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    Thread: Justification for higher education

    1. Member izzo's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 02:18 AM #26
      Or this... whichever.


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    3. Member MrRoboto's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 02:28 AM #27
      Quote Originally Posted by Rexist View Post
      It's funny how we all lust after expensive cars as status symbols to display our wealth. Education is only seen as a tool to acquire wealth. If you could be a highly educated man or a putz with a garage full of lambos which do you choose?
      The question is rather irrelevant IMO.

      You can be smart and think about depressing **** the whole time or you can be dumb and be oblivious to all the crap that's going on in the world today. then there are some not so well off folks I know who are always happy go lucky for some reason (my best friends), while another of my friends hates his job, and hates his wife. But at least he owns four commercial properties.

      What does it mean? Being smarter than you neighbor doesn't mean your house must be bigger, nor does it mean you're happier than they are either. But being educated to do something you like to do, and possibly make money while doing it, is probably more important. Does it mean you have to go to college or uni to do it? Not necessarily. Depends on what you're after, and what makes you happy.

    4. Banned roadtripper's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 02:35 AM #28
      Justification for higher education
      my amazing wife.

      and six of the great years of my life.

      the killer alumni discount for renting out the campus for gigantic parties ain't bad either.

    5. 05-02-2013 02:47 AM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by baljet View Post
      Supply and demand?
      Yeah - surplus of workers and shortage of jobs (thank you technology & productivity ). Seems simple, but 7 years ago we had unemployment below 5% IIRC and wages still sucked. It just seems like wages were better 30 years ago. Not sure if companies just intentionally paid more or what. IDK, maybe benefits have come to replace part of our earnings so it just looks like we're being compensated less. I always hear those statistics about how wages have fallen when adjusted for inflation. I think the average middle class income should be like $90K/year adjusted for inflation.

    6. Banned 20aeman's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 02:56 AM #30
      Education just makes you a better prospect for soulless corporations. Being a salaryman (i.e. selling your labor) will not make you rich.

      The people I know who are *truly* rich are entrepreneurs; "75 percent hard work, 25 percent luck" as one of them phrased it.
      Last edited by 20aeman; 05-02-2013 at 02:59 AM.

    7. Banned baljet's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 02:57 AM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by Rexist View Post
      It's funny how we all lust after expensive cars as status symbols to display our wealth. Education is only seen as a tool to acquire wealth. If you could be a highly educated man or a putz with a garage full of lambos which do you choose?
      Formal university education is nothing but an expensive game and indeed a tool. One does not need to be formally educated to be smart.

      Quote Originally Posted by Brett92 View Post
      Yeah - surplus of workers and shortage of jobs (thank you technology & productivity ). Seems simple, but 7 years ago we had unemployment below 5% IIRC and wages still sucked. It just seems like wages were better 30 years ago. Not sure if companies just intentionally paid more or what. IDK, maybe benefits have come to replace part of our earnings so it just looks like we're being compensated less. I always hear those statistics about how wages have fallen when adjusted for inflation. I think the average middle class income should be like $90K/year adjusted for inflation.
      Perhaps a consequence of the growing wealth disparity. As the top 1% own more and more of the wealth, the bottom 99% are left with less to go around, so naturally wages will be lower as well. The most dire consequence is enslavement.

    8. Member rlfletch's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 03:13 AM #32
      Quote Originally Posted by Brett92 View Post
      Yeah - surplus of workers and shortage of jobs (thank you technology & productivity ). Seems simple, but 7 years ago we had unemployment below 5% IIRC and wages still sucked. It just seems like wages were better 30 years ago. Not sure if companies just intentionally paid more or what. IDK, maybe benefits have come to replace part of our earnings so it just looks like we're being compensated less. I always hear those statistics about how wages have fallen when adjusted for inflation. I think the average middle class income should be like $90K/year adjusted for inflation.
      Rant on: It's all about the Gap. The pay at the executive level has increased something like 1000% over the past 30 years while middle class income has remained stagnant. Whereas corporate executives used to be embarrassed by making too much money in the old days now they have no problem completely raping companies to pay for their egos. Gordon was dead wrong. Greed is not good, especially when it is out of control and the game has been rigged by fraternity brother gangs at the very top. People can still get by but just surviving in the middle is becoming increasingly difficult as there is less and less pie left over for the 99%. Rant off.
      Quote Originally Posted by Fritz27 View Post
      Mercedes typically makes awful manual transmissions and fantastic auto transmissions. Choosing the stick would be like saying, "Y'know, that Natalie Portman is pretty hot, but if she grew some hair on her legs and had a dong, she'd be just right."
      Quote Originally Posted by jnm2.0t View Post
      Was it parked on the curb on garbage day?

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      05-02-2013 06:00 AM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by MrRoboto View Post
      You can be smart and think about depressing **** the whole time or you can be dumb and be oblivious to all the crap that's going on in the world today.
      This. Being unaware is a big key to happiness (at least until you get blindsided by something, but that can happen to anyone). What's the term? Blissfully unaware? And, of course, what you don't know won't hurt you.

      As for wages/salaries, the key seems to be to work in a field where the costs can be passed onto the "customers" in some fashion; the easier this is, the higher the pay and conversely the more difficult it is, the lower the pay.

    10. Member GruuvenNorth's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 06:26 AM #34
      There's a newer version of that poster...I saw it once at those funky furniture stores. It had flashing LEDs and stuff.

      Easy like Sunday Morning.

    11. Moderator aar0n.'s Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:11 AM #35
      ^
      I had that one on my wall in college. Some of the comments in here with regards to no one being able to attain real wealth anymore are absurd lol

      Quote Originally Posted by Brett92 View Post
      Yeah, wages for a lot of professional positions suck these days. I work in IT and am always amazed at the number of jobs that list a 4 year degree, 10 years experience, and multiple certifications (not Comptia, but MCSE, CCNA, etc.) as requirements, but then have a salary range of like $38K-$42K. IMO, that is crap money for those credentials.

      Meanwhile, I met a welder the other day. He's a part of a union (are there unions for white collar workers?) and he makes $35/hour. His union takes $10 right off the top, but supposedly guarantees him a pension and healthcare. Oh, and he went to a local tech college for less than a year.

      But, it could be worse. Lawyers have it really bad. My brother graduated with $175K in school debt, and if you're lucky to even get a job, you'll likely start at $50k-$60K (unless you're working for a big firm in a big city, and then you have brutal billed hour quotas). He actually told me there was a local attorney paying new graduates $40K a year!

      I'm all for the free market and I'm not necessarily a fan of unions, but it seems like we've taken a step back. I mean were more skilled/more productive than we ever have been, yet wages has dropped. Frustrating...
      Where are you located? Wages and salaries are tied into the cost of living in the area you live/work in. Entry level IT jobs at my company in NYC right now are paying $50-60k and there's plenty of potential for more but tied in with the cost of living in NYC, it really isn't much at all
      The Car Lounge summed up

      Quote Originally Posted by Fined View Post
      lots of people who post on this forum are not car OR driving enthusiasts. they just come here and post tirades/smarmy comebacks


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    12. Senior Member 6cylVWguy's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:20 AM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by aar0n. View Post
      ^
      I had that one on my wall in college. Some of the comments in here with regards to no one being able to attain real wealth anymore are absurd
      That's not really what the comments are about. They refer to the topic of the thread: that getting a college degree or more equates to instant wealth. And it's true it doesn't. I'm vastly more educated than the CEO of my company and yet he has vastly more wealth. Not that I actually care as aside from the pay, I wouldn't actually want his job.

      You can be born into money, you can be a visionary, or in some cases, you can be very good at your job. None of these require that a person has a college degree or more. But it doesn't exclude educated people either.

    13. Geriatric Member Aonarch's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:23 AM #37
      As stated higher education doesn't guarantee squat.

      Look at my aunt with two PhD's.

      Or all the dotcommers with high school diplomas.

    14. Banned Chris Stack's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:35 AM #38
      Quote Originally Posted by Brett92 View Post
      Yeah, wages for a lot of professional positions suck these days. I work in IT and am always amazed at the number of jobs that list a 4 year degree, 10 years experience, and multiple certifications (not Comptia, but MCSE, CCNA, etc.) as requirements, but then have a salary range of like $38K-$42K. IMO, that is crap money for those credentials.
      My wife and I were talking about this the other day; a financial analyst at her office was glad because he had just gotten a raise (after about 2-3 years there) and crossed the $50k threshold. She and I started just under $50k out of college...in 2005. Jobs that paid $48k in 2005 to start they are now hiring in at like $36k or $40k. Nuts.

    15. Banned Chris Stack's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:35 AM #39
      Quote Originally Posted by Aonarch View Post
      Look at my aunt with two PhD's.
      I'd like to but you didn't post a pic

    16. Banned roadtripper's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:37 AM #40
      a pair of Ds is always nice. if they're really good ones, they can even get you paid.

    17. Member Ender_'s Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:49 AM #41
      My old dorm room had some motivation as well.




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    18. Moderator aar0n.'s Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:52 AM #42
      Quote Originally Posted by 6cylVWguy View Post
      That's not really what the comments are about. They refer to the topic of the thread: that getting a college degree or more equates to instant wealth. And it's true it doesn't. I'm vastly more educated than the CEO of my company and yet he has vastly more wealth. Not that I actually care as aside from the pay, I wouldn't actually want his job.

      You can be born into money, you can be a visionary, or in some cases, you can be very good at your job. None of these require that a person has a college degree or more. But it doesn't exclude educated people either.
      You're definitely right about how a college degree doesn't guarantee anything anymore but at the same time, because the market is so saturated with college grads, an undergrad degree in 2013 is the equivalent of a HS degree 30-40 years ago. Yes, you can certainly make it in life without college, but with how so many people now have those degrees, even some basic retail/customer service jobs now require a bachelors degree That said, specific skilled trades are definitely a solid way to go and have a career and I have many friends who went this route. While it isn't a traditional bachelors degree, as other people have mentioned in this thread, there is still a large amount of time invested in learning the trade

      I was specifically referring to the posts about how only those in the medical field can be super rich or how no one in the medical field can really make that kind of money lol
      The Car Lounge summed up

      Quote Originally Posted by Fined View Post
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    19. Banned Chris Stack's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:54 AM #43
      Most of the wealthy people I know own their own business. For many, that business is a medical/dental practice. I'm sure medicine is like almost any other profession; the real money comes when you work for yourself.

    20. Member Sir UNBANNED_GERBIL M.B.'s Avatar
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      05-02-2013 09:58 AM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by LordBass View Post

      Funny I had that poster on my wall as a teen:

      That's in my basement right now


    21. 05-02-2013 10:03 AM #45
      Quote Originally Posted by aar0n. View Post
      ^
      Where are you located? Wages and salaries are tied into the cost of living in the area you live/work in. Entry level IT jobs at my company in NYC right now are paying $50-60k and there's plenty of potential for more but tied in with the cost of living in NYC, it really isn't much at all
      Wow, $50K-$60K doesn't sound like a lot at all for NYC.

      I'm in GA, so you don't need a lot of money to live, but there are entry level, "professional" (non geeksquad, etc.) IT jobs paying $25K a year. Actually, I didn't start at much more than that 5 years ago with a Bachelor's degree and A+ certification. OTOH, if you can get a job at the local military base, they pay entry level IT guys like $60K-$65K, with more specialized people getting 6 figures. I assume the pay is higher because it's federal, but also because of the clearance involved. I've thought about working there but most of the jobs are contracts with crappy shifts.

    22. Member Dscot8r!2's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 10:04 AM #46
      This is one of the greatest fallacies of all time. Some of the dumbest people I know are highly educated, and have a lot less money to their name than me. They may be good at what they do, but they suck at life.

      Hard work and fortitude provide more wealth and happiness than just having an acronym behind your name. $.02
      Lots and lots of money spent...

    23. Member lowlight's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 10:06 AM #47
      My wife & I will have a lot of student loan debt. But as NP's we'll have a flexible schedule and do what we enjoy with career growth/opportunity along the way.

      We can't live an extravagent lifestyle-but we'll travel and own nice cars. The former being more important to my wife, the latter moreso for me.

      Extrinsic motivation isn't a bad thing. I see myself with a GT-R and her with an A6 or MDX in 4-5 years.



      Current: '17 Tundra, '16 3 GT
      Past/Sold: '13 Evo, '08 Si, '12 Mustang GT, '03 Evo VIII, '01 Golf 1.8T

    24. 05-02-2013 10:10 AM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by Sir UNBANNED_GERBIL M.B. View Post
      That's in my basement right now

      It's in my garage now...........I bought it in 1985 for my dorm room back in the day.
      ***ORIGINAL OWNER*** ...............1985 TOYOTA Corolla GT-S, Hatchback, Brilliant Silver, Zenki "Hachi Roku" TRUENO

    25. Banned roadtripper's Avatar
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      05-02-2013 10:12 AM #49
      yes -- i'm going to go ahead and disagree anecdotally with this idea that only the top 5% of doctors make "real" money. in my backwater town alone, i know at least six doctors personally with very hefty sports car/racetrack funds. two are eye surgeons and one is a rheumatologist. the person that lives two doors down from me (psychiatrist) has a garage that rivals that poster. there are a lot of $$$ car nuts around here (race track a couple miles away), but my one other neighbor who's THAT crazy heavy into spending on cars owns a business -- a garage door business (no college). but he is from a different time and a different place. all the rest of them have at least a bachelors, and most of them far more.

      the BIGGEST exotic car guy in this town is a back surgeon. but remember; not all of the really rich ones spend their money on cars. it IS definitely getting tougher on the new generation of doctors, but i'm not buying that they're all suffering. the really ambitious ones will still figure it out. most of the BIG MONEY doctors have "side" interests.

      stay in school, kids. it might not be the same as getting your ticket punched, but it's still the right path for most people. if you are destined to be wealthy, you probably will be one way or the other. but at least if you do get the big score, you won't look like an ignorant hillbilly () spending it all and being out in public with your fancy new friends.

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      05-02-2013 10:15 AM #50

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