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So, realistically, how do we (and the organizers) improve the show?

31K views 208 replies 103 participants last post by  UnD3adDragon 
#1 ·
I see a lot of complaints so far this year, about venue, organization, etc., but few ideas on how to improve things moving forward. It would seem Ocean Downs is over as a venue for the event, so let's forget that. The school was meh, and we probably won't be back there. This place (Fort Whaley) had/has potential, but the traffic issue may kill it. So what are our alternatives?

I doubt inlet is viable, not large enough. And this time of year it's in use for some event nearly every week.

Convention Center certainly isn't big enough.

Jay has discussed buying property, but having 50+ acres for one weekend a year is expensive and probably not viable unless he can develop it to be multi-use, and even then traffic may be an issue. And finding that much land that's open and zoned for this sort of thing in Worcester County may be a near impossibility.

So, good people of Vortex, what suggestions have you? Would Salisbury be too far away? Ballfield/Winterplace park are big enough but 30 minutes out.

Getting Town of Ocean City on board would be huge, but Mayor Meehan and his staff and the council don't really like us, so that would be difficult at best.

Honestly, I'm at a loss. I know from talking to Shoup that he does truly care about H2Oi, but it's got to be a real headache at this point for him. I'm not sure what we can do as a community to help with the actual logistics of location and staff, but a huge help would be ending the stupid crap (theft, destruction of property, screaming and yelling and asshattery). I know we'd be in a lot better spot with local authorities if this sort of behavior hadn't become so prominent.

Anyone have any realistic comments/suggestions? I know Cory/Jay will see this, so perhaps some good will come of the discussion. I just hate to see all this negative without some input into fixing it.
 
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#2 ·
its not going to get better until its gets worse

this year seemed poorly planned i know when i went saturday it wasnt bad but there was no one directing you where to park so i ended up just driving though and leaving

i know a lot of condo places and hotels were turning people away/canceling reservations this year

i think the police presence this year was GREAT it really helps clean out the stupid

as far as the place to actually hold the show thats a tough one the campground seemed ok until that horrendous traffic jam and the turning people away but that might help people not go next year it was CRAZY down there this year, i think having it further away would weed out more people, i will be honest here and say while i support the show i honestly dont go for the show i go to see people who i rarely if ever get to see and spend good time with good friends in a relaxed enviorment
 
#3 ·
My .02
The trash people leave behind is absolutely apauling/ridiculous.
Not only where large masses of people Gather but even the smaller group Of people watching the "traffic" people leave so much destruction.. Looks like Zombie land on Sunday (lmao)

I don't think te Venue is all the bad however the racetrack was by far the best
Also the amount of people seem to be doubling like Gremlins in the rain.
 
#4 ·
Traffic was the biggest issue, and maybe placement of vendors as well(on pavement they, and we, are better off).

I think a big problem is how a lot of young (15-25) people think it's a huge party weekend where they can be assh*les. don't get me wrong, I like to party down there, but some people are going totally insane.

I know the weekend draws people who aren't really into cars too, and they're the worst offenders. I'm 23, and I've heard numerous people who aren't car people talk about going for the party. They have no stake in it, so their actions don't matter as far as they're concerned so long as they aren't jailed. I'm not sure how to get them gone.

I feel like the poster above talking about weeding people out is a bad idea. We want the true enthusiasts and not a bunch of assclowns, but at what point does weeding people out also weed out true enthusiasts? That's a tough thing to do and not mess things up.
 
#7 ·
I'll agree with this. I had a great time this year, but I unfortunately get thrown into the 'younger kid' category (I'm 20). The kids that were acting out and doing stupid **** bothers me. I had a good time and enjoyed my time there as I did last year, but with an event this big it's almost impossible to keep those kind of people away.

Also, I noticed a bigger presence of non-VAG cars this year than last, which I'm not a big fan of.

As far as the venue, I liked last years layout better, even though it was muddy. That being said, last year was my first year, so I don't know how the racetrack or other places were. And the whole $20 to get in thing is bogus when you could have parked on the side of the highway and walked right in.

Police presence was good too. Got some trashy people and their gay cars off the street.
 
#6 ·
I didn't think the venue was bad at all. The parking was veal mostly because people were not well directed in where they could park. Many people parked poorly and didn't cram their cars in tight to allow for more cars.


I was dissapointed that there wasn't much of a used parts swap meet. The vendor layout was poorly layer out also. But how much of that was from the crappy wet ground or just the vendors setting up wherever they wanted to?
 
#188 ·
I was dissapointed that there wasn't much of a used parts swap meet. The vendor layout was poorly layer out also. But how much of that was from the crappy wet ground or just the vendors setting up wherever they wanted to?
My apologies if this has been answered, but it was half and half. There were lines laid out for rows, but the scale was a bit off, so things started off tighter than they should have been. The primary issue was the rain and soft ground. I know the Air Lift guys got stuck trying to get their trailer into place on Friday, so from there on out it was a case of trying to get everything in where it was supposed to be, but the mud-bog pretty much prevented that.
 
#8 ·
Agreeing on the whole, "Let's get wasted and act like douchebags so we get lots of attention" crowd. Whatever, have a good time and party... but when people start throwing beer cans at passing cars or leaning into cars' windows and grabbing at the car when someone is trying to park and using "oh he's f'd up" as an excuse? Get real and grow up people. That'd be a huge help in making the show better. /endrant

Otherwise, my only real issue is the lack of water at the show. I couldn't find any at around 2:30/3pm- even looked in the general store. I'm pregnant so that was kind of a major issue. A vendor was nice enough to give my husband a bottle for me, but that really needs to be taken care of next year. (I realize I could have brought a cooler, but really didn't think finding a bottle of water would be a problem).
 
#11 ·
I agree. Also I would add that yes, the convention center may not be as big, however, most people, knowing its gonna be a cluster to drive in are most likely going to walk, scooter, bike or whatever to get there.if my hotel is like 15-20 blocks away, I would much prefer to walk there and see the show rather than deal with looking for parking. I think the fact that the Convention center is IN town provides a flexibility that may outweigh the fact its smaller and may work out beautifully. And maybe the convention center and its lot should be reserved for participating cars and vendors only - no spectator parking as the spectators are already parked somewhere in the vicinity anyway. Then again i've never organized a show this big, so i'm looking at it only from the perspective of a spectator :)
 
#10 · (Edited)
The camp ground was pretty good. I liked the setting. Not too bad on lowered vehicles. What did not work was the one entrance/exit. Nothing was marked for a single direction of traffic flow. Cars going in and out on the same roads. A lot of cars were trying to make turns that did not make sense and really halted the flow of traffic. Also, pedestrians had to cross the main flow of traffic to get to the show from the parking. Or to get from venders to the show.

There was a lot of wasted space in the parking area. With benches, buildings and whatever, people parked in weird angles, taking up more space than needed. I think it could be better if the show cars were in the camping area (Where they like to spread out and "set up" anyhow) and the parking out in the field where the show cars were this year. This is a double edged sword, though. Grass fields are not good parking lots for a group of lowered, front wheel drive cars.

I still don't think there was enough room to park the amount of spectators.

I think a better flowing, well marked and guided traffic flow inside the camp will help greatly. As well as specific paths for spectators to get from parking to the show.

Off topic, but yes..The number of non VAG cars everywhere did not help. They were there seemingly only to destroy what we have built. Every public G2G was quickly invaded. And shortly after, hot-rodding and burnouts by non VAG attendees put the event to an abrupt halt. I barely saw any VAG vehicles start any heavy commotion. It was always another import or domestic causing the commotion.

We may just have to plan meets away from the strip and find new, more scenic or secluded areas. Keep our side events more secretive. The poor "R" meet was SWAMPED! I walked into a store before the event and came back out to a parking lot stormed by people yelling and all sorts of tuner cars parked everywhere. :eek:
And a few R's scatted in the mess, not knowing where the rest of the group they were supposed to meet were at. Same went for the Forced induction meet, though the smaller area helped there to keep a lot of the riff-raff out. But there was still a steady flow of people turning into the event and ended up just stuck in a loop of traffic inside the event.

We have got to get this back to a VAG event. If "they" don't know where we are, they won't come.
 
#12 ·
Last year the 2 biggest complaints were the mud and lack of trash cans.

I understand the weather is out of anyone's control. but how often does it rain on this weekend. plan for it and don't make the highest traffic areas on grass.

As for the trash they did improve from last year. i saw about a half dozen trash cans.



The main issue i saw this was the orange and neon yellow "staff". They were idiots and did know what the **** to be doing. When i got there this morning they told me to drive that way and park somewhere. No wonder there wasn't parking spaces available, no body told anyone where to park.
 
#17 ·
FV-QR

I think the convention center would never work. Ocean City doesn't want us there to begin with so why would they support the idea of us having our show in their town? Besides the I think traffic would back up all the way down coastal highway.

I didn't mind this years venue. I was there early so I didn't encounter the traffic coming in, but when I pulled in to park, I had 3 staff members tell me to park in 3 different places. First guy tells me where to park and as I'm going to park there another staff member asks where I was going and that I had to park somewhere else then as I was going to that spot I had another staff member again tell me I was going in the wrong spot. Organization definitely needs to be worked on.
 
#18 ·
FWIW I just spoke to my grandmother who made a trip to the Downs for some gambling today. I asked how many people were there, kind of prodding to see about the viability of our return (unlikely I know). Her words: "I mean there were people there, but not any great crowds. It wasn't busy by any means."

I know it's damned near a pipe dream, but returning to Ocean Downs would mean a return to normal. One can hope.
 
#20 ·
I will approach this in a way that I have had belief in for quite a few years now. I for one would love love love to see the streets hold the show. I agree at this point it may be a far cry to get the mayor, townspeople and businesses on board, but by god it would be most definitely worth while to try.

Lets face it. Everyone is already in town for the event. And trying to hundreds or thousands of cars OUT of Ocean City at the exact same time, to be in the exact same place has proven to be the largest headache of all. At least in my 8 years of going down there. So why not bring the show to the people, instead of making the people drive to the show? Street vendors, restaurant and bar specials, live entertainment, and keep it contained to just the streets specifically for show traffic and pedestrians. Model it much like large bike rallys or hot rod events. People are already on the streets, so why not use it to our advantage.

Jay and the staff of H2Oi at least in my opinion have done an outstanding job with planning and working with what they have been delt. I mean, your talking about organizing an event to accommodate 10s of thousands of people, in a city who doesn't understand us, and at least attempt to keep most people on both ends happy. That takes some balls if you ask me. I would love to see 9 out of every 10 people who bitch about the weekend to do better. They need to think before they open their mouth and be grateful for what it is to begin with.

Maybe the police do get a little out of bounds, but can you honestly blame them? If your breaking the law, you KNOW your going to get pulled over, so why do it? So they dont let you stand in herds on the sidewalks, you blame them? All it takes is one dickbag to pop a curb and that entire group is laid up in the closest hospital. They are simply doing their jobs, do not blame them for your stupidity.

We as individuals are ruining the event, not Jay and his staff. Look what it used to be. HOOTERS used to be the place to be. Every night they welcomed us. But they were just like every other place. They only allowed us to get away with so much **** until it became a liability on them. Why keep helping us when all they got in return was a trashed parking lot and unhappy regular customers? Is it really that hard to leave your mothers house for one weekend a year and at least make an attempt to pick up your own garbage? If its too much to expect, then maybe you all should start packing your mother and bringing her along to pick up after you. Maybe then we would be able to reuse parking lots year after year.

I realize none of this is ever going to happen. Hell for all we know OC may just despise us all together after this years **** show. But one can always hope right?
 
#164 ·
I will approach this in a way that I have had belief in for quite a few years now. I for one would love love love to see the streets hold the show. I agree at this point it may be a far cry to get the mayor, townspeople and businesses on board, but by god it would be most definitely worth while to try.

Lets face it. Everyone is already in town for the event. And trying to hundreds or thousands of cars OUT of Ocean City at the exact same time, to be in the exact same place has proven to be the largest headache of all. At least in my 8 years of going down there. So why not bring the show to the people, instead of making the people drive to the show? Street vendors, restaurant and bar specials, live entertainment, and keep it contained to just the streets specifically for show traffic and pedestrians. Model it much like large bike rallys or hot rod events. People are already on the streets, so why not use it to our advantage.

Jay and the staff of H2Oi at least in my opinion have done an outstanding job with planning and working with what they have been delt. I mean, your talking about organizing an event to accommodate 10s of thousands of people, in a city who doesn't understand us, and at least attempt to keep most people on both ends happy. That takes some balls if you ask me. I would love to see 9 out of every 10 people who bitch about the weekend to do better. They need to think before they open their mouth and be grateful for what it is to begin with.

Maybe the police do get a little out of bounds, but can you honestly blame them? If your breaking the law, you KNOW your going to get pulled over, so why do it? So they dont let you stand in herds on the sidewalks, you blame them? All it takes is one dickbag to pop a curb and that entire group is laid up in the closest hospital. They are simply doing their jobs, do not blame them for your stupidity.

We as individuals are ruining the event, not Jay and his staff. Look what it used to be. HOOTERS used to be the place to be. Every night they welcomed us. But they were just like every other place. They only allowed us to get away with so much **** until it became a liability on them. Why keep helping us when all they got in return was a trashed parking lot and unhappy regular customers? Is it really that hard to leave your mothers house for one weekend a year and at least make an attempt to pick up your own garbage? If its too much to expect, then maybe you all should start packing your mother and bringing her along to pick up after you. Maybe then we would be able to reuse parking lots year after year.
This. Couldn't agree more.
 
#21 ·
Another suggestion, if you would.. this event is always so much later in the season and the vacationing crowd is usually at least somewhat cleared out unless for sunfest. Why not make an attempt to get the boardwalk on board for the show?? Use the boardwalk and the adjoining allys and streets. That way ALL the vw traffic would be off the main streets and highways. But once again, that would require OC to be on board. But with it being that late in the season, maybe the idea of kicking up some last minute boardwalk business may just catch their attention? Use the inlet area for vendors, main stage, specator parking and top dawg right at the beginning of the boardwalk and have show cars fill in from there. Maybe its just me but it soulds like a half decent venue in my opinion
 
#23 ·
Anyone considered, even briefly, the idea of having the show someplace else BESIDES Ocean City MD?

OCMD city gov't, law enforcement, and even some businesses around town have made it more than clear they don't want the show in their town. Simple enough.

I'm saying their are many other resort / vacation towns on the coast within a couple hours of OCMD. Anywhere from Atlantic City south to Virgina Beach or even Surf City NC. If OCMD doesn't want us maybe somebody else would be business - savvy enough to recognize money when they see it.
 
#24 ·
Like already stated vendor area and the parking issue.

Same thing happened to us, they took our money and pointed us in the direction to park after that we were on our own to figure it out. We had to hit multiple areas before finding a spot. There were cars that if parked "correctly" could have fit 3 in the space.

The vendor area was a jumble, no kind of organization or rows set up at all. Then you had that huge unused space in the center behind the Top Dawg cars. :confused:
 
#25 ·
I agree with everyone talking about the vendors! I wanted an official H2o shirt and no one could tell me where to get one not even staff people???? That's because they were at the outside of the show exiting! They should have been right in front of the bathrooms(that strip not literally in front of the bathroom) I'd say 100% of people went that way. I like the area minus all the mud because let's face it, it rains ever damn H2o and this being the driest one in 2 or 3 years that is a big concern. People don't want to get there show cars covered in mud or stuck nor sink in it while looking around. As far as side goes there's no way to determin the amount of people are going to be there it gets bigger on year to the next sometimes smaller but it's a tough thing to judge.
End rant/
 
#26 · (Edited)
I felt this year went very well. I drove right into the show, was promptly parked and had a great time walking around. There was some mud yes, but oh well. Walk around it. As far as the traffic goes, in my mind there wouldn't have been any/minimal backups if people weren't rear ending each other. People to need to pay more attention. An unfortunately I know this all too well, as I was plowed into by a mk4 at waterfest two years ago. Some kids just handle the nice cars around them while driving.
 
#27 ·
A suggestion for next year for the group as a whole... Dont get on here and post how mad you are about the punks trashing parking lots etc, if you didnt say anything to them. I see someone let trash behind so i give them a bag of ****, next i know i have 50+ people looking at me like im captain killjoy bc im a responsible human being. The start to get back on OC's good side would be to get control of the asshats and make them realize they are not welcome. Im not sayin get in someones face, but if a large crowd points out together that an individual, or small group is/are acting stupid and are unwelcome, they will leave.
 
#29 ·
But the overall problem is that it isn't just one person, or one specific group of people making the mess.. If even half of the people in one of the gathering parking lots lets one or 2 pieces of trash, that adds up to hundreds of pieces by nights end. Stepping up and picking up after people, yea thats great, but there are people lingering around lots till who knows what time in the morning in some sports. Unless your one of the last to leave somewhere, the efforts would be pointless. The people who do care about this event aren't there to babysit.

It should be common sense to pick up after yourself. Half the kids down there make room for at the least a case of beer and a few pairs of underwear for the weekend. Take an extra plastic bag from your walmart trip and if you have something to drink instead of throwing it on the ground when you leave, put it in the damn bag and throw it away at the hotel if your too lazy to walk to the end of the parking lot to put it in the trash can. I really don't understand how its too much to ask out of a group of "adults"?



And if you really think about it. Ocean City is the perfect venue to hold this event. Where would you move it? You really think your just going to change cities and its going to b a cake walk to still try to get 2 thousand cars in the same spot at the exact same time? People attend H2O because its an all in one. A convenient weekend drive, the beach, great food, and there is so much other stuff to do around the area. Hell you could really show up on friday, park your car and technically not move it again till sunday because so much is just right along the strip. There are very few other places that would actually be able to handle such a crowd and keep it the little bit under control that it is. At least there the main focus can be on 2 or 3 highways rather than spreading it through an entire city.
 
#30 ·
so for location.. clearly there doesnt seem to be anywhere with a large enough paved area to work, so ****'s gonna have to be off-road...

Anyone know how busy (or big) "Bunting's Field Airport" is? It's a privately owned airport, with one (or two, if you believe the FAA website about it) turf runways. Seems pretty big from google maps; and is located on a side road off of 113...

http://goo.gl/maps/ZrfRE

FAA site says it's privately owned, and my guess would be that it's where the small planes that fly up and down the coast with ad banners take off and land from; so might not be heavily used at all during H20 time. And the turf on the runway itself is bound to be compacted as ****.

There's another one that shows as having a longer runway, and looks to have a much larger surrounding area (hard to tell what the field around it is like from the map though; also privately owned... Carey Field. also a bit further out/harder to get to..

http://goo.gl/maps/MIDqu

These probably aren't real good locations, but I thought i'd post them up in case they happened to be worth the H2O people looking into...
 
#33 ·
My only true "complaint" was the organization of cars at the show. It was a cluster-cuff, I wanted to get some nice pics of like a row of MK 1's or R's etc. but everything was scattered everywhere and looked awful. I know why they weren't all together.... for judging but it just takes away from the show.
 
#35 ·
Everyone would have to be 21+ for it to be at Ocean Downs though, yes?
 
#38 ·
Asshats will be asshats, not much you can do there.
I thought the venue was very nice, lots of room. I just think they need to use the space more efficiently. Hopefully some lessons were learned. A friend of mine mentioned Dale st being blocked off and people being turned away to Jay while he was cruising around on his scooter and he had no idea this was happening so in my opinion he had nothing to do with this. Again, I saw lots of double parked cars and empty space while the side of the highway was becoming a parking lot. I would not be pleased if i was Shoup as thats alot of lost revenue.
The judging seemed choatic at best. I saw one car get judged twice while i stood beside it in 5 mins. This "format "of judging and mixed car parking was sub par. Agreed that the event staff need more direction, after paying to get in they seemed to be nowhere in site.
I would be very interested to know just how many people showed up this year. The OC seemed pretty busy and there was no sunfest people here.
 
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