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    Thread: Aisin Tiptronic Transmission Life

    1. Member SickTRed08FSI's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 09:27 AM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by Bill6211789 View Post
      Whoever you talked to at the dealer was an IDIOT! Change ur fluid and filter.

      Sent from my Galaxy S3
      This times like a million!!!!!! Buy the kit off ECS, find a good indy shop, and have them do it.
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    2. Member wpzr's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 09:30 AM #37
      Mine was telling me the same thing, but I managed to make them change my valve body and they put new fluid and filter as well

    3. 10-01-2013 10:55 AM #38
      This reminds me that I need to change mine soon. I'm at 105.6k and put 50miles every day. I have no idea about the previous life of my car except they had not performed any of the recalls, which I had done. So I'm assuming the transmission has never been serviced. It will be serviced by the latest 110k but it's holding up good with no issues. Other than the slow shifts of tiptronic.
      Quote Originally Posted by spitfirevr6 View Post
      I don't know what to think anymore after nemo played with my emotions.

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      10-01-2013 03:42 PM #39
      I have an '07 09G wagon and did receive a VW letter recommending transmission fluid changes. IMO there is no such thing as a lifetime transmission fluid. This is also debated for my 330i as well; BMW says lifetime fluid but the manufacturer (ZF) recommends every ~50k fluid change, so the consensus online is to change the fluid per the tranny manufacturs guidelines, not the car brand who's maintenance recommendations seem to be marketing driven

    5. Member Bill6211789's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 03:54 PM #40
      Quote Originally Posted by smgs92 View Post
      This reminds me that I need to change mine soon. I'm at 105.6k and put 50miles every day. I have no idea about the previous life of my car except they had not performed any of the recalls, which I had done. So I'm assuming the transmission has never been serviced. It will be serviced by the latest 110k but it's holding up good with no issues. Other than the slow shifts of tiptronic.
      See if your timing belt has been changed also, bc if it hasn't thats due too

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      10-01-2013 04:11 PM #41
      Quote Originally Posted by thenew3 View Post
      Dealer quoted $350 for flush.

      For what its worth, in my previous vehicle (BMW 328i) it also had a lifetime trans fluid and over 175k miles, I never changed the fluid and never had any issues with the transmission. still shifted as smoothly and ran as efficiently as the first day I picked it up with 6 miles on it.
      Had a '99 Passat 1.8t GLS and it was 12 years old and 180k miles. No problems with that trans. It was a lifetime fill. just my experience. Your mileage may vary.

    7. Member jddaigle's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 06:31 PM #42
      Quote Originally Posted by gstrouse View Post
      Had a '99 Passat 1.8t GLS and it was 12 years old and 180k miles. No problems with that trans. It was a lifetime fill. just my experience. Your mileage may vary.
      The transmission in your '99 was totally different from the 6-speed unit in the B6.

      It isn't complicated at all--if you have a non-DSG 6-speed auto in your VW, change the fluid and filter every 40,000mi. End of story. Go have a
      - Jeff
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    8. Member DasCC's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 07:08 PM #43
      Quote Originally Posted by joakim6945 View Post
      I just called my dealer to check on this. The answer i got was: "How many miles on your car?" "94,000" "I wouldn't even worry about it then. Let me introduce you to our sales rep you'll be needing a new car soon." If it would have been at 40,000 you could do it as part of an interval", but since your mileage is high I wouldn't even bother". So then I was like, "Well, that's why I think I SHOULD do it. Since the mileage is so high". Answer: "I don't know man. I see what you are saying...".
      this is probably what he meant.

    9. 10-01-2013 08:03 PM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by Bill6211789 View Post
      See if your timing belt has been changed also, bc if it hasn't thats due too

      Sent from my Galaxy S3
      Will be doing that as well. Any rough estimates of dealer pricing for transmission fluid and timing belt vs a typical indie shop?
      Quote Originally Posted by spitfirevr6 View Post
      I don't know what to think anymore after nemo played with my emotions.

    10. Member Bill6211789's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 08:38 PM #45
      Quote Originally Posted by smgs92 View Post
      Will be doing that as well. Any rough estimates of dealer pricing for transmission fluid and timing belt vs a typical indie shop?
      At the dealer:
      -Fluid job is around 400$ iirc (someone with an auto trans correct me if im wrong)

      -timing belt job is around 1,000$

      If you have a good euro indy local id see what they can do.

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    11. Member DasCC's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 09:24 PM #46
      Quote Originally Posted by Bill6211789 View Post
      At the dealer:
      -Fluid job is around 400$ iirc (someone with an auto trans correct me if im wrong)

      -timing belt job is around 1,000$

      If you have a good euro indy local id see what they can do.

      Sent from my Galaxy S3
      If they only pump the fluid out $400 sounds about right. My dealer drops the pan to change the filter and charges $700

      My indie charged 7 hrs for complete timing job, WP, tensioner and serpentine belt.


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    12. Junior Member frostydub's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 09:51 PM #47
      Quote Originally Posted by low_passat View Post
      I'm no engineer so it's a good possibility I'm reading this incorrectly but based off the introduction section it talks about maximum torque at 184 ft/lbs? Stock we're supposed to be at 207 and then a stage 1 tune puts it close to 300 - just curious I guess.

    13. Member Bill6211789's Avatar
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      10-01-2013 10:42 PM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by frostydub View Post
      I'm no engineer so it's a good possibility I'm reading this incorrectly but based off the introduction section it talks about maximum torque at 184 ft/lbs? Stock we're supposed to be at 207 and then a stage 1 tune puts it close to 300 - just curious I guess.
      Its known the auto trans has it's limitations. Its been proven to be safe by many people at stage 2-2hpfp power levels id say 90% of the auto 2.0t passat guys on here have at least a stage 1 tune. Once past stage 2 hpfp all bets are off as to how long the trans will last.

      Level10 says a TCM flash is all thats needed for the trans to hold more power

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      10-01-2013 11:04 PM #49
      I am not trying to plead for/against a fluid change, but I think there is such thing as lifetime fill. If the fluid can maintain the properties through the life of the clutches (which will wear regardless of how new the fluid is) then you call that lifetime fluid. A lot of older (5 speed at the most) transmissions on BMW and VW and Mercedes are working good with the original fluid even at 200k mls. To me changing the fluid too often is like washing your brake discs and rims everyday because keeping everything clean will prolong the life of the pads.
      That being said, VW had some issues with the valve bodies in these 6 speed auto, and I am pretty sure the pressure boiled down to "let's recommend fluid changes". It is really hard to tell if more fluid changes will help with the valve body issues, but it's a start. I don't think the fluid breaks down so fast, some cars experience problems at 50k mls or so... I am not an engineer for VW and didn't conduct any testing on those valve bodies with new vs old fluid (but I am pretty familiar what happens in companies when the sh?t hits the fan), but I know that most of them fail because of excessive wear, even at low miles, and because the solenoids don't work good. This is true with a lof of new transmissions, which relly heavyly in the valve bodies, from different tranny manufacturers. Long story short, yes, change the fluid, but don't expect the tranny to last longer just because of that. But like eveybody says, it's good preventative measure.

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      10-02-2013 12:51 AM #50
      Welp, if it's a "good preventative measure" what's it preventing?

      Tranny flush/refill with G055 025 A2 spec fluid to correct AST 6262/2 tool level at correct temperature, plus filter change must prolong overall box life.

      If you'd seen the filings around my pan magnets, the pan itself, and the colour of the OEM factory filled fluid at 52k mile you'd see what I mean. Clutches and solenoids must be the better for it. As well as my peace of mind

      Comparing a Borg-Warner 35, or Citroen's conical belt boxes, as examples from my yesteryear with today's hi-tech 09G is irrelevent. How much power was I losing thru them back then?

      It's only the s&h times from UK to Level10 stopping me doing that flash. Mine's a daily driver Stage 1
      (Nikos has his Audi now as well, grrrrr!)

      More good 09G info and tips in this running thread:
      http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea....&goto=newpost

    16. Member Nikos_GR's Avatar
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      10-02-2013 02:41 PM #51
      As few people said (like gigel), the ATF is for lifetime and I almost (98%) agree with this. If someone has a stock car and he is not driving it like a car-killer, I believe it will last forever. Or maybe for some many-many years (depends on what manufacturers characterise as "lifetime" - maybe 10 or 15 years?). So for someone with a stock car and wihtout an agressive driving style, I would say "don't bother mate". BUT, for anyone else (tuned car or agressive driving style), I would say "why not, go for it". Not every 10.000 miles, but do it at least every 30.000 miles.

      I have personally done it three times. Once when in APR stage 2+ (@~56K miles) and then twice while I had APR K04 setup (@~70K miles and @~88K miles). EVERY time, after the ATF change, the car feels like you have a new tranny. It even handles the power better! Now my car has 112,5K miles on the clock from which the last 44K miles are with APR K04 setup and hard driving. Still no problems at all. The car drives great! And it got quicker shift changes after the Level10 flash.


      Quote Originally Posted by RichardSEL View Post
      (Nikos has his Audi now as well, grrrrr!)
      Now I am swapping to DSG and AWD, because I am going for APR Stage 3+ (500+HP). The K04 setup is going in my friends Passat, also 2.0TFSI Tiptronic. We will also transfer the flashed TCM. So I will let you know how the Tip is handling, since we will keep having a car with the same setup. (btw, this car is a US spec Passat, since Tony -my friend- brought it to Greece from US).


      There they are, side by side!




    17. 10-03-2013 11:03 AM #52
      I have an appt to get the oil flushed and chnaged today. So if I keep doing this every 40,000 miles, the transmission would last me a bit I guess? I live in Dallas. Lots of stop-and-go durig rush hour

    18. Global CSI Moderator nater's Avatar
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      10-04-2013 05:33 AM #53
      Quote Originally Posted by gtaylor0 View Post
      Thanks, but I wonder if I should get mine changed as well. Hard to believe that any fluid or filter is lifetime...well, a longer lifetime
      Well,
      I've got the "lifetime" 09m and when I drained it, it was BLACK! Not lifetime.

      By the way, I did not use Vw fluid. I used Kendall Versa-Trans and it runs awesome.
      Versa-Trans is supposedly fluid that crosses into a lot of other vehicles (with a few exceptions).
      Check comparability of fluid first, then flush away !

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      10-04-2013 08:08 AM #54
      Do you still have the old oil, maybe we can send it for analysis?! IMO color is not a good measure of transmission fluid properties.

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      10-04-2013 09:32 AM #55
      Quote Originally Posted by gigel View Post
      Do you still have the old oil, maybe we can send it for analysis?! IMO color is not a good measure of transmission fluid properties.
      When it changes to black from red I'm flushing it. 173k? No need to send it out.

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      10-04-2013 09:58 AM #56
      You do have a point, indeed. But I am telling you that I have seen auto tranny fluids from fleet cars/vans/trucks that followed manufacturer's maintenance schedule (some of them no AT fluid change) and they had 300k + miles, the fluid looked awful color wise, and the transmissions were perfectly fine. I am not saying that's good, it's just that it would be good to find out how "good" or "bad" from a chemical point of view is. And AFAIK you are a champion when it comes to miles on B6 Passat.
      This discussion is almost similar to "how many miles should I do between oil changes". Some can say the best interval is 3000 miles, and "prove" why that is true, some will say that 10k or more is perfectly fine, and again "prove" why they are right. All I know is this: new vehicles owned by people who didn't know you need to change the oil last somewhere between 30k mls and 45k mls

    22. 10-04-2013 11:55 AM #57
      So I heard some people said that the tansmission felt moother and shifter quicker. I couldn't tell a difference at all.

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      10-04-2013 01:36 PM #58
      Quote Originally Posted by joakim6945 View Post
      So I heard some people said that the tansmission felt moother and shifter quicker. I couldn't tell a difference at all.
      Just know that you did preventative maintanence on your car and have no worries.
      My build.
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    24. Member Bill6211789's Avatar
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      10-04-2013 07:38 PM #59
      Quote Originally Posted by gigel View Post
      You do have a point, indeed. But I am telling you that I have seen auto tranny fluids from fleet cars/vans/trucks that followed manufacturer's maintenance schedule (some of them no AT fluid change) and they had 300k + miles, the fluid looked awful color wise, and the transmissions were perfectly fine. I am not saying that's good, it's just that it would be good to find out how "good" or "bad" from a chemical point of view is. And AFAIK you are a champion when it comes to miles on B6 Passat.
      This discussion is almost similar to "how many miles should I do between oil changes". Some can say the best interval is 3000 miles, and "prove" why that is true, some will say that 10k or more is perfectly fine, and again "prove" why they are right. All I know is this: new vehicles owned by people who didn't know you need to change the oil last somewhere between 30k mls and 45k mls
      Vw also says the cam follower isnt a maintenance part in the 2.0t fsi..... I bet you believe that too then?

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    25. Member jddaigle's Avatar
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      10-04-2013 09:22 PM #60
      At 67,000mi the fluid in mine was black and the filter had burn marks. This in a car that has led a pretty gentle life.

      VW changed from lifetime to 40k without any changes to the fluid spec, filter, mechanical components, or TCU programming that anyone has been able to identify. They probably only excluded 2006-2008 cars due to some calculation of the number of cars affected vs. the number still in warranty.

      Given all this, my question is why would you NOT change at least your fluid regularly if you plan to keep your car past 100k, or if you want to sell a used car that doesn't have a potential time bomb for a transmission? Sure, you might get lucky and save the cost of 3-4 transmission services, but why take the chance? I'm asking seriously, not rhetorically.
      - Jeff
      B6 Passat 3.6 & 4motion Resource Thread
      Now: 2008 VW Passat 3.6 4motion Wagon, 2013 Fiat 500 Sport
      Then: 1987 Volvo 745GLE, 1989 Volvo 740GL, 1994 Volvo 940T, 1995 Infiniti G20, 2000 VW Passat 1.8T, 2001 VW Jetta Wolfsburg Ed (x2), 2004 VW Golf TDI, 2006 Jetta TDI

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      10-05-2013 08:46 AM #61
      That is why I said that most owners should do the fluid change for peace of mind.
      The cam follower is DEFINITELY not a maintenance item, it is a bad part or design or a combination of both. If you feel that the cam follower is a maintenance item, then the valve body on the transmission is maintenance. Not just the fluid.

    27. Member Bill6211789's Avatar
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      10-05-2013 01:24 PM #62
      Quote Originally Posted by gigel View Post
      That is why I said that most owners should do the fluid change for peace of mind.
      The cam follower is DEFINITELY not a maintenance item, it is a bad part or design or a combination of both. If you feel that the cam follower is a maintenance item, then the valve body on the transmission is maintenance. Not just the fluid.


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    28. 10-05-2013 01:39 PM #63
      Aisin brand ATF for Aisin AT, (meets VW spec)

      about $6-7/l

      autohaus

      (also available at mypartsgarage, but I can't seem to post an active link)

      had my fluid changed (along with the valve body under the extended warranty) at 80K miles. Will do a fluid change myself next summer at 120K. Full fluid load is 7l, with change, you only remove about 3l. With fluid available this inexpensively, I'm tempted to buy 12l, drain, fill, run for a few minutes, drain again, refill, run, repeat until the fluid coming out looks as clean as the fluid going in.
      Last edited by bkpassat; 10-05-2013 at 01:44 PM.

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      10-05-2013 02:07 PM #64
      Did you change the filter as well?

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      10-06-2013 08:19 PM #65
      I was having some mild transmission whine at 90k and had my local mechanic change the fluid for $120 a couple of months ago. Not only did the whine stop, but I have smoother shifts now, too. For the small investment, I wouldn't think twice about doing it.

    31. 10-07-2013 09:49 AM #66
      I was able to chaneg the filter and do a transmission oil flush fro $380. Thought thaqt was pretty cheap

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      10-18-2013 04:35 PM #67
      Quote Originally Posted by joakim6945 View Post
      I was able to chaneg the filter and do a transmission oil flush fro $380. Thought thaqt was pretty cheap
      I was quoted 179.99 for OEM Synthetic at my local euro indy shop. They do amazing work too.

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      10-18-2013 04:45 PM #68
      Quote Originally Posted by joakim6945 View Post
      I was able to chaneg the filter and do a transmission oil flush fro $380. Thought thaqt was pretty cheap
      I was quoted 179.99 for OEM Synthetic at my local euro indy shop. They do amazing work too.

    34. 10-18-2013 05:30 PM #69
      yeah that's better. You know, I hate to say this because it will probably come back and bite me in the ass, but it is hard to believe that my car has almost 100K on it now. It looks like new (except for some small pinprickdings from flying debris on road trips. The car has been garaged always. At home and at work and it has been waxed every november.

      It also drives like new. Sure, maybe it has lost some power due to wear and tear, but I get no rattles, vibrations, etc. hought would be looking to trade by this time, but I don't see a reason to.

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