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    View Poll Results: Do you believe you should be liable for a ticket if you leave your car idling in your driveway?

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    Thread: Do you believe you should be liable for a ticket if you leave your car idling in your driveway?

    1. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 05:17 PM #51
      Quote Originally Posted by 2 doors View Post
      What does the law say about it where you live? That will determine whether on not you are "liable" for a ticket.
      This. If it's illegal, yeah. If not, no.

      All kinds of reasons it might be illegal. Theft potential (== more work for the police), etc etc.

    2. Member Galrot's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 05:23 PM #52
      Quote Originally Posted by dunhamjr View Post
      as mentioned above.

      wouldnt it also be polluting the exact same amount to just sit in the car with it running?
      what about the pollution caused by forgetting something and needing to make multiple trips?
      or the pollution caused by simply going to the store 3 times per week instead of once?
      Yes, you would. I do not think idling in general should be allowed nor is it here.

      A trip to the store or forgetting something do not produce pollution by itself. If you are driving there it does of course, but I do believe that people should live in such a way that these trips could and are mostly taken with either public transportation, by walking or cycling.

      Quote Originally Posted by dunhamjr View Post
      this fine ISNT about the pollution prevention in pretty much all instances (obviously there are always some small amount of exceptions).

      if they honestly want to prevent pollution then they need to ban ICE vehicles completely. the amount of pollution from unattended idling cars is much smaller than the overall ICE pollution numbers no matter what time frame or location you select.
      Then what is it about? I suspect the revenue they get from the fine is absolutely miniscule.

      And our (the Norwegian one) government have as a goal to stop the sales of new ICE vehicles after 2025 and they in general are trying incentive people to either switch to electric cars or biking.

    3. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 05:27 PM #53
      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      That's such a lame excuse. Ever had to drive back to the office because you forgot something? Oh my god I can't believe you'd be so selfish. That's my air too!

      You forgot your lunch today. Do you A: pollute into my atmosphere more to drive to the store, B: DoorDash food and have someone else pollute into my air to your request, or C: starve. I hope you'll starve before you hurt Earths atmosphere.
      There is not a eyeroll gif that rolls its eyes hard enough for this.

      Ever taken a **** in the woods while backpacking? No reason not to **** in the street every day!

      Ever driven across country? Well then I outta just throw a brick on my accelerator and burn off 3000mi worth of gas in neutral every day!

      There's a counter-argument to every possible regulation. The question is not "can you come up with a stupid straw man argument reason not to regulate anything, ever?" The question is more like "is this something not desirable, can we reasonably create a restriction that might solve the problem without undue consequences to others, unintended consequences, and so on?"

      I'm a huge fan of being *extremely* careful when we regulate things. I don't have a strong opinion pro- or anti-idling. But for some reason the counter-arguments are always so unimaginative. We get it, you should be able to do whatever you want, whenever you want, at whatever cost to others, just because you're a special snowflake.

    4. Member titleist1976's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 05:37 PM #54
      Quote Originally Posted by smoothsix View Post
      There is not a eyeroll gif that rolls its eyes hard enough for this.

      Ever taken a **** in the woods while backpacking? No reason not to **** in the street every day!

      Ever driven across country? Well then I outta just throw a brick on my accelerator and burn off 3000mi worth of gas in neutral every day!

      There's a counter-argument to every possible regulation. The question is not "can you come up with a stupid straw man argument reason not to regulate anything, ever?" The question is more like "is this something not desirable, can we reasonably create a restriction that might solve the problem without undue consequences to others, unintended consequences, and so on?"

      I'm a huge fan of being *extremely* careful when we regulate things. I don't have a strong opinion pro- or anti-idling. But for some reason the counter-arguments are always so unimaginative. We get it, you should be able to do whatever you want, whenever you want, at whatever cost to others, just because you're a special snowflake.
      I think he was being facetious.

      I live in CA - where it doesn't actually get cold too often. So yeah, I think there should be fines for stupidity. If I lived in the frozen tundra, I'd be way more lenient about it.

    5. A beautiful Summer's Eve Sold Over Sticker's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 05:40 PM #55
      Quote Originally Posted by smoothsix View Post
      There is not a eyeroll gif that rolls its eyes hard enough for this.

      Ever taken a **** in the woods while backpacking? No reason not to **** in the street every day!

      Ever driven across country? Well then I outta just throw a brick on my accelerator and burn off 3000mi worth of gas in neutral every day!

      There's a counter-argument to every possible regulation. The question is not "can you come up with a stupid straw man argument reason not to regulate anything, ever?" The question is more like "is this something not desirable, can we reasonably create a restriction that might solve the problem without undue consequences to others, unintended consequences, and so on?"

      I'm a huge fan of being *extremely* careful when we regulate things. I don't have a strong opinion pro- or anti-idling. But for some reason the counter-arguments are always so unimaginative. We get it, you should be able to do whatever you want, whenever you want, at whatever cost to others, just because you're a special snowflake.
      Man, that eye roll was so long, so slow, and full of such ire that I heard the scraping sound from Belmont.

      I guess my sarcastic petulance was missed on you. I was in no way serious. I felt he made a rather ridiculous point, so I had a little fun with him. He got sarcastic, so I got sarcastic.

      I agree with you. I don't think regulating common sense is the best way to go, but you can't assume the common person to have any sense. Letting a car idle for a few minutes in your driveway as a whole strikes me as "Are we really this bored that rather than getting annoyed with the cop, we're discussing the environmental impact of it?" Alas, it does in fact seem that we're that bored.
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      01-11-2017 06:18 PM #56
      Quote Originally Posted by PlatinumGLS View Post
      I am sure there is no restriction on looking inside through the windows and/or confirming if it is locked or not.
      Having such an intimate knowledge on door lock knob length is quite impressive. But what happens when there isn't a knob, what if it is a door lock slot?
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    7. Member dmorrow's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 06:30 PM #57
      Quote Originally Posted by 2 doors View Post
      What does the law say about it where you live? That will determine whether on not you are "liable" for a ticket.
      This. You are liable when you break the law, if you don't like the law you can change it or move. Debating whether you agree with the law won't change anything.

      I personally think idling is a waste of gas and adds to pollution, for close to no benefit, and don't do it. If I can walk to the cold car I can also ride in it for a mile or two until it warms up.

    8. Member PlatinumGLS's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 06:31 PM #58
      Quote Originally Posted by Silly_me View Post
      Having such an intimate knowledge on door lock knob length is quite impressive. But what happens when there isn't a knob, what if it is a door lock slot?
      They probably try the handle. I personally think it is an overreach but is likely within the law.

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      01-11-2017 06:47 PM #59
      Quote Originally Posted by PlatinumGLS View Post
      They probably try the handle. I personally think it is an overreach but is likely within the law.
      What happens if they tug on my handle, but it is locked, and the force of the failure to open causes the cop to slip on the ice in my drive and fall, is that still on me?
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    10. Member MatchStick's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 06:57 PM #60
      Forget warming up your car. Imagine, you're relaxing in your hammock on a nice summer day, beer in hand, almost asleep and a delivery truck shows up at your neighbor's house and they leave it idling for an hour in their driveway or on the street. You can't have it both ways. So in the winter, you're cold for a mile or two. BFD.

    11. Member l88m22vette's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 07:54 PM #61
      Quote Originally Posted by PlatinumGLS View Post
      I am sure there is no restriction on looking inside through the windows and/or confirming if it is locked or not.
      Even on private property? How about if I ask them nicely to take a hike? With everything going on in the country, someone letting their car idle for a few minutes to reduce engine wear, clear the windows so they can see, and improve how the car works is just about the smallest plankton in the sea. On a public street, sure, if only because of technical jurisdiction, but giving me a ticket on private property because I didn't jump in my car and drive away in 5* weather is wrong and feels like a money gouge more than anything. Seems to me they should have to do the same thing, considering they uphold the law and are supposed to be setting the example.

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    12. Member PlatinumGLS's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 08:10 PM #62
      Quote Originally Posted by Silly_me View Post
      What happens if they tug on my handle, but it is locked, and the force of the failure to open causes the cop to slip on the ice in my drive and fall, is that still on me?
      Quote Originally Posted by l88m22vette View Post
      Even on private property? How about if I ask them nicely to take a hike? With everything going on in the country, someone letting their car idle for a few minutes to reduce engine wear, clear the windows so they can see, and improve how the car works is just about the smallest plankton in the sea. On a public street, sure, if only because of technical jurisdiction, but giving me a ticket on private property because I didn't jump in my car and drive away in 5* weather is wrong and feels like a money gouge more than anything. Seems to me they should have to do the same thing, considering they uphold the law and are supposed to be setting the example.

      Oh, right, do as I say, not as I do. Got it!
      To be clear, even if lawful, I think it is ridiculous....

    13. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 08:41 PM #63
      Quote Originally Posted by Sold Over Sticker View Post
      Man, that eye roll was so long, so slow, and full of such ire that I heard the scraping sound from Belmont.
      Well, I'm only off behind the Oracle towers, so it's not really that far.

      I read both your post and AtoZ's posts but didn't remember the full context of AtoZ's and probably skimmed yours a little too quickly. I should have realized it was a little TOO easy

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      01-11-2017 08:42 PM #64
      Quote Originally Posted by PlatinumGLS View Post
      To be clear, even if lawful, I think it is ridiculous....
      Um....no. I saw your blog Idling Cars Matter, and the monsters that own them You aren't fooling anyone
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    15. Senior Member Iroczgirl's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 08:49 PM #65
      And here I thought idling laws only applied to draw bridges.

      Anyway, my driveway is private property. So as long as I pay my taxes, I'll idle as much as I want. Not that I do, unless the truck is covered in snow or ice.
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      01-11-2017 09:39 PM #66
      Quote Originally Posted by Iroczgirl View Post
      And here I thought idling laws only applied to draw bridges.

      Anyway, my driveway is private property. So as long as I pay my taxes, I'll idle as much as I want. Not that I do, unless the truck is covered in snow or ice.
      Problem there is as private as your driveway may be thieves don't give a blank about that. I'm totally surprised that even on this message board there's so little concern for your pride and joy falling into the wrong hands.
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      01-11-2017 10:01 PM #67
      I guess I should be careful bringing a car up to temp in the driveway to do any cooling system troubleshooting from now on.

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      01-11-2017 10:03 PM #68
      Quote Originally Posted by Iroczgirl View Post
      And here I thought idling laws only applied to draw bridges.

      Anyway, my driveway is private property. So as long as I pay my taxes, I'll idle as much as I want. Not that I do, unless the truck is covered in snow or ice.
      Exactly. And if a law enforcement officer wants to wander onto my property and cite me then I very much take issue with that.

      Quote Originally Posted by Carson Fiber View Post
      Problem there is as private as your driveway may be thieves don't give a blank about that. I'm totally surprised that even on this message board there's so little concern for your pride and joy falling into the wrong hands.
      Maybe some of us live in peace, and we aren't constantly threatened by the possibility of foul play?
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    19. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 10:39 PM #69
      Quote Originally Posted by patrikman View Post
      Exactly. And if a law enforcement officer wants to wander onto my property and cite me then I very much take issue with that.
      My wife got a ticket for expired registration, while parked in our driveway. I was floored that it was legal.

      Looked it up, sure enough, if it's visible from the street, ticket. If only she backed the car into the driveway...

      I agree with your sentiment about people being too damn paranoid, though. Dash cams, guns, fear FEAR FEAR.

    20. Geriatric Member J-Tim's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 10:49 PM #70
      Quote Originally Posted by patrikman View Post
      To whom it may concern:
      I think it's none of your damned business how long my car(s) idle in the driveway in the winter. You should be happy you don't have to listen to the 3" on the Baja in the cold.

      Sincerely yours, homeowner
      You're already doing more than enough damage to our home even without leaving your car running idle.
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      01-11-2017 10:51 PM #71
      Quote Originally Posted by J-Tim View Post
      You're already doing more than enough damage to our home even without leaving your car running idle.
      What does that mean?
      Quote Originally Posted by Code Red! View Post
      Why does a guy trying to shove a water bottle up his ass have anything to do with the Bay area and helping it sustain itsel.....wait nevermind.

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      01-11-2017 10:58 PM #72
      those who say idling a car to warm it up should never be done have never lived somewhere where windchills regularly hit -20 to -30 and sometimes -40.

      start your car in that - the car literally screams and howls, and the steering is frozen stiff - you could do real damage to the vehicle by not allowing it to warm up.

      in fact back in the hydraulic steering days, doing exactly this resulted in a power steering pump failure.

      as for those who cant lock the car running with the spare key, that sucks. modern vws wont let you but my lowly simple ford will, thank god.

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      01-11-2017 11:26 PM #73
      Quote Originally Posted by smoothsix View Post
      My wife got a ticket for expired registration, while parked in our driveway.
      lol that's some impressive omnipotence fail, even my county clerk knows when I'm paying taxes on a car I have no intention on registering for the street though..... that could be a KY thing. We do love our lawn jewelry.
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    24. Geriatric Member J-Tim's Avatar
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      01-11-2017 11:40 PM #74
      Quote Originally Posted by patrikman View Post
      What does that mean?
      Stop spewing crap into our atmosphere unless you really have no choice.

      Makes sense now ?
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      01-11-2017 11:49 PM #75
      Quote Originally Posted by J-Tim View Post
      Stop spewing crap into our atmosphere unless you really have no choice.

      Makes sense now ?
      Not quite enough. You said I'm doing enough damage without idling. What's does that mean? Is it because of what I drive?
      Quote Originally Posted by Code Red! View Post
      Why does a guy trying to shove a water bottle up his ass have anything to do with the Bay area and helping it sustain itsel.....wait nevermind.

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