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    Thread: ILX sales are below Acura projections

    1. Member clutchrider's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 02:09 PM #71
      For the money of an ILX you could easily slide into a loaded GLI or get a nice lease on a VW CC.

      I am not pushing my own car, but there is nothing that really makes the ILX stand out. It looks meh, it performs meh, and is marketed towards the entry level businessman. Sorry but I know of nobody in that market who would want this car.

      I've seen one in the flesh. One. It looked nice, nicer than the pictures show. But it wasn't anything special.

    2. Member P-Body's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 02:11 PM #72
      Quote Originally Posted by clutchrider View Post
      For the money of an ILX you could easily slide into a loaded GLI or get a nice lease on a VW CC.

      I am not pushing my own car, but there is nothing that really makes the ILX stand out. It looks meh, it performs meh, and is marketed towards the entry level businessman. Sorry but I know of nobody in that market who would want this car.

      I've seen one in the flesh. One. It looked nice, nicer than the pictures show. But it wasn't anything special.
      I'd say you pretty much described the CC and the GLI as well.
      Quote Originally Posted by teklord69 View Post
      Scenario: Uphill on two lane hwy. You need to pass and overtake a slower vehicle. That 151 torque won't let you. You will hit an oncoming car the opposite side if you do.

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      10-05-2012 02:14 PM #73
      Quote Originally Posted by choochoo View Post
      I was commenting on west coast Gen Yers? I don't think I know anyone around my age, would even consider a buick. Which people are you polling, Verano owners? I wonder how many Verano owners are gen Y and live on the west coast. I'm really curious.

      I think the CR comment is very valid for the compact entry level luxury market. Like I said earlier, people would rather buy a bigger car with the same amount of features without the premium badge.
      Especially in a soft economy.
      Well there is a big, big world out there beyond the West Coast. 30 years ago, BMW's were what you drove if you couldn't afford a Mercedes and Saab was in the wheelhouse of those same buyers. Things change, and will continue to do so if a company makes the investment. And CR's view is outdated. Why is the 'Verano segment' and the smaller premium market in general growing? Buyers needs are changing, along with there spending habits.

    4. Member choochoo's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 02:36 PM #74
      Quote Originally Posted by Minority5 View Post
      Well there is a big, big world out there beyond the West Coast. 30 years ago, BMW's were what you drove if you couldn't afford a Mercedes and Saab was in the wheelhouse of those same buyers. Things change, and will continue to do so if a company makes the investment. And CR's view is outdated. Why is the 'Verano segment' and the smaller premium market in general growing? Buyers needs are changing, along with there spending habits.
      I understand that, my comments are based on my observations. I'd rather not talk about the rest of the country where I have little or no experience with. Like I said, I wonder what percentage of Verano owners are on the west coast and gen y?

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      10-05-2012 02:40 PM #75
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      I'd say you pretty much described the CC and the GLI as well.
      Agreed.

      People just like to whip on Acura on these boards.

      Sure, go buy your beyond base level Audi/BMW/Merc whatever at 30k, it won't have nearly the same options or equipment on it as the ILX will, lets be honest here.....

      The ILX looks worlds better than the Verano.

      For the price I do agree the engines could have a little more oomph to them... Why not the I4 from the Accord?

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      10-05-2012 03:20 PM #76
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      I'd say you pretty much described the CC and the GLI as well.
      Except the GLI is cheaper and has 50 more bhp.

      And the CC is a larger, more substantial car that many people feel is quite stylish.

      What does the ILX have on either of these cars? What 'killer app' does it have that distinguishes it in the marketplace?
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      10-05-2012 03:28 PM #77
      The marketing behind this car is horrid. Here's the full page ad in C&D for the ILX:





      So, if your dad didn't have you, you think he'd be driving an ILX? And who are they targeting with that ad..... you, or your dad so he can reclaim his youth?

      I went to the local dealer and saw a ILX in the showroom this week. $33K. You gotta be kidding me.
      Last edited by randy; 10-05-2012 at 03:44 PM.
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      10-05-2012 03:39 PM #78
      Quote Originally Posted by clutchrider View Post
      For the money of an ILX you could easily slide into a loaded GLI or get a nice lease on a VW CC.

      I am not pushing my own car, but there is nothing that really makes the ILX stand out. It looks meh, it performs meh, and is marketed towards the entry level businessman. Sorry but I know of nobody in that market who would want this car.

      I've seen one in the flesh. One. It looked nice, nicer than the pictures show. But it wasn't anything special.
      When it comes to actually spending my own money, in reality, I'm 100% with you on this. I would pick the GLI over pretty much any other sedan under $35k. Which isn't to say that I think the GLI is the objective best car out there, but I think it represents a better value. At least at moderate levels of equipment, which is how I buy my cars anyway.

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      10-05-2012 03:53 PM #79
      Quote Originally Posted by randy View Post
      So, if your dad didn't have you, you think he'd be driving an ILX? And who are they targeting with that ad..... you, or your dad so he can reclaim his youth?
      marketing 101 fail

    10. Member P-Body's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 03:55 PM #80
      Quote Originally Posted by Charlie84 View Post
      Except the GLI is cheaper and has 50 more bhp.

      And the CC is a larger, more substantial car that many people feel is quite stylish.

      What does the ILX have on either of these cars? What 'killer app' does it have that distinguishes it in the marketplace?
      By that rationale, a GLI is a horrible buy considering I can get a WRX for about the same amount.

      And I'll match your CC with just about any upper echelon mid-size sedan with more options from a non-luxury brand.

      It's a silly argument. And one that is parroted over and over. Your two examples don't bring anything new to the table either, but you're using them as examples. In fact, the Jetta regressed technically versus previous generations.

      The ILX is a premium compact car. Nothing more or less.
      Quote Originally Posted by teklord69 View Post
      Scenario: Uphill on two lane hwy. You need to pass and overtake a slower vehicle. That 151 torque won't let you. You will hit an oncoming car the opposite side if you do.

    11. 10-05-2012 04:06 PM #81
      Acura needs to get serious liek Infiniti does offer more hp than the competition to get in the game.
      This isnt 1986 anymore

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      10-05-2012 04:13 PM #82
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      By that rationale, a GLI is a horrible buy considering I can get a WRX for about the same amount.

      And I'll match your CC with just about any upper echelon mid-size sedan with more options from a non-luxury brand.

      It's a silly argument. And one that is parroted over and over. Your two examples don't bring anything new to the table either, but you're using them as examples. In fact, the Jetta regressed technically versus previous generations.

      The ILX is a premium compact car. Nothing more or less.
      I'm not trying to hawk the GLI or the CC. Someone else brought up that particular comparison. My point is that they each have something compelling about them...a reason to prefer X instead of Y. The ILX does not.

      I just purchased a GLI as my daily driver. I got it for a ridiculously good price (less than the cost of a loaded Civic). I wouldn't call it a great car, but it's good solid transportation that can be a little fun now and then and isn't aesthetically embarrassing (as I find the WRX to be). In the GLI:WRX Venn diagram, they have some in common but not really that much overlap...different features, layout, design, and different buyers. If you Venn diagram'd the GLI and the ILX, I think you'd find that there is much more overlap but the ILX's circle is considerably smaller despite being more expensive.

      Again, my point is not about the GLI or the CC or the WRX. I'm focusing on the ILX and it's lack of any unique appeal. In the crowded market of $25K sedans, how does the ILX stand out? I guess some might argue in it's favor that you're getting a "luxury" badge for $25K. Well, I can't help those people if all they're after is the badge...and not even a very good one at that.
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      10-05-2012 04:15 PM #83
      Quote Originally Posted by Hajduk View Post
      Meanwhile in Canada....... the ILX is selling better than its predecessor, the CSX.

      I guess we just really like fancy Civics.
      Don't think so... even in GTA north (Markham, Richmond hill) where lots of Asia ladies (EL and CSX were always loved by Asian ladies ), I don't see the new ILX much. I am guessing lots of Acura customers (specially Asian) had moved "up" to Audi/BMW/Mercedes.

      I only saw an ILX on 401 once... Honestly, nowadays Honda and Acura selling most of their cars with big discounts... like the old GM.
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      10-05-2012 04:18 PM #84
      Quote Originally Posted by Impeccable View Post
      Acura needs to get serious liek Infiniti does offer more hp than the competition to get in the game.
      This isnt 1986 anymore
      Really! Infiniti knew that it needed a shot in the arm and to do that, they needed a game-changer. Solution? Build a 3-series knock-off, but make it bigger, more powerful, and cheaper. It's a simple formula, but it did exactly what it was supposed to. Now, Infiniti is in much better shape than it was when it was just re-badging Maximas.
      DD: 2012 GLI with a friggin' plaid roof.
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      10-05-2012 04:34 PM #85
      Seen three ILX's on the road. All driven by middle aged women.

      I live in Southern CA... the "just for men" guys don't want to drive cars like this. They're buying trucks, mustangs, or RWD...
      - mikey

      "It's not a real build until there's Plasti Dip involved."

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      10-05-2012 04:38 PM #86
      Quote Originally Posted by Charlie84 View Post
      I'm not trying to hawk the GLI or the CC. Someone else brought up that particular comparison. My point is that they each have something compelling about them...a reason to prefer X instead of Y. The ILX does not.

      I just purchased a GLI as my daily driver. I got it for a ridiculously good price (less than the cost of a loaded Civic). I wouldn't call it a great car, but it's good solid transportation that can be a little fun now and then and isn't aesthetically embarrassing (as I find the WRX to be). In the GLI:WRX Venn diagram, they have some in common but not really that much overlap...different features, layout, design, and different buyers. If you Venn diagram'd the GLI and the ILX, I think you'd find that there is much more overlap but the ILX's circle is considerably smaller despite being more expensive.

      Again, my point is not about the GLI or the CC or the WRX. I'm focusing on the ILX and it's lack of any unique appeal. In the crowded market of $25K sedans, how does the ILX stand out? I guess some might argue in it's favor that you're getting a "luxury" badge for $25K. Well, I can't help those people if all they're after is the badge...and not even a very good one at that.
      And my point is that everything you described your GLI as, I can do the same for the ILX. It stands out in a sea of good 25k sedans about as well as anything else, including your Jetta.

      And the Subie is squarely in the same group as the Jetta. Turbocharged compact sedans from regular brands. The Acura plays with the Verano, A3, CT and whatever the small Volvo is.
      Quote Originally Posted by teklord69 View Post
      Scenario: Uphill on two lane hwy. You need to pass and overtake a slower vehicle. That 151 torque won't let you. You will hit an oncoming car the opposite side if you do.

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      10-05-2012 04:39 PM #87
      I wasn't looking to tout the GLI/CC either. I was just using them as examples. The CC for it's price point offers something that you cannot get "brand new" in the market from many other manufacturers. At least not without stepping into Mercedes price ranges.

      In the sea of sedans in the ILX price range, what makes it stand out from the group? Is the GLI the best of the best, not at all. But it is the "performance" (used lightly) version of the Jetta lineup and thus has a niche same as the Si and WRX in the same price point. Value for the money plays a role in this segment. The ILX just doesn't have anything to make it noticeable.

      Acura should be spending more time fixing their current models than releasing more garbage (MDX aside). It just adds to the opinion that they don't care anymore.

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      10-05-2012 04:48 PM #88
      That brochure reminds me of this....

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      10-05-2012 04:50 PM #89
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      In fact, the Jetta regressed technically versus previous generations.
      Maybe for the non-GLI Jetta, but the GLI has the IRS & all the soft touch interior trim of the euro-Jettas.

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      10-05-2012 05:14 PM #90
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      And my point is that everything you described your GLI as, I can do the same for the ILX. It stands out in a sea of good 25k sedans about as well as anything else, including your Jetta.
      Um isnt the ILX, at best, a 2.4L N/A with 200 hp / 170 tq? At about 2978 lbs... it's similar but probably a bit slower than the GLI.

      Also it's derpy looking.
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      10-05-2012 05:46 PM #91
      You'd think TCLers never heard of a manufacturer making a premium car based on a non-premium car.
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      10-05-2012 05:52 PM #92
      Acura sells a 4-door sedan with 201hp and a manual for less than $30k and TCL still bitches and moans...

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      10-05-2012 05:56 PM #93
      Quote Originally Posted by Hostile View Post
      Acura sells a 4-door sedan with 201hp and a manual for less than $30k and TCL still bitches and moans...
      Because it's

      a) weird looking
      b) 170 tq for ~2970 lbs
      c) not un-weird looking
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    24. 10-05-2012 05:59 PM #94
      Quote Originally Posted by above8k View Post
      people saying ILX is like another Civic.
      I forgive you, but I can understand why you are confused. You probably didn't know about the generations before the ILX to truly grasp what the ILX is.

      The EL, CSX, and ILX are just a tarted up Civic targeted for people older than 25.

      Acura EL

      (Civic Based)



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      Acura ILX

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      Last edited by DedRok; 10-05-2012 at 06:07 PM.
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    25. Member choochoo's Avatar
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      nothing to see here
      10-05-2012 06:07 PM #95
      ^^^nope
      ILX has a completely different sheet metal all the way around and different interior.

    26. 10-05-2012 06:08 PM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by Prail11 View Post
      Agreed.

      People just like to whip on Acura on these boards.

      Sure, go buy your beyond base level Audi/BMW/Merc whatever at 30k, it won't have nearly the same options or equipment on it as the ILX will, lets be honest here.....

      The ILX looks worlds better than the Verano.

      For the price I do agree the engines could have a little more oomph to them... Why not the I4 from the Accord?
      While subjectively, it may look better than the Verano ( I don't care for either the ILX or the Verano), the ILX is priced close enough to the Buick Regal that it becomes a legitimate choice.


      I think the Accord is the number 1 reason not to get an ILX. The newly redesigned Accord starts at a lower base price, with a more powerful engine: 185-189 hp 2.4 I4 vs 150 hp 2.0 I4.
      If you move up to the more powerful 2.4 I4 in the ILX (201 hp starting @ $29K+) you get close to the Accord EX L V6 which has 278 hp starting @ $30K+.

    27. 10-05-2012 06:11 PM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by choochoo View Post
      ^^^nope
      ILX has a completely different sheet metal all the way around and different interior.
      Coming from a guy from a country where the EL & CSX wasnt sold....

      "The Acura ILX is an entry-level luxury car for Honda's luxury brand Acura. It replaces the Canada-exclusive Acura CSX and is a new model for the U.S. Like the preceding CSX, the Acura ILX is related to the Honda Civic." - Exactly what my definition of "tarted up Civic" means... It's cosemtics are different, but when you get down to the bones, it's a Civic. Are you trying to tell me that it's an entirely different car?

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acura_ILX
      Last edited by DedRok; 10-05-2012 at 06:16 PM.
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      10-05-2012 06:12 PM #98
      I'll just leave this here....



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      10-05-2012 06:20 PM #99
      Quote Originally Posted by P-Body View Post
      And my point is that everything you described your GLI as, I can do the same for the ILX. It stands out in a sea of good 25k sedans about as well as anything else, including your Jetta.
      You're right. I described the GLI as "good solid transportation that can be a little fun now and then and isn't aesthetically embarrassing." This also describes the ILX. But, the VW has the following "x-factors" working for it's appeal:

      -$25K gets you 200bhp, a turbocharger, cloth seats, a 6-speed dual-clutch automatic OR a manual, and the appeal of buying into a brand with a following and a youthful, semi-hip, European image (which, of course, matters to some). Raw, irrational, visceral appeal matters when it comes to big purchases.

      The ILX, in contrast:

      -$25K gets you 150 bhp, naturally aspirated, cloth seats, a 5-speed automatic only and all the image appeal of a fax machine.

      Summation: The ILX is a perfectly good car. Of course it is. It's based on a Civic, after all. But, just as the Civic is no longer the market segment champ it once was, the ILX has no uniquely compelling appeal. It does not stand out in any area. It is merely "good enough". So, I ask you: What does the ILX offer that would make you say "Yes, that's the one to have" and then sign on the dotted line?

      Quote Originally Posted by clutchrider View Post
      I wasn't looking to tout the GLI/CC either. I was just using them as examples. The CC for it's price point offers something that you cannot get "brand new" in the market from many other manufacturers. At least not without stepping into Mercedes price ranges.

      In the sea of sedans in the ILX price range, what makes it stand out from the group? Is the GLI the best of the best, not at all. But it is the "performance" (used lightly) version of the Jetta lineup and thus has a niche same as the Si and WRX in the same price point. Value for the money plays a role in this segment. The ILX just doesn't have anything to make it noticeable.
      Quote Originally Posted by thebanker View Post
      Um isnt the ILX, at best, a 2.4L N/A with 200 hp / 170 tq? At about 2978 lbs... it's similar but probably a bit slower than the GLI.

      Also it's derpy looking.
      Actually, I think it's reasonably good looking in a way that will appeal to the soft, soggy middle of the sedan market. But, really, there are hardly any truly bad looking sedans available today. Even Kia and Suzuki have well-styled mainstream sedans. Looks will not be a hindrance to ILX sales. But boring looks are not the stuff you need to build brand cache. Acura has no brand cache. They're in a state of continual existential crisis.
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      10-05-2012 06:58 PM #100
      Quote Originally Posted by Charlie84 View Post
      Actually, I think it's reasonably good looking in a way that will appeal to the soft, soggy middle of the sedan market. But, really, there are hardly any truly bad looking sedans available today. Even Kia and Suzuki have well-styled mainstream sedans. Looks will not be a hindrance to ILX sales. But boring looks are not the stuff you need to build brand cache. Acura has no brand cache. They're in a state of continual existential crisis.
      I think it's reasonably bland looking. It's not downright hideous, but put it next to a competitor like the Kia Optima or a Sonata.

      Suzuki's mainstream sedan isn't half bad, I think the Kizashi has more flair than the ILX. The reason Acura has a tough time building brand cache is because they keep putting out cars like this. Where I live, cars are important. Acura is trying to target my demographic with this car. I'm a 30 year old married guy with a job and no kids. I like cars and I care about what I drive, and I don't want a truck. The crowd Acura thinks it's targeting is ACTUALLY buying:

      used A4's
      GTI's
      Jettas
      Optimas
      Sonatas
      Chargers
      Mustangs
      used G35's and 37's
      new Fusion, probably
      Heck, they're even buying the new style Camry that's grounded to the ground.

      My point is, this car exemplifies Acura's lack of brand cache. It's not cool looking, it's not mean looking, and neither are the guts.

      Step it up Acura. Sh#t I'd buy a used RSX, but not this thing...
      - mikey

      "It's not a real build until there's Plasti Dip involved."

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      10-05-2012 07:00 PM #101
      Quote Originally Posted by DedRok View Post
      I forgive you, but I can understand why you are confused. You probably didn't know about the generations before the ILX to truly grasp what the ILX is.

      The EL, CSX, and ILX are just a tarted up Civic targeted for people older than 25.

      Acura EL


      (Civic Based)




      Acura CSX


      (Civic Based)



      Acura ILX


      (Civic Based)

      Thanks for proving my point. The Acura EL and CSX wore faint disguises, where as the ILX has all around different sheet metal and interior. That's all I was saying.
      Last edited by choochoo; 10-05-2012 at 07:09 PM.

    32. Member thebanker's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 07:06 PM #102
      It's wearing a prettier dress, yes.

      Hey Acura, I'm your demographic. Make a freakin' Integra Type R again, and make it cool. I'd buy it. Or a Legend coupe.

      no?


      What's that?


      oh you have this for me. Great.



      hurrrrr durrrrr
      Last edited by thebanker; 10-05-2012 at 07:11 PM.
      - mikey

      "It's not a real build until there's Plasti Dip involved."

    33. Member thebanker's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 07:12 PM #103
      ^ and that humping character line around the rear wheel isn't fooling anyone... no power to those wheels.

      Ok I'm done.
      - mikey

      "It's not a real build until there's Plasti Dip involved."

    34. Member Robski92's Avatar
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      10-05-2012 07:28 PM #104
      I think it's a very subtle car and suits people who want something understated, I like the interior too. It could be a decent CPO in a couple of years.

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      10-05-2012 07:36 PM #105
      Quote Originally Posted by Charlie84 View Post
      You're right. I described the GLI as "good solid transportation that can be a little fun now and then and isn't aesthetically embarrassing." This also describes the ILX. But, the VW has the following "x-factors" working for it's appeal:

      -$25K gets you 200bhp, a turbocharger, cloth seats, a 6-speed dual-clutch automatic OR a manual, and the appeal of buying into a brand with a following and a youthful, semi-hip, European image (which, of course, matters to some). Raw, irrational, visceral appeal matters when it comes to big purchases.

      The ILX, in contrast:

      -$25K gets you 150 bhp, naturally aspirated, cloth seats, a 5-speed automatic only and all the image appeal of a fax machine.

      Summation: The ILX is a perfectly good car. Of course it is. It's based on a Civic, after all. But, just as the Civic is no longer the market segment champ it once was, the ILX has no uniquely compelling appeal. It does not stand out in any area. It is merely "good enough". So, I ask you: What does the ILX offer that would make you say "Yes, that's the one to have" and then sign on the dotted line?
      .
      You're missing the point. Acura isn't targeting the Jetta with this car. They're going after the entry level luxury market. Similarly badged vehicles. You can scoff at the price of the badge, but that's the market. Buick prices the Verano cheaper because they have to price it cheaper. The majority of this market sits at the 30k mark, where the 200HP ILX fits just fine.

      What would make me buy an ILX? Nothing. But I wouldn't buy anything in this class, because I'd rather pay a bit more and get something better, with every single entrant. But the ILX does the stylish compact car thing pretty well. And it will likely be excellent on gas and the most reliable in the segment.

      If you play the game you're suggesting, I might as well say that a Jetta GLI is a ridiculous proposition in light of 270 HP midsizers for the same price. But I wouldn't do that, because someone shopping a Jetta GLI isn't looking at an Altima 3.5, just to name one example.
      Quote Originally Posted by teklord69 View Post
      Scenario: Uphill on two lane hwy. You need to pass and overtake a slower vehicle. That 151 torque won't let you. You will hit an oncoming car the opposite side if you do.

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