VWVortex.com - dsire's DIY valve cleaning method is Brilliant!!
Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
    Results 1 to 25 of 39

    Thread: dsire's DIY valve cleaning method is Brilliant!!

    1. 02-19-2009 12:37 PM #1
      Did this valve clean yesterday. It is the easiest thing in the world! Thanks a million to dsire for posting this!
      https://forums.vwvortex.com/zer...80170
      You don't even have to remove the engine cover. I sucked in fluid for about 1 second, let engine continue to idle a bit, and then revved and held at 2000 rpm until all white smoke stopped. Then repeated until out of fluid. I changed the oil after letting it run awhile after that. This has to be the easiest way to deal with valve/intake deposits plus you can do it really easily right before you change the oil.
      Cost:
      1) hose - 1/4" ID x 1/2" ODiameter x 24" $1.99 at autozone
      2) Basketball needles $1.99 for 3
      3) 1 bottle lubro-moly valve cleaner (ventil saubber) $6.38 at IPD volvo parts place, or buy here:
      http://www.worldimpex.com/part....html

    2. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    3. 02-19-2009 03:03 PM #2
      How many miles does your car have on it?
      Sold the VAG COM

    4. 02-19-2009 04:38 PM #3
      I've got 9000 miles. RS-RL1's post showed that buildup on the valves can happen in as little as 800 miles (on the RS4 engine anyway) and that is even with the RS4's efficient oil seperator for the pcv system.
      http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/...25647
      Also we know from pics like this from vwtechhouston on an EOS at 22k miles, it can build up fast in our engines. My thinking is do it every 5000 miles, just before oil change. I think it is sort of like fuel injector cleaner, used every once and a while it can be cheap preventive maintenance.
      Also photos like the one below scream for an effective pcv solution that eliminates return to the engine (I mean eliminates return both through intake or pre-turbo)
      [IMG][/IMG]


      Modified by saaber2 at 2:44 PM 2-19-2009

    5. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    6. 02-19-2009 05:54 PM #4
      using fuel injector cleaner through the intake manifold right?
      what other products out there can be fed through the intake manifold?
      also did you feel any difference in the smoothness of the motor? preferably at idle?

    7. 02-19-2009 06:21 PM #5
      It's funny you ask that because the first thing I tried was spraying throttle body/air intake cleaner just downstream of the MAF sensor. My thinking was that using the valve sauber, via dsire's method, would clean the intake and valves, but what would clean everything upstream of that?
      In other words, what would clean the contaminates that came from the pcv pipe on the back of the intake to the turbo (does that make any sense?) such as the turbo itself, intercooler, pipes to intercooler, etc. I have used this method very successfully on saab turbos for years.
      After two sprays of air intake cleaner downstream of the MAF (maybe 1/4-1/3 of a can each) and subsequent running at 2000 or so rpm, the idle smoothed out quite a bit and starting improved a lot. The one thing I didn't like though is you are basically "drowning" the engine in the stuff and then asking it to start, which doesn't sound real great when it is trying to burn all that solvent off. So I said that was enough for the "upstream" treatment and did dsire's valve cleaner method for the manifold and valves.
      The dsire method further smoothed out idle just a tiny bit I think (maybe just in my mind ha ha) and also starting a bit. It really wasn't a fair test of the valve sauber because probably some of the cleaning work had already been done by the air intake cleaner.
      What impressed me the most is how incredibly simple and fast dsire's method is. Plus the car is already running when you do it so that it is easy for the car to digest the stuff vs. starting with it in the intake like the spray throttle body/air intake cleaner.
      I think next time I will do just the dsire method as I didn't like the rough start required when starting the car with the air intake cleaner in there.

    8. 02-19-2009 06:27 PM #6
      so we can run:
      water
      seafoam
      lubromoly valve cleaner
      what else? can we run those techron bottles through the manifold too?

    9. 02-19-2009 06:33 PM #7
      I ran the C-R-C throttle body/air intake cleaner like you find at schucks, autozone, etc. I have seen that stuff directly dissolve old carbon deposits on throttle body plates so it is pretty effective (basically it is just milder carb cleaner probably). The ones you mentioned will probably vary in how agressively they clean carbon. I would love to find a mechanic with a flexible borescope/videoscope and take some before and after shots. Would be easy to do but hard to find someone with the borescope.

    10. 02-19-2009 06:38 PM #8
      i wonder if carb cleaner would combust prematurely blowing something up, since seafoam and water are pretty inert, they wont blow up inside the manifold, but carb cleaner might.

    11. 02-19-2009 06:54 PM #9
      this still seems like a caveman approach......
      When we do induction services at the dealer bg44K or a MOC iduction cleaner is put into a can that gets pressurized via the shop compressor and a beautifull fine mist gets misted into the intake pre TB.....
      Im not to fond of the pure liquid approach you guys are using. The mist is not only more effective but safer.

    12. 02-19-2009 06:57 PM #10
      Quote, originally posted by RABIDRABBIT1983 »
      this still seems like a caveman approach......
      When we do induction services at the dealer bg44K or a MOC iduction cleaner is put into a can that gets pressurized via the shop compressor and a beautifull fine mist gets misted into the intake pre TB.....
      Im not to fond of the pure liquid approach you guys are using. The mist is not only more effective but safer.

      the liquid breaks up a bit as soon as it is sucked up and into the manifold, the key is to suck some air and some liquid at the same time.
      as much as anyone here wants to use that machine, it would involve money. the next best thing to that would be to just run w/m injection.

    13. 02-19-2009 07:07 PM #11
      That spray air intake cleaner is a mist. I suppose a guy could make an adapter so that the little red tube from the spray can could be inserted at the same location as dsire's method (the temp sensor) hole. Heck even a rubber stopper with a hole in the middle would work for that.
      I assume these two are the same product just different label.



      Modified by saaber2 at 4:20 PM 2-19-2009

    14. 02-19-2009 07:10 PM #12
      extremely flammable
      do the instructions say its its ok to use while the engine is on?

    15. 02-19-2009 07:15 PM #13
      Yea I have used it probably 75-100 times on different cars with the car running and never had a problem and it says on the can to rev the engine up and down while spraying and car running (car running is prefferred method). The can says if the car won't run with air cleaner off (i.e. so that that you can spray onto intake throttle body) then spray in 1/2 can, reconnect air cleaner, run, repeat. Of course I wouldn't spray this in the air cleaner on our cars because it is upstream of the MAF.
      Correction: i just read the back of the can (the can in the right photo above) and it says to spray with engine off. I've used this stuff for many years and the old cans say running is preferred method, but this can doesn't say that. It may be due to cars becoming more sophisticated, more sensors etc. now than when old instructions were produced.? Like I said above I like the dsire method better.



      Modified by saaber2 at 4:34 PM 2-19-2009

    16. 02-19-2009 07:31 PM #14
      Quote, originally posted by dubsker »
      the liquid breaks up a bit as soon as it is sucked up and into the manifold, the key is to suck some air and some liquid at the same time.
      as much as anyone here wants to use that machine, it would involve money. the next best thing to that would be to just run w/m injection.


      I totally understand......... better way to skin these cats thats all

    17. 02-19-2009 07:42 PM #15
      Quote, originally posted by RABIDRABBIT1983 »
      I totally understand......... better way to skin these cats thats all

      The other issue, even if people wanted to pay the dealer to do it every 5k miles, is finding a dealer that is competent to do it. Probably could find some good indy shops have that equipment and are competent, but every time I talk to a dealer service guy it takes so long to educate them about the car it is not worth it and I wouldn't trust my car to them unless I had no other choice.
      It's like, "no, you don't understand, it is DSG, not an automatic, and it does have a mechatronics unit, and you do have to change the fluid at 40k" etc. etc. It is just horrible most places. Sounds like your dealer is way, way above the curve. Wish it was over here.

    18. 02-19-2009 07:51 PM #16
      lol............i dont work for VW/AUDI but another highline marque.
      Trust me ALL dealers can be SCARY!!! Of all the techs in the shop even some of the "master techs" cant fix a sandwich and I only let a handfull touch my car.
      Just like anything in life sometime you get lucky and get the guy who has done the job a 100 times can do it blindfolded or you get the guy who shrugs off anything that sounds remotely intelligent because he does not get paid for that method

    19. 02-19-2009 08:27 PM #17
      The method I posted is not perfect. It primarily focuses on valves 2 and three, which are the two valves that suffer the most from oil deposits from the PCV system.
      But you can literally watch in real time with the vag com and see the misfires disappear when using the ventil sauber. Of course the misfires go up when the solution is being applied, but watch for the big zero misfire count immediately after.
      For valve 4, use the vacuum port on the right hand side of the manifold, or if an Audi inline engine, the plug on the firewall side of the engine. That will focus more on valve number 4. Havent figured out a good way to get at valve 1 yet.

    20. 02-19-2009 08:32 PM #18
      dsire, I'm curious what you think of the throttle body cleaner spray technique. Also any ideas of how to clean upstream of the intake manifold and downstream of MAF? Is it even that big of a deal to clean that section? (obviously not compared to valves, etc. I just mean is it worth the effort to clean that section)
      Also, do you think an atmospheric catch can pcv system would adequately evacuate gases from the crankcase or do they have to be evacuated under vacuum like from a vacuum pump or slash-cut system (assuming the line to the intake is not used any more)? I'm still looking for an adequate PCV solution that eliminates the oil/contaminates coming back to the intake but uses some vacuum to adequately evacuate gasses.
      Here is an example of vacuum assist catch can:
      http://moparforums.com/forums/...r-234/



      Modified by saaber2 at 5:45 PM 2-19-2009

    21. 02-19-2009 08:36 PM #19
      you would have to drop the tb pipe just to be able to hit at the throttle body, since the whole charge pipe system is under positive pressure at all times.

    22. 02-19-2009 08:55 PM #20
      Quote, originally posted by saaber2 »
      dsire, I'm curious what you think of the throttle body cleaner spray technique. Also any ideas of how to clean upstream of the intake manifold and downstream of MAF? Is it even that big of a deal to clean that section? (obviously not compared to valves, etc. I just mean is it worth the effort to clean that section)
      Also, do you think an atmospheric catch can pcv system would adequately evacuate gases from the crankcase or do they have to be evacuated under vacuum like from a vacuum pump or slash-cut system (assuming the line to the intake is not used any more)? I'm still looking for an adequate PCV solution that eliminates the oil/contaminates coming back to the intake but uses some vacuum to adequately evacuate gasses.
      Here is an example of vacuum assist catch can:
      http://moparforums.com/forums/...r-234/
      Modified by saaber2 at 5:45 PM 2-19-2009


      I was not keen of running solvent through the turbo, so I did not consider the spray technique mentioned. You will find some oil in the intake piping, but it usually settles out (harmlessly) in the intercooler piping. Pull a lower coupling and you will see it. I live in a climate where a catch can is not an option. It would freeze up in winter.

    23. 02-19-2009 09:28 PM #21
      pre tb is the way to go


      yes i realize that is a M54 BMW not a 2.0T FSI and yes I realize the maf is unplugged while doing the induction service.
      Just showing you guys the whizbang mist machine in action.

    24. 02-19-2009 09:32 PM #22
      more information about that CAT tool please

    25. 02-19-2009 10:04 PM #23
      Quote, originally posted by dubsker »
      more information about that CAT tool please

      there are some listed on the http://www.bgprod.com wesbite.
      Im sure its a ridiculously pricey setup..........The shop foreman rarely asks for prices on shop tools.
      If you mean simply function........its simple. The hose leading into the pre TB hose has a fine mist nozzle on the end. Hook up shop air to the CAT can and open the valve once the car is running. The cleaning product gets misted into the intake system cleaning carbon/oil off the intake,tb, intake valves etc. The atomizing makes for more even product displacement and better cleaning, as well as less chance for hydro lock

    26. 02-19-2009 10:12 PM #24
      Quote, originally posted by saaber2 »
      I ran the C-R-C throttle body/air intake cleaner like you find at schucks, autozone, etc. I have seen that stuff directly dissolve old carbon deposits on throttle body plates so it is pretty effective (basically it is just milder carb cleaner probably). The ones you mentioned will probably vary in how agressively they clean carbon. I would love to find a mechanic with a flexible borescope/videoscope and take some before and after shots. Would be easy to do but hard to find someone with the borescope.

      One of the techs at work just got a cool video boroscope action........hes a big RC buff so i'm not surprised LOL. Ill see about checking mine out .......with only 12 k on my car maybe I wont even wanna do a induction service yet once I take a look.
      LOL one of the salesguys started listing a few places he wants to use it

    27. 02-19-2009 10:52 PM #25
      Quote, originally posted by RABIDRABBIT1983 »
      One of the techs at work just got a cool video boroscope action........hes a big RC buff so i'm not surprised LOL. Ill see about checking mine out .......with only 12 k on my car maybe I wont even wanna do a induction service yet once I take a look.
      LOL one of the salesguys started listing a few places he wants to use it

      Cool! tell whoever has that nice valve cleaner setup that you need to get a before and after video to prove it works! That would be cool especially on a car with some miles on it/full of gunk.

    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •