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    Thread: NEED HELP with 1.6TD in Samurai

    1. 11-12-2016 06:18 PM #1
      Hi, I am new to this forum, but not new to VW's or diesels. I have owned a couple 1.6TD Jetta's and many 1.9TDI Jetta's. I have been a mechanic for many years, work on all my own stuff, plus did a lot of semi-truck diesel repair, which does not necessarily help out a lot on these old 1.6TD. Anyways, I recently purchased a Suzuki Samurai with a VW 1.6TD/Acme conversion. I have been all over the rig, and it seems like everything was done right. It has been together and running for about 5K miles. The engine was completely rebuilt(I was told) and it seems to be true. No blowby, no oil usage, seems to run great, good power, only black smokes under heavy load/acceleration, will make 10PSI boost. I started looking in to it because of several things I have noticed, the major one being is that it is getting HORRIBLE fuel mileage. About 21-22MPG. I was expecting 35 MPG, and have seen reports of 40MPG with my same set up. I was told they took a complete engine out of a running car and rebuilt it, so everything should be matched together, and it seems so. By my best guess, the engine is out of about a 1986 Jetta, it has a mechanical head, 12MM head bolts, looks like the correct TD fuel pump and the correct wastegated turbo. So I started looking in to stuff, fuel pump seems set stock, has all the plugs and yellow seal marks on it. All the obvious stuff seems ok, and like I said, it has good power/runs good but it has a effective 5.25:1 rearend gear ratio, so anything would seem to have good power in a 2700 LB vehicle. My first thought was a timing belt/injection timing issue/error for a couple reasons, the obvious terrible fuel economy(I wouldn't think a good running 1.6TD would get as bad as 21MPG if you ran it wide open all the time) AND because the cold start/warm up lever has NO effect on how the engine runs(It is properly adjusted), my understanding is that lever advances the injection timing. So, I pulled the belt cover to first check that all the marks line up and I am having difficulty there, I can not find a timing mark on the cam gear anywhere, I can not use the flywheel mark to determine TDC, because it is now mated to a Suzuki transmission with a ACME flywheel. I was able to line up the injection pump mark correctly and verify that the tool locks in, the cam lobes looked like they were properly in the up position. I would think that if the cam was even one tooth off from TDC, the valves would hit, but I am not positive. It makes good boost, but you have to get it wound up to do it. It seems like the injection timing is retarded, could it be a full tooth off, or could it be retarded that bad on the plate? I know all the procedures, I just hate to tear half the motor apart for something that could be simple/nothing. Any help would be appreciated.

    2. Member
      Join Date
      Aug 5th, 2008
      Location
      Rapid City, SD
      Posts
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      A small army of Mk. II's and a IV....and 16 yo wife
      11-13-2016 12:25 AM #2
      No, you will not see any sort of timing mark on the cam gear because the cam/gear is infinitely adjustable. You should well know THIS if you have worked on VW diesels in the past.

      The distal end of the cam has a flat slot in it for timing purposes. You will need to buy some sort of manual to assist you if you do not know the procedure for setting one of these up..
      It will be imperative to determine tdc on the crankshaft somehow.....period. How you are now going to achieve this is...well...your problem.

      Yes, one of these engines will tolerate one tooth off.
      Two teeth....probably not. I was never so stupid as to try.

      You have totally relied on luck to make it this far. I suspect your nine lives are over.
      Probably better start thinking WITHIN the box.

      Edit: It is possible the fuel screw is turned up too much if you are getting mega-smoke. But, when that happens, you usually will not be able to idle the engine down to acceptable levels. I, personally, have no idea how far one of these samuri-vw love affairs will go on a gallon. They tend to sit high....have no aerodynamic-ness.....and run the horrendous final ratio....probably with heavy-lug tires. Go to vwdiesel.net and search "samuri" and see what you get.
      Last edited by Prairie; 11-13-2016 at 12:32 AM.
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    3. 11-13-2016 05:42 PM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by Prairie View Post
      No, you will not see any sort of timing mark on the cam gear because the cam/gear is infinitely adjustable. You should well know THIS if you have worked on VW diesels in the past.

      The distal end of the cam has a flat slot in it for timing purposes. You will need to buy some sort of manual to assist you if you do not know the procedure for setting one of these up..
      It will be imperative to determine tdc on the crankshaft somehow.....period. How you are now going to achieve this is...well...your problem.

      Yes, one of these engines will tolerate one tooth off.
      Two teeth....probably not. I was never so stupid as to try.

      You have totally relied on luck to make it this far. I suspect your nine lives are over.
      Probably better start thinking WITHIN the box.

      Edit: It is possible the fuel screw is turned up too much if you are getting mega-smoke. But, when that happens, you usually will not be able to idle the engine down to acceptable levels. I, personally, have no idea how far one of these samuri-vw love affairs will go on a gallon. They tend to sit high....have no aerodynamic-ness.....and run the horrendous final ratio....probably with heavy-lug tires. Go to vwdiesel.net and search "samuri" and see what you get.
      Let me repeat the fact is that I bought it this way, and I do have the Chilton manual for this engine, and I knew the 1.9TDI cam gear was infinitely adjustable as you say, however I thought the 1.6TD was keyed. I did some more research and it turns out that the ACME flywheel is marked to use the stock Suzuki timing hole on the trans. So I started checking to find it today, it is there, but the it turns out the cam is retarded just enough to put the timing mark out of the window when you lock the back of the cam and pin the pump. The cam gear bolt was barely tight, my guess is that the cam has slipped about 1/2 tooth. New timing belt kit on the way from Amazon and hopefully it should be right as rain when properly put back together.

    4. Semi-n00b
      Join Date
      Jan 24th, 2014
      Location
      BC Canada
      Posts
      12
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      1995 Golf and assorted TD engines
      01-09-2017 11:48 PM #4
      Tell us more about the samurai..........
      Is it stock, or lifted, modified gearing, much extra weight added, and on larger-than-stock tires, like 31's?
      If it has suspension mods with 31's or larger tires, your mileage isn't too far off the mark, considering the aerodynamics of a lifted zuk.

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