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Hey guys,seems I have run myself into a jam and would like some advice as to what would be the best way of mating a 20V head onto a TDi block.I made that jump from the ABA 20V because I no longer needed an Intermediate shaft and to mount the ABA into an A4 would require custom engine mount brackets along with other bs which didnt look too appealing to me.The A4 engine mount brackets bolt fine to the TDi block but it appears I have run myself into a couple of issues.

* 1. The ALH TDi Block uses a 12mm x 115mm head bolt where as the AWP (same generation block) uses a 10mm.I have emailed raceware in the hopes that they could custom make a set for me so I am keeping my fingers crossed pertaining to that aspect of this project.

* 2. If you look @ the mage below of the 20V head you will notice that it has only 2 oil return ports on the intake manifold side where as on the TDi block they are 3.I am a bit skeptical to weld a cast iron block internally so below is a poll which I have set up to help me decide which would be more economical to go through with.
Now I am willing to exhaust all options in order to use the TDi block as it is a 236mm block and is just a much cleaner unit to work with.

AEB 20V Head:

1.9 TDi Block on Raceware Headstuds (courtesy of homegrownmotorsports)




Modified by Issam Abed at 9:40 PM 8-29-2009

Weld up the Cast Block & Deck it (88%, 15 votes)

Open the oil return ports on the head (11%, 2 votes)

FUKSDS OLD AS DIRT

- As for the Head Studs. You mentioned AEB then you mentioned AWP. Which one are you using? Becuase iirc, the AEB uses 11mm Head bolts where the rest of the 20v's use the 10mm.

I am not sure there is enough meat or room to go messing with the head to accommotate larger Studs/Nuts. The AEB is very tight in this regard.

Ideally, a custom set of studs than neck down to accommodate the head would be the best option.

Shawn

My G60 on MSnS-e | 2020 Timing Belts | 4Cyl Torque Plate Rental | 02M Mounts

Helicoil and timesert are 2, I'm sure there are others

I almost mentionend Helicoils but didn't. Not becuase they aren't strong enough, but mainly becuase it will likely be hard finding some with the thread length necessary. Two coils in one hole might cause some problems with binding and such and I wouln't do it. If you can find long enough ones, I would consider this a Viable option.

Shawn

My G60 on MSnS-e | 2020 Timing Belts | 4Cyl Torque Plate Rental | 02M Mounts

"... freedom is sometimes simply another perspective away..." -Kutless

Futrell Autowerks

Quote, originally posted by CrazyMonkey »

I almost suggested the same thing. Perhaps a thought would be to drill out and weld the head bolt holes in the block solid, then drill and tap that. Maybe. Custom head bolts are probably a little easier though.

I definitley wouldn;t drill, weld or tap the block. I'd only do the helicoils if the OD thread was 12x1.5 and you could just screw them into the existing holes.

As for depth- they list various lengths on their site up to 3 diameters, so I think that would be okay

Quote, originally posted by Raceware »

Thank you for your RACEWARE inquiry.While we do offer custom made aerospace quality engine fasteners, one-off sets are very expensive. Design and engineering costs start at about $2,000USD and go up depending on the complexity of the design. Our hourly consulting rate is $300/hour with a minimum of (4) hours time. All new stud designs require custom made tooling to grind all three diameters of the stud to their final size after heat-treat. The tooling cost is an additional $1000 per stud design. This is a one-time charge and the tooling remains with us.As you can see the cost to supply the (1) set of custom designed studs would easily be in excess of $3500 USD plus shipping. Normal delivery time is 10-14 weeks from receipt of your full advance payment, which is required prior to the beginning of production.Once we receive your purchase order,no order cancellation, design changes, refund or exchange is possible. The studs would have our normal 190,000 PSI tensile strength guarantee and be similar to our typical RACEWARE stud design but produced to drawings that you must approve prior to production.

Quote, originally posted by bobqzzi »

Perhaps the OD of a 10mm insert is 12mm and you could simply screw them in.

Even on raceware's site they list the TDi as a 12mm bolt and the 1.8T as a 10mm bolt.I asked some questions over on a TDi board but they were clueless when it came to gas engines.The only way to confirm any of this was if there was a member on the board who had both a 20V and a TDi block kicking around.

unless of course the length is too short( it doesnt stick up through the head enough for the nut to grab )

i just measured a old aeb headbolt i have laying around and from the bottum of the head to the bottum of the threads is roughly 4 and 3/4 inches .

so if you screwed the studs in all the way .. bakced them out a 1/4 turn (how i was taught to install them) and you have roughly 5 inches sticking out of the block .. i would say you are good

just my thoughts

Trever

I have a scrap head here that I am going to bore out to increase it from 11mm to 12mm (AEB comes with 11mm bolts) then search for replacements from McMaster or something.Anyone want to send me a junk TDi head bolt?

the tdi block seems like a good option as it has a water source (or is it a sink??) on the block... and also has an oil return on the oil pan..

I'd still vote for drilling out the old head

I worked at a shop where a car had a blown timing belt. The aeb head bolts for some reason didnt even want to fit down a spare aeb head?? it was odd, so the boss threw the head on the drill press and opened up the holes to get it done.

It was a mostly stock car, it held up for as long as i stuck around, but i dont really know if it would work on a high boost/big power motor....i dont know if i would do it.

Quote, originally posted by transient_analysis »

I'd still vote for drilling out the old head

"... freedom is sometimes simply another perspective away..." -Kutless

Futrell Autowerks

The issue is the area the bolt head bears on- it is very small -essesially the OD of the bolt head . So there is no way a stude will work unless it comes with the special cylindrical nuts like the racewares. My concern with the stock 12mm bolts is the OD of the head- I don't know, but suspect it is larger than those of the 10/11mm bolts. If so, you would have to bore out the well in which it sits with a mill..which would be a huge pain, and there may not be room.
You could turn down the OD of a stock bolt head, but that reduces the bearing surface significantly.

"... freedom is sometimes simply another perspective away..." -Kutless

Futrell Autowerks

Quote, originally posted by Passenger Performance »

You can also use headstuds from arp originally from the ford cosworth 4 cyl engines.

Dave do you have a 16V or 20V head knocking around that you can put on one of the TDi blocks?How about an old TDi headgasket?

People used to use the ABA for 20v swaps, this ALH tdi motor has an internal waterpump (which the ABA does not) it has all the oil drain plugs (the ABA does not) and its chain driven oil pump along with a few other small things that makes it worth while. Since it is a tall block and utilizes 159mm rods instead of all the other mk4 blocks with 144mm you can run say a eurospec 100mm crank with an 83mm piston and have a 2.2L 20v motor that can do 8500rpm with a solid lifter head. I think that’s pretty awesome.

I was under the impression the european ALH and an NA ALH have the same crank???

Sounds like a neat project

Anybody had any luck with comparing anything?

Quote, originally posted by Wizard-of-OD »

Most of the junk I do has not been done before

This has been done before. Long blocks can be bought set up like this, just a little on the pricey side of things.

you should call them and ask what the use.

Modified by billyVR6 at 10:48 AM 4-5-2006

Quote, originally posted by Eurospec »

Issam, When we build our 2.2ltr 20vt long block we use our Eurospec Sport Turbo Head bolt part number: 06A 198 385R Thanks, Eurospec Sport