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    Thread: fargin won't start.

    1. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-06-2006 07:48 PM #1
      92 digifart.
      Will crank, and there is spark at 6btdc It will not run.
      What I have tested.
      It wouldn't start and there was a fuel leak from a fuel line in the engine bay, it appears that it was the return line. It has been repaired.
      There is fuel coming to the fuel rail, I have replaced the Pressure regulator and the in-tank pump Cranked the engine and there is suffecient fuel leaving the hose. The Tank Pressurises. I hear the primary pump pump to pressurize then stop

      Air box restriction...None have a Air hog, and it is sucking air. No difference if I remove it.

      I have looked at the time with a timing light. It is firing 6deg BTDC on number on.
      Checked the static time. Mark at 0 on the tranny, the number one plug is on the hash. The cam belt is a little above the valve cover corner.
      What I have replaced..
      Plug Wires, Plugs Bosch Plat 2's
      The cap is clean on the inside
      the Rotor is good
      If I crank it solid, then apply and release the gas. It will try to start. Almost like a flooded car. I took out the plugs and they smelt of gas. but were not overly wet...
      I have cleaned all the connectors on the fuel rail hall sender and the ECU.
      Help me Mr. Wizards out there......... What could it be....
      Last question the fuel line from the pump goes directly in the fuel rail?
      as that is the only thing I might have gotten crossed. It is almost like the injectors aren't injecting...... I haven't pulled them yet.
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    3. Member speedtek40's Avatar
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      04-06-2006 07:51 PM #2
      put the pedal right to the floor and crank it until it starts, just hold it there...don't pump it. If it's flooded, that's the cure, you'll know as it will start to catch and then start up fairly rough. Let us know what happens atfter that.
      PS, have you cleaned the airmeter?


      Modified by speedtek40 at 6:52 PM 4-6-2006
      Change is inevitable......progress is optional

    4. Member tolusina's Avatar
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      04-06-2006 08:04 PM #3
      Quote, originally posted by briano1234 »
      .......Last question the fuel line from the pump goes directly in the fuel rail?
      as that is the only thing I might have gotten crossed.....


      <edit> if it does turn out to be crossed fuel lines and self inflicted, don't feel bad, it's not the first time it's happened....... </edit>


      Modified by tolusina at 5:11 PM 4-6-2006
      Quote Originally Posted by kamzcab86
      I hate reading: "But I bought this car for $500 and don't want to put another dime into it."
      ____(hey, it's VW AND it's electrical, what's not to fail?) neoBentley+



    5. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-06-2006 10:25 PM #4
      No, it still won't start, thinking about buying ether......lol
      The lines are a possibility, as when this all started one of them was leaking. It was the return to the fuel tank. I replaced it, then did the other as preventative measure.
      So any why I had to change the oil pump, figured that while it was in the air..... to fix the leak...
      I changed thew wires and the plugs, then tried to start it, and no the wires aren't crossed.... I replaced one at a time.

    6. Member speedtek40's Avatar
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      04-07-2006 01:07 AM #5
      Well Brian, It sounds like you missed something when you hooked things back up. Did you double check everything you disconnected? I remember when I was doing some test starts on Taz this winter I was cranking and cranking and cranking and getting more and more pissed that it wouldn't start. Especially since I was sure I had put everything exactly back the way it was.It was only as I passed the underdash engine computer (sitting on the bench) the third time that the light came on and I realized things wiould probably work much better if it was in the car as opposed to on the bench.
      Change is inevitable......progress is optional

    7. 04-07-2006 01:35 AM #6
      Ha. That's funny. I've done worse...

    8. Member tolusina's Avatar
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      04-07-2006 04:08 AM #7
      check for a split air intake boot between the maf and throttle body. take it off, flex it around and check every surface, every convolution.
      check your maf, is the flap stuck/sticking?
      all your injectors didn't suddenly fail all at once. you may have lost injector pulse, the ground signal from the ecu. injectors are powered all the time whenever the fuel pump is powered. injector grounding is very different between digi I and digi II, consult bentley for specifics. very easy to check for an injector signal on the ground side, use a dwell or duty cycle meter, a lab scope, a two color led can tell if there is a signal, it cannot, of course measure it. pulse width should be somewhere around 2.5 to 3.5 milli seconds. 5 milli seconds is really rich.
      bypass the cts with a 500 to 1kΩ resistor, sometimes you need to tell the ecu fibs, briefly.
      your return line leak may have been pointing to a pinched return line. check fuel pressure, about 45 psi with no vacuum to the pressure regulator, about 35 with vacuum applied, pumps running.
      while you have a fuel pressure gauge connected, pull the vacuum hose from the fuel pressure regulator, crank for fuel pressure, pause for normal pressure drop to residual. pull fuse s-5 to dis-able the pumps, crank and watch for fuel pressure drop due to injectors opening.
      you mention timing is on, checked with a light. may or may not be an indicator of adequate spark. check the old fashioned way, ask a friend to hold a loose plug wire while cranking. if they fall down, then hit you, spark is good. seriously, watch it jump, you should get at least an inch of bright blue spark. coils can and do die all of a sudden, partially or completely.
      catalytic converter or/and muffler plugged? thought that was all new on your car.....
      sorry no caps, keyboard in one hand, bentley in the other.........
      Quote Originally Posted by kamzcab86
      I hate reading: "But I bought this car for $500 and don't want to put another dime into it."
      ____(hey, it's VW AND it's electrical, what's not to fail?) neoBentley+



    9. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-07-2006 11:57 AM #8
      Yes new cat and the muffler is good.
      The timing I checked with a timing light to the Tranny hole, it is rock hard at 6btdc.
      Also took out the plugs to verify that they were sparking.
      If the spark test wasn't so funny..... wet gras lawn mower and a shovel in the rain.... almost as bad as when a cattle prod fired between my left hand and my right was resting on the vise....Now that was a spark to remember... I saw blue flashes in my eyes....
      gonna wig out the fuel lines. Jumper the relay, and see if I can fill 300ml in 30 seconds. Gonna also replace the filter.
      Then I am going to cuss pitch a fit, jump up and down and throw the BFH at it. (maybe that will scare it).

    10. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-11-2006 01:58 PM #9
      Today I finally got around to cutting the resonator off before the cat, and the Cabby lives...Sounds meaner than hell....spose it was mad because it wasn't driven for a couple of weeks... I cut the resonator off, it was hollow so I know I have a probably? Totally Plugged Muffler........
      IT LIVES.... But I guess I shoudl of known, that when your constipated, you don't want to eat, or run......Should be an ex-lax for cars...

    11. Member kamzcab86's Avatar
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      04-11-2006 02:13 PM #10
      Quote, originally posted by briano1234 &raquo;
      IT LIVES....

      Woohoo!
      Quote, originally posted by briano1234 &raquo;
      But I guess I shoudl of known, that when your constipated, you don't want to eat, or run......Should be an ex-lax for cars...

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    12. Member speedtek40's Avatar
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      04-11-2006 02:45 PM #11
      it's about bloody time!!! LOL
      Change is inevitable......progress is optional

    13. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-15-2006 03:57 PM #12
      Well after replaceing everything it wasn't, I now know a lot about the ignition and timing and fuel supply of the Digifart.
      So I thought that I would update you on the Thread....
      For those that have been following on the TRF here is the recap and the answer.
      Any one know where I can buy a short block?
      The problem is the crank shaft timing gear is sheared, as soon as I got to it, I noticed tha the harmonic dampner could move about 1/8 of and inch laterally. No worries, at least I don't have to remove the intermediate gear.....cause the waterpump pulley bolts are crap.
      I can spin the harmonic dampner and I can see the gear bolts move with it.
      I got all the balancer bolts out, but it appears that this had a similar problem before, because I have the torque broke on the crank bolt but I can't get the bolt loose, it is bound I think they probably over torqued it and stripped it.
      I have it backed out about 4 revolutions and it is froze. I can't get it to go either way with out alot of muscle.
      So the original problem has been discovered, it is the crankshaft timing gear is sheared.
      I can't get the cover off with out getting the harmonic pully off, and I can't get that off because the crank bolt iis stripped....
      So anyone got a digifart low miles for sale? OHHHHHHHHHHHHHH SHEEEEEEEEEITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

      I will try a little later as I have shot PB Blaster all over that dam thing. But I think it is a lost cause.
      I might try dropping the pan, then using a barstock to lock the Crank to see if I can get the torque to overcome the bolt. but I am afraid that either way the engine is lost for a crank.
      My only other question is can I take off the Front plate, and the rear, to drop the crank out, and just put a new one in its place, but then again I should have the Cylinders cleaned and new rods new bearings.....
      Anyone got a running Digifart in the atlanta area they have swapped a 2.0 for ?

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      04-15-2006 11:51 PM #13
      I had a caliper bolt stuck much like you're describing a couple of months ago... (the sort of brakes where the caliper is bolted solid to the steering knuckle) After my coworker broke the bolt off for me (he has bigger arms...) we had a machine shop fix the steering knuckle. (aluminum) It wasn't pretty.. the bolt really didn't want to come out of there... but it was a $800 knuckle and the repair was solid enough. That bolt was no joke though... turn 1/2 turn one way, 1/2 turn the other. It was an M10.
      You could remove the transmission and drop the crank out leaving the top end together and install another crank... the rings/clyinder walls should be good for 200k+ so I wouldn't worry about those
      If you can't manage to get the pulley off I'd melt the rubber on the harmonic balancer and maybe remove the outtper part of it to gain enough room to remove the seal plate bolts and get the crank out that way.

    15. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-16-2006 09:30 AM #14
      Nick,
      That is my thought, I will talk to my Machine shop guy, and see if he can centerbore it if it is out of the engine. He may be able to Save it, but that is for tomorrow morning. I will get the chance to clean the engine bay and all of the extra Grime and Goo.....then take the corrosion off the little things and make it look more purty....... I suppose...
      Degreaser, power Washer, and paint......the possibilities are endless.

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      04-16-2006 12:51 PM #15
      oh, and some of the pulleys are setup to remove the pulley stuff with the 4 allen bolts, the hole in the center is large enough so the crank bolt isn't in the way... but I've seen a couple the other way too.

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      04-17-2006 10:14 AM #16
      hey... I just took apart the lower pulley on my '92 while doing the t-belt, and the pulleys do come separate from the timing gear without undoing the gear bolt...

    18. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      04-17-2006 10:34 AM #17
      Nick that isn't the problem.. I got the firts vbelt pulley off, but the problem is that the timing gear is sheared on the crank. I gotta drop the crank with the front plate and gear and pulley to see what the hell is up... I have a shop lined up to take a look at the job, he says that the helicoil will take the 100 ft lbs or torque required, I just gotta get the shaft to him. So.....With that said I gotta get the front plate off, and the cranks out.
      So is it easier to drop the engine out the bottom, ( I have done a diesel or two that way) or to pull it out the top, and is it easier to take the tranny off to pull it or leave the tranny on and pull it together.....
      Either way I am going to have to seperate the tranny from the engine to get the crank free....

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      04-17-2006 08:51 PM #18
      I realized what your issue was, I was just worried that you'd have the sort of front pulley setup that would prevent removing the pulleys without removing the crank bolt, seems I've seen one or two such setups on past vehicles... I was thinking that with the pulleys on there it would be a major pita to get the timing cover off, and then the front seal cover... I didn't realizez you already had the front pulleys off. cool beans.

    20. Senior Member briano1234's Avatar
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      05-06-2006 08:51 PM #19
      It is back running rather loud and obnoxious like me, but it is running. I drove it around the block, shifted good. I have to tweak the timing, but that is better done when the muffler is on.
      For those that have an Automatic in thier car, the "Bentley" dosen't have the measurement for you to tell if your Torque Convertor is correctly installed...I had to use the "Haynes" According to "Haynes" with a straight edge from the top of the bell housing to the bottom, there shoudl be 1 13/64 inches from the edge of the bellhousing to the button on the torque convertor. It took me about two hours playing with it to get it set right. There are 3 Splined shafts under the torque convertor and untill you get all the ducks in a row you will never get the 1 13/64 Clearance
      So as much as we all bad mouth Bentley my Haynes pulled it out of its posterior.
      Hurrah for Haynes.

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