Modified by artargyle at 5:49 AM 10-13-2006

Modified by artargyle at 6:17 AM 10/13/2006

Actually Judge, George made REVO's reflash policy quite clear.

REVO will not reflash your vehicle for free if you lose your flash to any way other than dealer ECU replacement or reflash. You will have to repurchase REVO at full price in order to run REVO software in the future.

I told George that this was unfair and that when you buy any other competitor's software, they give lifetime reflashes for the lifetime of the VIN# of the car. He never responded.

That being said, I now run APR and can't be any happier with the software. I do know that APR has a separate manual & DSG file.

Dave

Actually REVO is the only one that has disabled the hardware protection map.

GIAC & APR leave it intact.

IMO, go with GIAC if you want the most performance. Go with APR if you want a smoother driving, but still powerful daily driving chip.

REVO loses power over stock under 2700rpms . . . whereas it feels as if APR & GIAC both gain power over stock under 2700rpms. With REVO, I found myself needing to shift at much higher RPMs to stay in the powerband. With APR, I can shift at 3500 or 4000 and still be in the powerband in the next gear. Possibly due to this, I have picked up 2-3mpg more over REVO (unexpected bonus). Can't say whether or not people will see the same gains when switching to APR from stock.

Dave

Feels as if, or actually does? No pissing match here, just curious

It is difficult to say. I ran REVO for 5k and their "stock" program doesn't feel like OEM stock to me. So, comparing APR to OEM stock under 2700rpms, it would be difficult for me to quantify exactly what the gains are. However, I do think it is more than stock with both GIAC and APR, since it is one of the recurring comments you'll hear from new users. I can definitely say that REVO is weaker down low.

Dave

Thanks... I've been watching the threads over in 2.0T with great interest, very informative

I wonder if this is not better for a DSG car. You can't feather the clutch or anything so it's real easy to spin the wheels with just the stock low-end torque.

Unfortunately I haven't driven GIAC.

GIAC is the one car that I do want to drive, but I never seem to meet any people with it, given that the nearest distributor is 300 miles away.

APR is much better than REVO. Lower end, it is a night and day difference. Midrange it is stronger. REVO takes the upper end 5,5-7k, but that is all due to how they run excessively high EGTs at the top to make power.

Dave

That sounds like a driver issue. Throttle modulation is different from having a weak powerband.

You really notice the lower RPM power losses of REVO on the highway. I always had to drop down a gear to pass, whereas with APR, I can pass pretty easily if I'm starting out at 2-2,5k.

Dave

Oh my how times have changed. which could be a good thing. first the carbonio and now running APR.

With APR, in TIP and in Sport I get clean shifts just like from the factory both in stage I and stageII. However, whenever I'm in D I only get clean shifts if I'm light on the throttle and shift between 2000 - 2500rpm or 4000-5000 rpm. I've noticed that if I get it to shift between 2500 - 4000rpm, the turbo begins gaining boost and the transmission decides to shift at the same time which causes a fairly big kick in the tranny. Doesn't really bother me that much, if I need to go fast I put it in sport/tip. If I feel like driving like an old grandma, leave it in D

Audi Meets:
Ortega

Oldtimer: "... use the !@#$%&* search ..."

Noob #2: "OMG you need to replace your DV and PCV stat!"

JJ are you really having an issue with this. I learned it was very easy to control (both chipped and stock), only real problem I had was on the test drive. Not to mention once I switched tires I had 0 issue with it at all (and thats with both my winters and summers). At this point I would really have to go out of my way to spin my tires.

I think you've got the wrong impression. I'm just saying that from a "maximum acceleration" point of view, with a DSG car, it may be better to have the power come in later. During heavy acceleration you are only in the lower RPM range once, in 1st gear. With a manual you can compensate for too much low-end torque by working the clutch properly. With DSG you don't have that option. You have to go lighter with the accelerator and try to get it "just right" so that you apply as much power as possible without breaking the tires loose. Sometimes you'll push too hard and get wheel spin and sometimes you'll not push hard enough and miss some potential. It is harder to get it "just right" when there is so much low end torque. If you're having no problem with wheel spin on a chipped car with "just" good tires then you must not be trying hard enough.

I've got Pzero Rosso tires on my car and I know I can drop a bunch of cash on very sticky tires that will practically melt onto to the road. Yes, it would prevent wheel spin but this is my commuter car and I don't feel like dropping $1000+ a year on tires.

I can definitely see how you would want a better low-end with a manual transmission. Most of the time you don't want to bother with downshifts or you want acceleration without the lag time required for shifting so it's helpful to have that low-end torque. With DSG the downshifts are effortless and near instantaneous so you don't have the same issue.

Modified by MisterJJ at 12:02 PM 10/13/2006

Expect a new post either tonight or sometime over the weekend.

Dave

PS. APR did write a DSG specific program A3 and when it's installed it will be noted as such.

Modified by artargyle at 7:29 PM 10/13/2006

Modified by artargyle at 7:30 PM 10/13/2006

Modified by artargyle at 7:35 PM 10/13/2006

Modified by artargyle at 7:36 PM 10/13/2006

Modified by artargyle at 8:14 PM 10/13/2006

No I understand you properly, I just think your looking at it wrong. Whether your adjusting torque with the clutch or with the accelerator, it still in simple terms the same equation, limiting torque to control traction. So i just dont see your point.

Oldtimer: "... use the !@#$%&* search ..."

Noob #2: "OMG you need to replace your DV and PCV stat!"

If there is, I'm going to Disney Land... I mean EuroCode tuning

Audi Meets:
Ortega

Andy's is a 6sp. But yes, they have DSG-specific files for both stage 1 & 2.

Dave

Modified by artargyle at 6:49 AM 10/16/2006

Modified by artargyle at 6:54 AM 10/16/2006

Glad to see you are happy. Please let me know if you need anything, I will defintley help you out on your ride.

Any discount for switchers who want to go to APR? I'd probably consider it at this point.

yes . . . pm me

Quote, originally posted by Mud_Shui_Ah »

This makes me revo owner very sad. will revo have an upgrade software anytime soon?

Why should you be sad? Did your car start performing poorly as soon as this thread started? Were you not happy with it before? It does kinda suck that someone may have chosen REVO because of the badmouthing of APR. Then the person badmouthing APR turns around and rips REVO while praising APR.

I just think that REVO is a more aggressive tune and it shows. If I was just concerned about "smooth shifts" I would have gotten a slushbox!

Modified by artargyle at 6:21 AM 10/20/2006

Modified by artargyle at 6:22 AM 10/20/2006

Next mod you should look at is the downpipe . . . and then go with APR stage II. That'll give you even more power + more engine note.

Modified by bacchus2678 at 6:55 AM 10-20-2006

Modified by bacchus2678 at 6:56 AM 10-20-2006