Checking V8 (6 speed transmission) fluid levels

[Kenny G]

Hi all,

I got fluid to change out my v8 tranny fluid and found more oil in there than I thought so I have suspended my job until I get a little info.

I decided to take out the fill plug first to see if I could feel in there and determine if the fluid was LOW possibly causing my tranny to slip a little when driving around town. It is starting to exhibit some of the issues which other owners have had and the fluid refresh seemed like a good start. Maybe the tranny is over full but to my surprise fluid started draining out before I had the plug all the way out so I put it back in. The car was in a level position so that should not have been a factor.

Is this normal?

Tomorrow I will try it when cold maybe the temp was to high, the fluid seemed to be around 30-40C and I had not driven it in 4 hours.

Thank you for your thoughts!

Ken

[PanEuropean]

Hi Kenny:

The process for checking the transmission fluid level is complex. It is described in detail in a post here on the forum that specifically addresses the 5 speed transmission used in Phaetons equipped with the W12 engine, however, I SUSPECT that the process for checking fluid level might be similar for the 6 speed transmission.

In short, the fluid is checked only when it is at a specific temperature, with the engine running.

See this post: Changing Transmission Fluid on the 5 speed (FGE) Transmission (W12 Engine), the explanation of how to check the fluid is in there towards the end of the initial write-up.

Michael

[jkuisma]

I SUSPECT that the process for checking fluid level might be similar for the 6 speed transmission.

I confirm this. Taking of the plug is a bad idea. It is really not possible to check the fluid level without "topping it up" at the same time.

Jouko

[Paximus]

Hi Ken,

There's some info in this PDF from Audi on diagnostics for ZF 5HP19 and 5HP24 gearboxes, including comments about ATF level.:

5HP19 & 5HP24 Diagnostics


The VW level check/filling procedure for the 09L box is this:


Test Conditions



-- Monitor the gearbox oil temperature using VCDS.

-- When the temperature reaches between 35 and 40 deg C, remove the ATF inspection plug from the oil pan.

-- If ATF continues to drip steadily out of the inspection hole:




-- Adding ATF requires a special hooked nozzle on the V.A.G 1924 unit.

-- With the ATF temperature still the same, fill with ATF until ATF flows out of the inspection hole.



I hope that helps, if I got the correct gearbox info...

Cheers,
Chris

[Kenny G]

You guys are life savers I should have read up on the procedure before getting into it. I think I have a clear idea on the procedure now and will try soon. I will keep you all posted and again thank you for all you do! Really could own one of these cars without the forum unless money was a none issue. So far I have survived with an amazingly reliable car which has not been any more expensive to own than my mercedes or ford.

ken

[invisiblewave]

The dealer hooks up the transmission to their monitoring equipment to precisely check the temperature of the fluid when gauging the level, so I'm not sure how you'd even be able to attempt it yourself. Somewhere in the forum there's a document that speaks to the importance of the temperature during the measuring process, and indicates how much difference it makes to fluid quantity depending on relatively small temperature fluctuations.

[PanEuropean]

There's some info in this PDF from Audi on diagnostics for ZF 5HP19 and 5HP24 gearboxes...

I have attached the complete PDF that Chris refers to below. The original document (hosted at the other site) was 1.01 megabytes, just fractionally over the maximum size for attaching a PDF here, so I resaved it as a 'reduced size' PDF. That might have resulted in a little bit of image quality degradation, so, as long as the original document is available at the link Chris provided, probably best to grab the original.

Michael

[PanEuropean]

Adding ATF requires a special hooked nozzle on the V.A.G 1924 unit...

Here is a picture of the hooked nozzle that is used to get the ATF into the filling and level-checking hole. You could probably make a jury-rig device that accomplishes the same thing - just keep the tank with the supply of fluid considerably higher than the transmission filling hole, and gravity will do the rest. As I mentioned earlier, the whole process is illustrated at this post: Changing Transmission Fluid on the 5 speed (FGE) Transmission (W12 Engine), but keep in mind that that post describes the specific processes and values for the 5 speed transmission.

Michael

Transmission Fluid Filling Tool

[PanEuropean]

Attached below is an extract from the VW maintenance manual for the Phaeton that sets out the exact steps for checking fluid level.

Also attached is a document from ZF (the manufacturer of the transmission) that lists approved fluids that may be used.

Michael

[Paximus]

Here's Ross-Tech's instructions on reading the ATF temperature using VCDS (VAG-COM):

[Select]
[02 - Auto Trans]
[Meas. Blocks - 08]
Set group to "005" (May be group 002 or 004 in some vehicles - again check the Repair Manual).
[Go!]
The value in field 1 should be ATF temp in °C.

Chris

PS - I get confused as to the correct name for VCDS - it's listed as VCDS on Ross-Tech's web site and in the product itself, but VAG-COM on their web adverts and in most people's reference to it.

[PanEuropean]

...I get confused as to the correct name for VCDS...

The formal name is VCDS, but the product is widely known by the original name, which is VAG-COM. I believe that Uwe (the company owner) changed the formal name to VCDS about 4 years ago, when he determined that he could not register a trademark for VAG-COM.

Michael

[Kenny G]

I have vcds but my pc is died and the apple doesn't work for vcds so I will have to get another pc at some point.

I drained 6 quarts out and measured the amount then went through the procedure to refill with a basically cold car but could only get around 4 quarts back in for some reason. I drove it around for a few days but it wasn't shifting any better so then I decided to back-fill through the drain plug the other 2 quarts and it drives much better! I am tempted to flush again because the transmission was much improved and I can only get the slip to happen between 2nd and 3rd when it is really hot and I floor it. Seems to me like 130,000 miles was far to long to wait to change the fluid. (wish VW had been more help) Hope it last me a few more years, there are reports on the audi forums that transmissions go beyond 200,000 if well maintained not sure if the vehicles mentioned had the exact same 6sp transmission but it gives me hope!

Ken