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    Thread: The 2017 F1 Countdown Thread

    1. Senior Member @McMike's Avatar
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      11-28-2016 05:28 PM #26
      Quote Originally Posted by robhurlburt View Post
      how much fatter are these tires?
      Here's a testing image from August, the understeer is going to be amazing.


    2. Member vwpiloto's Avatar
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      11-28-2016 06:05 PM #27
      Quote Originally Posted by @McMike View Post
      Here's a testing image from August, the understeer is going to be amazing.
      With those rears, Max no longer needs to move under braking to protect his position.

    3. Member VW...vw...wv...WV's Avatar
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      11-28-2016 06:33 PM #28
      Please never cancel SPA, please!
      I love that track, hope to go to an f1 race there someday.
      Satan´s nopemares...

    4. Member Cousin Eddie's Avatar
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      11-28-2016 07:02 PM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by VW...vw...wv...WV View Post
      Please never cancel SPA, please!
      I love that track, hope to go to an f1 race there someday.
      I went in 2012 when Button dominated. It is an amazing facility, the best racing atmosphere i've ever been around and the best general admission grounds access you could possibly get on the F1 circuit.

      I've also been to Montreal and even in the stands it's a waste of money by comparison.

      The fans at Spa are amazing, the atmosphere is crazy. You can access so many different vantage points on the grounds. Walk right up next to the fence on the long straight and feel the sound go right through you. That was nuts, it was still the naturally aspirated V10s. I will never forget what it felt like to stand a few feet away from the cars at full speed high rpm. Like a slug hitting you when they went by.

      The first car caught me by surprise, it was so unbelievably loud by comparison to anywhere else on the circuit. We were walking a path that's at a lower elevation from the straight. I walked up to the fence to look.
      Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
      yes, i am bored by FWD driving dynamics, and anyone who doesn't drive there cars to the limits and the beyond.

    5. Member VW...vw...wv...WV's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 11:26 AM #30
      Quote Originally Posted by Cousin Eddie View Post
      I went in 2012 when Button dominated. It is an amazing facility, the best racing atmosphere i've ever been around and the best general admission grounds access you could possibly get on the F1 circuit.

      I've also been to Montreal and even in the stands it's a waste of money by comparison.

      The fans at Spa are amazing, the atmosphere is crazy. You can access so many different vantage points on the grounds. Walk right up next to the fence on the long straight and feel the sound go right through you. That was nuts, it was still the naturally aspirated V10s. I will never forget what it felt like to stand a few feet away from the cars at full speed high rpm. Like a slug hitting you when they went by.

      The first car caught me by surprise, it was so unbelievably loud by comparison to anywhere else on the circuit. We were walking a path that's at a lower elevation from the straight. I walked up to the fence to look.

      Wow, that was the exact thing i was hoping for!
      I´m so glad you had the chance to live that.
      I was very close to go to spa on 2011 iirc but we went to rome instead. was an unexpected trip from barcelona to rome already, and going to spa would have just added like a ton of expenses not considered.
      Satan´s nopemares...

    6. Senior Member @McMike's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 01:58 PM #31
      I created my first F1 drive tribe. It's called "Lewis Is Bald."



      https://drivetribe.com/t/CmdlnTH;akjsdb;caib__wed777

    7. Member pawa_k2001's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 02:13 PM #32
      Hoping to make it out to CoTA next year. Cars should look better, hoping for more engine noise though. The cars were to quiet in 2015 Montreal race.

    8. Member Cousin Eddie's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 02:32 PM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by @McMike View Post
      I created my first F1 drive tribe. It's called "Lewis Is Bald."
      Quote Originally Posted by cockerpunk View Post
      yes, i am bored by FWD driving dynamics, and anyone who doesn't drive there cars to the limits and the beyond.

    9. Member CoolJetta3's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 02:33 PM #34
      I'm in

      sent from Galaxy Note4 using Tapatalk
      - Nick

    10. Member G0to60's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 03:12 PM #35
      Now that the 2016 season is over I'm really looking forward to seeing what the various teams do with the new regs. I love geeking out on the comparison between the old car the new up coming car.

      I'll also put in my prediction of Ricciardo as Champion and RBR for the constructor's champion. I really think that RBR will nail it with the new car regs next year. Then I think that it's going to be really close between MB and Ferrari for second.

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      11-29-2016 03:26 PM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by enigmatic enthusiast View Post
      more aero was the last thing they needed. less aero more ground effects would lead to far more exciting races
      The idea was to increase aero while also significantly reducing drag. The lower height of the top rear wing and a elongated diffuser under the front and rear wheels was to help these effects. Of course they significantly increased drag with the wider wheels, but also significantly increased potential grip level.

    12. Member VW...vw...wv...WV's Avatar
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      11-29-2016 06:26 PM #37
      Yeah, grip levels should go really high.

      It will be great seeing how cars behave in Spa´s pouhon curve, or Japan´s 3-4-5, or 130R.
      Satan´s nopemares...

    13. 11-30-2016 01:48 AM #38
      Found some good pictures of tire testing on this site:

      https://twitter.com/pirellisport

      [IMG][/IMG]

    14. Member
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      11-30-2016 03:26 AM #39
      Should have been the first post eh.


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      11-30-2016 05:26 AM #40
      Well here is a good comparison video, showing just how important downforce is compared to speed.


      The 2016 car was between 20-30kph faster on the straight. Yet, even on the Ultra soft tires, the 2011 car completely gained back all of the lost time by significantly better corner speed and control.

      Shows just how great the blown diffuser and downforce was on the 2011 cars. So the complaints about extra downforce and drag may not be such a bad thing if the turbo cars can keep some advantage in speed over the older cars.

      key points

      Turn 1 we can see the clear advantage the 2011 chassis has in the corners, carrying significantly more speed...

      Onto the 1st chicane... Again more corner speed, better chicane exit...and then...

      Down the First straight the V6T/H pulls like a train gaining around 25kph the entire straight. This is even before the DRS zone.

      More of the same before the 2nd DRS zone.

      Into Turn 17 after the long 15-17 complex we can see again the 2011 chassis blowing into the corner with greater accuracy and much higher entry speed. this speed advantage is kept all the way down to the apex and out through turn 18-19 before the v6T/H picks up power into turn 20...

      Then into the last corners 20-21 the 2011 chassis has such a huge Grip and Aero advantage and carries tremendous speed onto the start/finish


      If the 2017 cars can maintain the best of both worlds, lap times will be shattered. But we can see how difficult this is going to be. Carrying significantly more straight line speed and trying to keep it through the corners is going to be a workout.
      Last edited by MaysEffect; 11-30-2016 at 05:38 AM.

    16. Moderator Oliver@triplezoom's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 10:02 AM #41
      German GP is dropped for 2017, Brazil still in doubt http://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/38160269

    17. Senior Member @McMike's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 10:07 AM #42
      Quote Originally Posted by Oliver@triplezoom View Post
      German GP is dropped for 2017, Brazil still in doubt http://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/38160269
      While it might be true, I'll wait until the FIA releases the schedule before I believe it.

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      11-30-2016 12:18 PM #43
      Quote Originally Posted by Cousin Eddie View Post
      The fans at Spa are amazing, the atmosphere is crazy.
      This x100. I lived in Germany and was fortunate to see both the German and Belgium GPs in 1990 - the Senna years. I camped at Spa and I had VIP boxes at Hockenheim. (my uncle was mayor of a town 15 miles from Hockenheim)

      Spa is an incredible experience, one that any serious F1 fan vacationing in Europe should try to do. My next opportunity to go to Spa did not pan out due to travel plans being derailed and keeping me in Italy longer than I wanted, that was '98, the year of rain and half the field being taken out in the first corner. I'm kinda glad I missed that. I have been to Montreal, Hockenheim 3x, Monza and Hungary - but Spa is my favorite by far.

      My next stop is Austria! I've seen the track in person, but not an F1 race.

    19. 11-30-2016 12:42 PM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by MaysEffect View Post
      Well here is a good comparison video, showing just how important downforce is compared to speed.


      The 2016 car was between 20-30kph faster on the straight. Yet, even on the Ultra soft tires, the 2011 car completely gained back all of the lost time by significantly better corner speed and control.

      Shows just how great the blown diffuser and downforce was on the 2011 cars. So the complaints about extra downforce and drag may not be such a bad thing if the turbo cars can keep some advantage in speed over the older cars.

      key points

      Turn 1 we can see the clear advantage the 2011 chassis has in the corners, carrying significantly more speed...

      Onto the 1st chicane... Again more corner speed, better chicane exit...and then...

      Down the First straight the V6T/H pulls like a train gaining around 25kph the entire straight. This is even before the DRS zone.

      More of the same before the 2nd DRS zone.

      Into Turn 17 after the long 15-17 complex we can see again the 2011 chassis blowing into the corner with greater accuracy and much higher entry speed. this speed advantage is kept all the way down to the apex and out through turn 18-19 before the v6T/H picks up power into turn 20...

      Then into the last corners 20-21 the 2011 chassis has such a huge Grip and Aero advantage and carries tremendous speed onto the start/finish


      If the 2017 cars can maintain the best of both worlds, lap times will be shattered. But we can see how difficult this is going to be. Carrying significantly more straight line speed and trying to keep it through the corners is going to be a workout.
      Wow May, you put a lot of work into that! With more grip and more down force, it will mean more "G" on the driver, they will et a workout on some tracks because of it.

      How crazy is first practice and first qualifying going to be next year as everyone will want to see who lost and who gained after the changes?

      I know that the reason these changes were made was to make lap times go down, to make the cars faster.
      But I have a question. Will these changes make the driver more or less of a factor? Old wisdom said that a car with less grip and less down force was more demanding to drive and the driver with the best "feel" would always prevail.

      They grapple with a somewhat similar dynamic in NASCAR with more rear wing/less rear wing on the big tracks.

    20. Member VW...vw...wv...WV's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 12:55 PM #45
      Agree on may's nice contribution.
      Do you remember that race in indy, dont really remember if it was champ car or indycar, but lots of drivers complained about lapsus of unconsciousness due to the high grip and speed reached (super high g forces) ?
      In f1 there are some curves that could generate some enormous g's...i bet drivers are already adjusting their physical preparation/regime for this.
      I'm guessing it will depend on the track itself if the driver would play a bigger part.
      Satan´s nopemares...

    21. Member Sump's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 01:04 PM #46
      Quote Originally Posted by VW...vw...wv...WV View Post
      Agree on may's nice contribution.
      Do you remember that race in indy, dont really remember if it was champ car or indycar, but lots of drivers complained about lapsus of unconsciousness due to the high grip and speed reached (super high g forces) ?
      In f1 there are some curves that could generate some enormous g's...i bet drivers are already adjusting their physical preparation/regime for this.
      I'm guessing it will depend on the track itself if the driver would play a bigger part.
      I dunno aren't the 2004 cars still the fastest we've had or will 2017 be faster lap times?

    22. Member ramylson's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 02:19 PM #47
      Quote Originally Posted by Sump View Post
      I dunno aren't the 2004 cars still the fastest we've had or will 2017 be faster lap times?
      Here's are breakdown from the 2016 Circuits, and their record laps:

      http://f1.wikia.com/wiki/Lap_Record

      "Due to limitations placed on F1 cars from the 2005 Formula One season, many Lap Records on current circuits are from the 2004 Formula One season."

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      11-30-2016 02:51 PM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by Sump View Post
      I dunno aren't the 2004 cars still the fastest we've had or will 2017 be faster lap times?
      It's really hard to compare the two. Rules and regulations made what we have now completely different to whatever was available in 2004.

      But on outright speed, the 2016 car is probably the fastest we've ever seen. If the cars had traction control alone,I'm sure ever record would have been shattered by now. Not to mention ABS some other banned tricks along the way and from 2004. The only argument for 2004 chassis is that the cars generally carried more fuel on qualifying laps, how many tenths that would add or not, we'll never know....

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      11-30-2016 03:04 PM #49
      Quote Originally Posted by ramylson View Post
      Here's are breakdown from the 2016 Circuits, and their record laps:

      http://f1.wikia.com/wiki/Lap_Record

      "Due to limitations placed on F1 cars from the 2005 Formula One season, many Lap Records on current circuits are from the 2004 Formula One season."
      I will never understand why lap times during the race is counted as the lap record when trying to depict what is truly the fastest ever time around a circuit.

    25. Member BluMagic's Avatar
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      11-30-2016 03:05 PM #50
      I wonder if Monaco will be better or worse for passing.

      Low speed turns and more mechanical grip make me think better, but the track is also narrow.

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