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Is there a market here for small engine diesel luxury cars in the US?

5K views 58 replies 29 participants last post by  Saintor 
#1 ·
I've lived years in Europe and towards the end I had a 2011 Opel Astra Wagon with a 1.7 turbo-diesel.... I NEVER felt like it needed more power even loaded. It would easily cruise at 160kph (100mph), while getting 45mpg and still have plenty of room to keep accelerating. I also rode in a few taxis that were Mercedes E220CDI and loved them!

Now I know the Astra is no luxury car, but I wish I could buy a new E250CDI here in America, I want the room and luxury, but I have no need for power, I drive 40k miles a year and if I could just get something nice like an E-class that will also get excellent economy I'd be sold.

My Astra dwarfing my cousin's Twingo


What I want:
 
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#13 ·
x2.

The US doesn't have the right climate for diesels. Cars are not as expensive as Europe and we have far fewer taxes on displacement or emissions.

I'll bet you if European countries dropped emissions/engine size taxes and lowered fuel prices big hulking engines would become popular overnight :p
 
#3 ·
What I want:
id buy one of those. maybe even new. :thumbup:


but no dice though, their target market here in the states wants lots of power off idle and to not have to use more than 30% throttle when merging (slowly) onto the freeway. a smaller motor that needed to be flogged even harder to function in traffic definitely wouldnt fly here...
 
#6 ·
id buy one of those. maybe even new. :thumbup:


but no dice though, their target market here in the states wants lots of power off idle and to not have to use more than 30% throttle when merging (slowly) onto the freeway. a smaller motor that needed to be flogged even harder to function in traffic definitely wouldnt fly here...
Welcome to Diesel Town, population: Torque.
US Drivers act like they need hp, but it's really the torque wave they want to ride. Low Revs and minimal pedal input is the Diesel M.O.
 
#11 ·
Basically, no. I think a lot of folks like the idea of them, I think that very few would actually go ahead and do it.

To the extent that there's a market for diesel luxury cars, I think it's SUVs, not compacts. My feeling is that hybrids, EVs, and PHEVs are more marketable in the compact luxury space. And the market backs me up on that.
 
#18 ·
There may be, as the diesel market is growing in the states. However, the only small engine diesel luxury vehicle sold here does not sell in any significant numbers. Audi A3 TDI. That said, the A3 is long in the tooth and a small hatchback.....an A4 wagon TDi may have been a better move.
 
#20 ·
any small engine is a pretty hard sell in the US.
much less a small diesel in a big car.

i would really like to see more small diesels, DI gassers, hybrids, etc in all segments.
we have gone power and displacement hungry in the US and fleet fuel economy suffers because of it.
 
#23 ·
Remember when BMW sold a crapload of these? Yeah, me neither.

Remember when the OP said Small Engine Diesel? yeah, this is not it.


I think there absolutely is a market for small engine diesel luxury AND non-luxury vehicles. The reason why that 335d didn't do well was because it didn't really offer that much more than a 328i in terms of performance and fuel economy, but it was priced very close to a base M3 when decently optioned.

Now had BMW given us a 320d priced at around the same as a base 328i people would be willing to give up a little performance for a huge improvement in fuel economy and I suspect things would have been much different in the sales front. Small engine diesel today doesn't mean small power. Only a few years ago a 6 cylinder 3.0 E320 diesel made about 200 hp and 360 lb/ft of torque and it was refer to as a freight train. Today almost every maker which offers diesel powertrains can get very similar power figures from 2.0 and 2.2 4 cylinder diesel engines while achieving even better fuel economy. There's a market for these engines almost every where in the world, I don't see what makes the US market so different or special for these diesel engines not to make sense.
 
#31 ·
I'd love to see more Diesel offerings...

Every time the manufactuers try though the things just don't sell. Like another poster said given the market we live in, the answer is self explanitory because they are not here!

The biggest reason they do so well in europe is mostly due to the size of the roads in a lot of places favoring smaller cars, and of course the biggest reason being fuel costs.

Fuel is still really cheap in NA compared to most of the world, and the premium you pay for a diesel over a gasser doesn't really justify the fuel savings. I honestly don't think the average driver much cares about the differences in how the motors perform, it's usually just about the $$$.
 
#44 ·
I would guess that there is a market for small diesel engines in luxury cars in the US. I bought a Golf TDI earlier this year that was only missing one option as far as I can tell, the DSG transmission. It has the tech package with HID adaptable headlights, KESSY, upgrade Dynaudio stereo, etc. It ended up right around $30k and I consider myself to not be an extravagant spender. Before any one says "But that's not a luxury car" I agree! It is not a luxury car, it's an economy commuter car that still hit $30k. If someone wants a luxury car but fuel economy is still a priority then a small diesel would make sense.

I have issues with the US attitude that comfort and luxury are proportionate to size and also to power/performance. These metrics are independant to some extent. A small car with soft touch materials, thick carpet, lots of sound damping, and thick leather is still luxurious even without the footprint of a land yacht.
 
#47 · (Edited)
FV-QR

North American diesel cars exist for questionable reasons.

It is not about saving money. It is a gadget lovers thing. So they are a NICHE market and judging by overall performance hybrids like ES300h and MKZ hybrids would rape them.

2016 CAFE is coming.
 
#52 ·
The 335d did not sell well in my opinion because most of the cars were loaded to the brim and were available only with automatics. I would have bought one and tuned it but the lack of manual transmission was the deciding factor for me. So I bought 335i.

BTW, the N57 engine in the 335d is HEAVILY undertuned. With just a few simple mods, it will make close to 500 of tire shredding torques. You will could not dead in one of these. :laugh:
 
#59 ·
The 335d did not sell well in my opinion because most of the cars were loaded to the brim and were available only with automatics.
It did not sell because North American don't want diesel cars that make no sense in regard to their raison d'être; saving money. Oh, also a diesel is nasty. Much more fun with a well-born gasser.
 
#53 ·
The 335d definitely had a pricing issue. I bought mine new, but I did not pay anywhere near MSRP for it. It would be a much more convincing package if it was priced $5K less. The engine is fantastic, but everything else (good and bad) is standard 3-series.

At this price point, I think the X5 is better suited for the engine.

I have a mild chip on mine and the power delivery is way more fun than any 328i I've driven.
 
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