rpm difference @ 80mph!).

Even the 3M/9Q from the QTD (0.73 fifth gear) would pull that 60mph cruise @ less than 2500rpm in fifth gear.

However, I'm looking forward to hearing what interchangeability exists with the internal gears of the 4-cylinder and larger 5-cylinder Audi/Passat gearboxes. Seems like even higher 3rd/4th/5th ratios could make sense when re-powering with a turbocharged 1.9 or 2.0L in a 2100-2400Lb Dasher.

J.R.
SoCal

[thecheesemannn]

If you need a timing cover, i have 2 extras. You can PM me if you want it.

[QuantumSyncro]

As to the timing belt cover... Yah, have to agree with that (and plead "guilty" to running w/o mine for the last 25K miles!).

But re. the "only about 200rpm less at highway speed" statement relative to the to the 4-speed to (oem-geared) 5-speed swap... gotta say "no way"/ time to replace the calculator batteries!

At 60mph: the '79 Dasher's oem 4-speed YT trans (0.882 fourth gear) had the engine @ 3000rpm @ only 60mph, while the replacement 2M (0.778 fourth gear & 0.60 fifth) puts engine speed @ roughly 350rpm less, just in the 2M's fourth gear, with fifth still left to come @ about 2040rpm. Furthermore, that's only @ 60mph, not up at the more common cruising speeds of 65-70mph... or commuting @ 75-90mph (almost 1300rpm difference @ 80mph!).

Even the 3M/9Q from the QTD (0.73 fifth gear) would pull that 60mph cruise @ less than 2500rpm in fifth gear.

However, I'm looking forward to hearing what interchangeability exists with the internal gears of the 4-cylinder and larger 5-cylinder Audi/Passat gearboxes. Seems like even higher 3rd/4th/5th ratios could make sense when re-powering with a turbocharged 1.9 or 2.0L in a 2100-2400Lb Dasher.

J.R.
SoCal

Sorry, I was looking at my 5 speed gearing data and did not look at the 4 speed stuff. I generally don't think too much about he 4 speed boxes as an option. I'm surprised your cars PO left that JT gearbox in the car.

These are the figures I've come up with for various trans combos. I've eliminated the FD and top gear as they're already known, these are also with 195/60r14 (23.2" diameter) tires. This is RPM at 65mph.

PW - 2848 rpm (4 spd) (3.89x.778)
PSA - 2646 rpm (5 spd)
3M/9Q - 2824 rpm (5 spd)
5M/2M - 2321 (5 spd)
QF - 2078 (5cyl 5 spd)

These are the standard gearboxes available with normal internal gearing. My comment I guess was regarding the PW to PSA conversion since in the Fox world that's what's mostly discussed although it's relevant here as well because it's an option. The PSA is better than the 9Q/3M which is barely better at road speed than a PW 4spd.

I don't have a dasher manual for after 77 so I don't have access to the late dasher data. And you're right, the JT just about runs at 3k rpm at 60, which is awfully high for a tdi engine given that max is created just under 2k rpm.

In your case a gearbox change would definitely be in order, but I wouldn't settle for a 3m/9Q, you need something that goes further like the 5M/2M if you can find one or a hybrid setup that combines gears from other boxes like the QF.

My goal for the Fox TD is a 5M/2M trans. The Fox only weighs in at a ton so there's not much to move down the road. If I get a chance at a 1.9TDI I'll have to come up with another option, probably a combination.

Sorry for the confusion

steve

[xthechadx]

no, thanks for all the Info, I now know what to start looking for. I have since been offered a Garage when ever i need it, and made some friends to help, so hope to be getting the parts for the swap around the new years.

[neverthesamecar]

A little off topic, but what are your wheel/tire specs? I picked up a set of RA's for my car last night, and trying to figure out what size tires to run.

[thecheesemannn]

Originally, if memory serves me correctly the dasher had 155/80/13 unless it was a sport model..... But let me check my vw workshop manuals for certain.

[thecheesemannn]

I was correct.... Originally they came with Bias Ply 155/SR13 (Radials 155/80/R13)..... Unless you had a sport upgrade, then they came with 175/70/R13 Radials starting in 1979. They are about the same diameter.... The 175's are just wider.... The only noticable difference is stoping power, personally I put the 155's on my dasher for fuel economy purposes..... not to mension theyare about $25/tire vs $60/tire for the 175's.

[krautwhlz]

Skinnies definitely deliver more miles per gallon, but IMHO whether the trade-off's worth it, is really a very personal decision. Almost went to 205/55-14, but the 196/60-14s were so much better than the previous 175/70-13s that I stopped there as a good compromise between fuel economy and better handling/braking/steering. 14" wheels also give the brakes (discs or drums) more room to vent off the heat of operation. Gotta find the balance that works for you, your car's suspension setup, and mostly... for your style of driving.

J.R.
SoCal

[xthechadx]

So update on the car, LOVE the thing... have driven it to and from Denver to Wichita twice (550 miles one way)...

I really need the 5 speed as my speedo is off the faster i go and im really doin 55mph with 65 indicated... makes for a LONG trip...

So in trying to track down a transmission i found this site with supposedly Knew transmission and has a 5 speed for an Audi Coupe/90 FWD..... would that work?

http://www.autoshoppingcenter.com/Vo...ns_5speed.html

It says PX as the Trans code...

[xthechadx]

3M/9Q - 2824 rpm (5 spd)
5M/2M - 2321 (5 spd)
QF - 2078 (5cyl 5 spd)

I don't have a dasher manual for after 77 so I don't have access to the late dasher data. And you're right, the JT just about runs at 3k rpm at 60, which is awfully high for a tdi engine given that max is created just under 2k rpm.

In your case a gearbox change would definitely be in order, but I wouldn't settle for a 3m/9Q, you need something that goes further like the 5M/2M if you can find one or a hybrid setup that combines gears from other boxes like the QF.

These came out of which vehicles?

5m/2m are from the Quantum Turbo Diesel but the
QF???
and 3M/9Q????

[zollie]

You might want to look into my topic (Q-TDI).

I have made a gearbox that is almost perfect for TDI! You just need 2 different 5-speed gearboxes and some guy that knows how to build them

[QuantumSyncro]

These came out of which vehicles?

5m/2m are from the Quantum Turbo Diesel but the
QF???
and 3M/9Q????

Yes, you should read Zollie's thread on the Q-tdi, he's been working on a gearbox to get the rpm range down to optimal for the 1Z/Ahu engines.

5m/2m are 013 5 speed from 4 cyl gasser quantum / 4k (B2)
QF is a type 093 5 speed from a 5 cyl gasser 4k/ coupe GT (B2)
3M/9Q is type 013 5 speed from 4k/quantum diesel / turbo diesel.

While a person can't use the 093 QF trans directly with a 4 cylinder engine the internals (3,4,5th) can be transferred to a 4 cylinder gearbox to make it better with the low torque curve of the tdi.

[xthechadx]

I figure i would add some pictars... since there has been a lot of informational text lol

These are from my drive at christmas...

Loaded up ready to go... That is a MKV Thunderbunny kit for my cousins car, what a nice christmas present





Had to help my sister transport a dog, on my way back to CO, with her underground dog railroad lol. She fosters for a no kill large breed Rescue, This was a mastiff from texas making his way to NM, I took him from KS to Denver, then gave him to another volunteer, I wanted to keep him, he was such a big baby, scared of the world



Hit a little snow on the way home, you can see how big the dog was...




Here are some pics of another trip to KS/OK, I purchased a 03 GTi VR6 24v. I had owned it before and was just buying it back.... But had a buddy with me to drive the GTi back, decided to stop at only dinners and take the back way without freeways... was a fun trip

Got my Euro Plates mounted just before the Trip...


Here is the Rear, and My buddy Jerrod at the resturant we stopped at...


Jerrod felt adventurist and orderd the Rocky Mountian Oysters..... you can see my Grilled Cheese in the bottom of the Pic... (im a vegitarian so i could not pertake lol)







This is when we figured out it was one Testie sliced then fried....




When we decided to leave a couple other Diesels decided to join me





Made it to Dodge City to stay for the Night, why stay at the Holiday in when you can stay at the sweet Thunder Bird




Dont worry it was double room, two beds lol



Had to hit up the Casino...




The next morning we stopped by this crazy artist place in NOwhere western KS. I saw this place on the "Whats Wrong With Kansas" documentory on netflix



then stopped for breakfast at the Mom and pop dinner, with only one farmer in there, we got the "who the hell are you guys" look from the only patrin lol





At a truck stop had to park by the period correct Toyota...

[dasherinoz]

Get me some high res photos of your Dasher's travels, I'd love it for the 2014 B1 wall calendar

http://www.B1calendar.com <- 2013 edition.

[xthechadx]

will do, give me a couple weeks, I left it in wichita getting some work done when i picked up the 03 GTI, I will get wax it up and get some good pics, which would be better, up in the Rockie Mountians, or in the city of Denver?