VWVortex.com - Rear Lap Belts and Children
Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    Results 1 to 23 of 23

    Thread: Rear Lap Belts and Children

    1. Member Colombian Gringo's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 6th, 2003
      Location
      Weehawken, NJ
      Posts
      7,509
      Vehicles
      '89 Cabby ABA/16vT, '89 Cabby, '94 E420 (RIP), '05 C55
      09-20-2005 04:37 PM #1
      My Cabby only has the lap belts in the rear and I'm trying to come up with a safe setup for my daughters (ages 2 and 5). My youngest, Samantha is still in a car seat that has it's own belts. Her car seat requires running the seatbelt through the back of it. Will that be safe with just the lap belt running through the back of it? My older daughter, Lauren is in a booster seat that doesn't have it's own belts. She is defintely not safe with just the lap belt. I had been thinking of installing the 3-point belts from a later model Cabby but found that they don't just bolt in and require welding. I was considering purchasing some Schroth harnesses and bolting them into the stock lap belt mounting points as well as the rear bulkhead between the suspension towers. After looking at some of their diagrams with the recommended anchor points I'm not sure the rear bullkhead would be a suitable anchor point.
      Has anyone else figured out a way to safely strap your kids into your Cabby?
      Thanks,

    2. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    3. 09-20-2005 05:06 PM #2
      The safest way, I think, would be to go with three-point belts. Harnesses are great but - as you say - it's tough to know the best anchor point. Best not to experiment with these things.
      If you can get the brackets and belts from a later cabby then head down to a local GTG and ask who does welding. Somebody will put the brackets in exchange for a case of beer. As an alternative, you could post your welding request in the tri-state forum.

    4. 09-20-2005 06:35 PM #3
      I toyed with the same thing - lap belts are safer than no belts (in most cases), but not as safe as 3-point belts. You're right, welding is the only great way fo 3-points, but the wender had better be god as they'd be welding on an old piece of sheet metal - not that thick. A safe alternative would definitely be harness belts with some form of ratcheting device. These could be easily secured to the rear bumper bolts - they're plenty strong and won't pull through the body like a through-bolt could. Still, there is nothing holding the belt "up" - in a major frontal impact the belt would be pulled forward and down, possibly crushing whatever the belt is holding in.
      I also toyed with Passat rear belts - these could be bolted to the backside of the reat strut brace as the angle is right, and the strut brace material is fairly think steel (washer it to make sure, always use Grade 8 hardware or the equivalent in metric). Still, the problems then arise with belt routing. Directly over the top of the seat risks crushing the kids in a hard impact, since the belt would only have the seat frame holding it up (seat framing not designed for that sort of stress).
      An alternative for both would be getting a sturdy strut-tower-top bar of some kind and routing the belt over that. OR... having someone weld in a "real" belt bar (a "roll bar"
      material bar between the tops of the rear strut towers would do) and securing harnesses or belts to that.
      Do let us know what you do - I'm driving carefully and running lap belts...

    5. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    6. 09-21-2005 08:36 AM #4
      My daughter is still in a car seat. I welded "rings" or "loops" in the crack of the seat (between back and bottom there is no crack in the seat LOL) similar to the ones found in newer cars for the Latch system. I also anchor the top tether on the seat to the bulkhead between the shock towers. Since the tether is anchored to the back of the car seat and not to the harness in the car seat, I don't have to worry about spine compression. (like when you mount a harness too low) I hope this helps with half your problem.

    7. Member atomicalex's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 2nd, 2001
      Location
      Detroit and Düsseldorf
      Posts
      16,969
      Vehicles
      dark blue stick shift station wagon, shiny yellow motorbike, dirty green motorbike, bluBRZ
      09-21-2005 09:21 AM #5
      I'm toying with this, too. My take was to add a rear strut tower bar and anchor harnesses to that as my kids are still small enough to not worry about compression incidents. Plus, I think they would get a huge kick out of the harnesses!
      たくさんとうふ、よ Where did all these damn Toyotas come from?
      Compared to a British roadster, all Volkswagens are reliable!
      nevAr Lose - DE Minister of Foreign Affairs and Deputy Bankruptcy Controller - IPROfftopikstan, kuhlBRZ

    8. Member Richthecopyguy's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 26th, 2005
      Location
      Selinsgrove PA
      Posts
      190
      Vehicles
      1984 Rabbit Convertible;1990 Cabriolet;1967 Beetle(Fred)R.I.P.
      09-21-2005 09:32 PM #6
      I installed a four point harness from wesco performance for my daughter(she's only three) I then took the car to the local state police barracks and had thier seat belt expert look at what I did and he was impressed enough to ask for any info I had so he could offer it as a suggestion to any one else that might have a similar prob.
      When I can get a chance, It'll have to be saturday, I'll take pics and post them. [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]
      I'm not prejudiced...I hate everyone equally.

      Lights timed for 45mph are also timed for 90!

    9. Member VeeDubDriver1990's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 19th, 2004
      Posts
      3,199
      Vehicles
      1981 Rabbit Pickup, 1990 Cabriolet, 1993 Corrado VR6 (up for sale)
      09-21-2005 09:49 PM #7
      Quote, originally posted by Richthecopyguy »
      I installed a four point harness from wesco performance for my daughter(she's only three) I then took the car to the local state police barracks and had thier seat belt expert look at what I did and he was impressed enough to ask for any info I had so he could offer it as a suggestion to any one else that might have a similar prob.

      [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]
      See, all PA State Police aren't bad! I don't know why everyone always
      has a problem with them

    10. 09-22-2005 12:02 AM #8
      Quote, originally posted by dixonL2 »
      An alternative for both would be getting a sturdy strut-tower-top bar of some kind and routing the belt over that. OR... having someone weld in a "real" belt bar (a "roll bar"
      material bar between the tops of the rear strut towers would do) and securing harnesses or belts to that.

      See, that what I was thinking about doing in Cabbymomma's car. We need to get somethinkg in there for our daughters (4 and 2 1/2). I was going to bend up a 1 1/2" piece of .095 mild steel and have it run right behind the top of the rear seat and then weld it to the shock towers or possibly the brace that runs between the strut towers. Then anchor the actuall retractor part of the belt to the brace and then the rings that belts go thru to the extra "roll bar". I think that should be pretty safe, the mounting points that it's welded to would be thicker parts of the car. But that's just my thinking

    11. 09-22-2005 12:02 AM #9
      ...only a problem when my right foot gets too heavy....

    12. Member jordanvw's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jan 8th, 2001
      Location
      southeast PA
      Posts
      3,322
      Vehicles
      I AM THE VAN MAN
      09-22-2005 02:10 AM #10
      wow...everyone has female children... so i guess you all with little boys just let them jump all over the car when its in motion?
      ps if anyone is interested, i have a '93 cabriolet i am parting out with the OEM 3 point rear shoulderharnesses... i will cut the brackets out (the brackets are welded in..PITA to remove, but its the only way to get the rear shoulderbelts) and you can reweld them into your cabby. fits all year cabbys from 80-93. includes the brackets, belts, everything you need to add rear 3 point OEM shoulderbelts to your cabby..
      send me IM if your interested.. [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]

    13. Member Black_cabbie's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 16th, 2003
      Location
      Athens Greece
      Posts
      8,819
      Vehicles
      Q7 4.2 V8 , Smart 451 Turbo
      09-22-2005 05:17 AM #11
      Some info....









      Chip Tuning for a living @ www.microchips-tuning.com

    14. Member Colombian Gringo's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 6th, 2003
      Location
      Weehawken, NJ
      Posts
      7,509
      Vehicles
      '89 Cabby ABA/16vT, '89 Cabby, '94 E420 (RIP), '05 C55
      09-22-2005 10:23 AM #12
      Quote, originally posted by Richthecopyguy »
      I installed a four point harness from wesco performance for my daughter(she's only three) I then took the car to the local state police barracks and had thier seat belt expert look at what I did and he was impressed enough to ask for any info I had so he could offer it as a suggestion to any one else that might have a similar prob.
      When I can get a chance, It'll have to be saturday, I'll take pics and post them. [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG]

      I would definitely be interested to see how you have the harnesses mounted and to hear what the State Police have to say. Please post some pics when you get a chance.

    15. Member jordanvw's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jan 8th, 2001
      Location
      southeast PA
      Posts
      3,322
      Vehicles
      I AM THE VAN MAN
      09-22-2005 11:01 AM #13
      thanks for the pics george.. [IMG]http://*****************.com/smile/emthup.gif[/IMG] that very cabby pictured is the exact cabby that the 3 point mount setup if from. that blue '93 cabby pictured sits in the top of my barn now, and those brackets/belts pictured are the ones i have for sale

    16. Member Richthecopyguy's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 26th, 2005
      Location
      Selinsgrove PA
      Posts
      190
      Vehicles
      1984 Rabbit Convertible;1990 Cabriolet;1967 Beetle(Fred)R.I.P.
      09-22-2005 09:14 PM #14
      The short of the installation is that I used all of the original factory mounts. I ran the shoulder harness part under the cross member behind the seat and up over the seat back. the lap portion is mounted to the original lap belt and reciever are mounted. Now I really don't know about you but I did find that without a head rest on the back seat I didn't feel safe having her in a booster but rather putting her in the seat which then puts her in the lowest possible position in the seat, gets the lap portion snug across her lap with the shoulder parts laying just as they would if she was in a child seat with a harness. Believe it or not the trooper that checked my installation agreed that she was much safer in this position.
      Btw my daughter loves the way the seat belt works and even wants to pull the shoulder straps tight when we go for a ride.
      I'm not prejudiced...I hate everyone equally.

      Lights timed for 45mph are also timed for 90!

    17. 11-30-2008 08:24 AM #15
      Posted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:20 pm Post subject:
      --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      If anyone is still interested then i have a full set of the OEM US 3 point belts for sale. I bought them years ago but never got round to fitting and have since sold the car. I paid something close to £300 for them so please make me a sensible offer or bid on my auction. Thanks.
      http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayI...57931
      P.S Email is often gets to me better than a pm.

    18. 10-13-2010 09:23 AM #16
      Ive since bought the cab back from the person i sold it too and would like to put the 3 point belts in this time so if anybody knows anyone selling then please let me know.

    19. Member
      Join Date
      Sep 19th, 2010
      Location
      Montreal
      Posts
      116
      Vehicles
      '93 Cabriolet/ '03 Golf/'13 Golf Wagon 2.5
      10-14-2010 06:09 PM #17
      I have similar concerns with the lap only belts in my '88. My 4 year old daughter is big enough for a booster seat (which is in my wife's Yaris), but I put the Britax seat in the VW. I tested it by grabbing the seat and and yanking it as hard as I could and it would hardly budge. I plan on installing an anchor somewhere in the trunk to attack the hook from the Britax just to be safe, but I'm not particularly worried about the current setup.

      I explained to my wife how when I was a little kid, that my dad's 1970 Mercedes 280SL didn't even have a back seat, only a small ledge, with no belts whatsoever, and that's where I sat.

      That said, I drive this car much differently that I do a modern car, in the sense that I drive it more like a motorcycle than a car.

    20. 10-15-2010 03:01 AM #18
      there is a diy conversion in the link below.
      it is in french but from the pictures you will get an idea

      http://piupiu.ferreira.free.fr/montage_de_ceintures.rar

    21. Member
      Join Date
      Mar 21st, 2013
      Location
      Minnesota
      Posts
      117
      Vehicles
      1986 cabriolet (MT), 2012 Toyota Sienna
      08-11-2014 10:42 PM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by msoze View Post
      there is a diy conversion in the link below.
      it is in french but from the pictures you will get an idea

      http://piupiu.ferreira.free.fr/montage_de_ceintures.rar
      This french slideshow is tres bien! Merci beaucoup!
      little bandit needs premium!
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dceB3SKBw9w

    22. 07-01-2019 07:00 AM #20
      Originally Posted by judderi

      If anyone is still interested then i have a full set of the OEM US 3 point belts for sale. I bought them years ago but never got round to fitting and have since sold the car. I paid something close to £300 for them so please make me a sensible
      essay typer offer or bid on my auction. Thanks.
      Ive since bought the cab back from the person i sold it too and would like to put the 3 point belts in this time so if anybody knows anyone selling then please let me know.
      Hi,

      Do you still have those for sale? I've been trying to make some improvements on Sparco Evo 2 Plus and I just found the guy who can send me his diy project pics with the OEM 3 point belts. So I thought I could find them for sale, but I'm on a tight budget.
      I apologize for bumping.
      Last edited by TerryMulhern; 07-01-2019 at 07:01 AM. Reason: just a mistake

    23. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 20th, 2004
      Location
      Atlanta Ga
      Posts
      20,695
      Vehicles
      90, 92, 93 Cabriolet They own you.
      07-01-2019 10:09 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by TerryMulhern View Post
      Hi,

      Do you still have those for sale? I've been trying to make some improvements on Sparco Evo 2 Plus and I just found the guy who can send me his diy project pics with the OEM 3 point belts. So I thought I could find them for sale, but I'm on a tight budget.
      I apologize for bumping.
      Reviving a 5 year old post is a tad Pointless, but you need to post this as a Want to Buy in the Classifieds section.

      Now for sake of argument the Rear Seat belts out of a Cabrio may work for you and the older Passant and Jetta's are Vertical mounts as well.
      The issue is that in the 91.5 Cabriolet they added them, but they were welded in as a Bracket and Housing assembly. You may be better served by finding a wrecked 91.5 to 93 Cabriolet and a few batteries and a Grinder or Sawzall in a wrecking yard will do wonders, just be sure that you get the Parcel shelf as well as the parcel shelf side frames.

    24. Member
      Join Date
      Mar 3rd, 2016
      Location
      Bay Area, CA
      Posts
      226
      Vehicles
      '90 Cabby
      07-01-2019 01:20 PM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by briano1234 View Post
      by finding a wrecked 91.5 to 93 Cabriolet
      Unfortunately, I think I know someone around here who has one...

    25. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 20th, 2004
      Location
      Atlanta Ga
      Posts
      20,695
      Vehicles
      90, 92, 93 Cabriolet They own you.
      07-08-2019 09:39 AM #23
      Quote Originally Posted by agentphish View Post
      Unfortunately, I think I know someone around here who has one...
      Well I am not going to chop my blue one any more than I already did... . It is getting ready for it's final tow to the YARD.....
      I have Swapped over the interior, top, rims as the Tear drops are better than the ARS ones I bought on the car years ago, the windows scrapers and seals have all been removed, and swapped over, so my 92 is getting major overhaul on the features, and well I may finally break down and give it a good paint job...

      The Dash got Destroyed, and the Frame was bent, the Top frame was bent as well, but the engine still turns over, but since the passenger side shaft is Cabbage, I can get it to run on the transmission, but it does cycle through all the detents.

      While the Chassis is toast, it's parts will still live on.....
      I did notice that my strut bar was twisted and bent, so I am not taking that off, and it is a pain to see the engine in that condition, but it still fires and runs.

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •