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    Thread: Wiring Question - 93 vr6

    1. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 06:08 AM #1
      back of fuse panel, D connector. Does this wire go in slot 3 or 4? i had to de-pin it to repair the wire and then i got interrupted. wire jumpers over to a connector coming off the fan harness.



      I checked here http://www.a2resource.com/electrical/CE2.html and the Bentley but nothing lines up with what I really have. Also did a bunch of google searching last night to no avail. So any help is appreciated as I think I have it in the correct spot but keep 2nd guessing myself now.

      I will likely have more questions in time as the wiring harness was messed up by the PO and I am trying to upgrade to a shaved bay/OBD2. Thanks!

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    3. Member mateok's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 07:30 AM #2
      Are you sure that came out of D connector? The reason I ask is because I don't see anything going into D/3. Canadian headlight washers used D/4, but no option used D/3.

      The A/C uses a BK/Y wire going to Q/2 that joins together with the fan harness. That connector is right below D connector. I don't mean to confuse you, I know that's tough stuff.

    4. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 08:10 AM #3
      Hey thanks for the reply. Yep it definitely came out of D. Notice in my pic I have almost nothing plugged into the fuse panel. The whole car is stripped as I work on it ever so slowly so I only have a few items plugged in at the moment. The diagram you show shows the same connection on Q2 that I keep coming back to also. But if that was the case, shouldn't I have a blk/yellow wire coming from the fan harness to the fuse panel? Nothing along that harness has been cut or modified, it is all intact until u get here at the fuse panel.

      I have been reading wiring diagrams at work all morning and I think this is something that a PO messed up. The wire in the picture went to a butt connector, to a blk/yellow wire, and to the afore mentioned 2 pin connector on the fan harness (the other wire in it is red/white if that helps).

      If it was in D/3 I think it would have power on it all the time but I have no idea why you would want this scenario. thoughts?

      Oh and AC and fans worked perfectly prior to disassembly.
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-14-2013 at 08:34 AM.

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    6. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 08:23 AM #4
      I should say that I plugged this connector into the D slot, found my note on the butt connector wire from when I disassembled the car, de-pinned the wire at the D connector, soldered the wires together, got interrupted by the fiancé, and then realized I couldn't recall where it went. All of 5 minutes. I hate wiring!

      I may to take some pictures tonight of the connectors I have coming through the firewall at this moment for clarification.

    7. Member bunkkaws's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 08:48 AM #5
      The only other black/yellow that I see according to A2 that controls the fan is

      A1/07 Horns, Radiator Cooling Fan After-Run Control Unit Black/Yellow

      I would check A1/07 and see if you have anything there.

      I do see the heated mirrors in the D but that wouldn't tap into the fan.

      Also you have nothing in D/7, which is a black/yellow wire that controls the ABS Hydraulic Pump Relay, but again that shouldn't tap into the fan.

      If i were you I would work the other way. Trace the red fan wiring that the mystery wire taps into to the fusebox, and then look it up in the bentley. If the bentley shows that a black/yellow wire is suppose to be tapped into the fan wiring, you can follow it to the correct pinout on the fusebox.

    8. Member mateok's Avatar
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      08-14-2013 10:01 AM #6
      D3 is on circuit 75/X, load reduction, powered only when ignition is ON. You'll need to turn it on to see power.

      I don't know why that's there but, either slot 3 or 4 will work. D4 goes to the fog light relay and to the turn stalk in the other direction. D3 is tied into the rear window wiper.

      D connector is a catch all for a lot of modifications. It's relatively empty and has access to all the circuits, 30, 31, 50, 15, etc. whatever it's powering will work where you currently have it (D4).

    9. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-15-2013 10:19 PM #7
      Just had a big long reply and i lost it all so this will be shorter. going out of town for the weekend so i will check this on Sunday night.

      spent the last few days digging through diagrams and harnesses. my Corrado build date is 09/1992 and seems to follow some 92-93 wiring diagrams in the Bentley and some 1993 diagrams.

      Here is the pic of the radiator fan harness connections at the fuse panel where my confusion begins including with the black/yellow "jumper" wire that I believe a PO installed to the D connector as noted above (left side of pic)


      The brown connector i have marked clearly lines up with a brown connector on the headlight harness which i had marked when i disassembled the car. It follows the 92-93 wiring diagram perfectly as seen here with a red and black/yellow wire going to the headlight harness:


      The black 2 pin connector in that first pic is where this all started. That connector makes no sense as is but according to the diagram above should have that large red wire and the current red/white wire in it and be known as T2a. That makes sense until you look at the AC harness with the 92-93 diagrams.

      According to them the other side of T2a should be red/white going to N2 (correct) AND red/white going to a fuse and then N3. the fuse and wire to N3 do not exist.


      If you go and follow the 1993 diagrams for the AC harness though it seems to make sense except it shows the red/white wire in a 4 pin connector and that is clearly an error since the same pin connection point is used twice on the diagram. The N connector in that set of diagrams shows only the connections/wires in the positions that i have on mine. The black/yellow wires all line up and make sense just not from the engine bay side.


      So, it is like i have some sort of mix of the 2 wiring diagrams. This is why it has been so much fun for me trying to figure it out. The black/yellow jumper and the large red wire would both be "hot" just at different times (correct?) with the black/yellow only being "on" with the ignition switch and the red being hot always. I think I need to remove that black/yellow jumper in the 2 pin switch and re-insert the red as according to the 1993 diagrams there is no such large red wire. Thoughts on this? Otherwise where would I put it?

      Okay final question on this front for today. While looking at all of this i found this at the AC relay covered in standard electrical tape like someone added it. What is it? is it supposed to be there...i doubt it based on looks, should i remove it?:
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-16-2013 at 08:03 AM.

    10. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 10:14 AM #8
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    11. Member sdezego's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 10:45 AM #9
      A little late to the party.. I didn't have a chance to read through this whole thing, but here is the the Correct D Connector. Notice the 2 very similar wires in D? Y/B vs B/Y (D/3 is for the Rear Wiper Power and D/7 is for the Load Reduction Relay)


    12. Member sdezego's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 10:47 AM #10
      Yes, I believe wire color can be incorrect in the bentley for N. I seem to recall when swapping my Early interior to 93 and I needed to repin that to accommodate the mixed swap.

    13. Member sdezego's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 10:50 AM #11
      Also, to answer a generalized question in regards to the load red circuits. One remains active after the ign was active at some point until you pull the key out. The other LR circuit is inactive the minute the key is turned off.

      This allows you to say, Roll up your windows or close your sunroof after shutting the car off, until you pull the key out.

    14. Member sdezego's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 10:54 AM #12
      Quote Originally Posted by weaselwhy7 View Post
      Okay final question on this front for today. While looking at all of this i found this at the AC relay covered in standard electrical tape like someone added it. What is it? is it supposed to be there...i doubt it based on looks, should i remove it?:
      oh dear... That Diode should not be there on the A/C relay. I don't know why someone did that, but I am guessing to compensate for some other wiring screw up. Maybe the relay was staying active after power was cut or something...

    15. Member mateok's Avatar
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      08-16-2013 11:32 AM #13

      That red wire looks too big for a connector. Looks like a power wire (+12v from battery) with the red clip cut off the end.

      Terminal 30 and 30B is a jumper wire (+12v to the fuel pump relay). Z1 is not used. Y/3 is direct power to the fusebox from the battery. Y/1 is power to the ECM from the battery.

      I've rebuilt quite a few harnesses that arrived looking like spaghetti in a huge box. The Bentley wiring diagram is fairly accurate (it has it's share of mistakes) but, the best tool is a multimeter set to conductivity and really long leads. Long enough to attach to one end of a wire behind the fusebox and the other to reach into the engine compartment. I don't care what the book says about wire color, size, or location - if the multimeter beeps - I know what that wire's doing.

    16. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-19-2013 10:28 AM #14
      Thanks for the replays and insight. I just got back into town last night so I will be back to messing with this in a few days.

      From the responses i am definitely removing that diode and fixing that wiring. I am still a little unsure of what to do with the big red wire. I am going to dig through other harnesses and find the butt connector that it connected to and see if that helps me at all.

      I will keep u guys updated. Thanks!
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-19-2013 at 10:36 AM.

    17. Member bunkkaws's Avatar
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      08-19-2013 04:28 PM #15
      keep us posted!

      You are right about the 92-93 wiring diagram. That's what you want. You will notice that 92-93 are for the AAA (VR6). And the other 92 only diagram is for PG (G60). I have always used the 92-93 diagrams on my 92 and it worked fine.


      This may sound like adding waaay more time to your project, but I went through this same scenario as well. It gets frustrating because with all the wires wrapped up and tangled you can't trace all the wires to their end point, and that's what you really need to do.

      I ended up pulling out the entire motor harness and unwrapping ALL the wiring tape. It will take time but will make your life WAY easier.

      Also unwrapping will expose all the broken wires that you can fix, preventing future issues. I found that many wires that were routed at 45-90 degree angles (like turned to go to the throttle body, turned to head over to the fog lights, etc. etc. ) had the jackets all cracked up from age, exposing the wires.
      Last edited by bunkkaws; 08-19-2013 at 04:30 PM.

    18. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-19-2013 05:08 PM #16
      Quote Originally Posted by bunkkaws View Post
      keep us posted!

      This may sound like adding waaay more time to your project, but I went through this same scenario as well. It gets frustrating because with all the wires wrapped up and tangled you can't trace all the wires to their end point, and that's what you really need to do.

      I ended up pulling out the entire motor harness and unwrapping ALL the wiring tape. It will take time but will make your life WAY easier.

      Also unwrapping will expose all the broken wires that you can fix, preventing future issues. I found that many wires that were routed at 45-90 degree angles (like turned to go to the throttle body, turned to head over to the fog lights, etc. etc. ) had the jackets all cracked up from age, exposing the wires.
      I have done this as well! Since I am doing a shaved bay and upgrading to OBD2 I unwrapped everything as I lengthened wires. I found whole places where multiple wires had been "sawed" through and were hanging on by only a few copper strands. I am amazed it was never on fire. That's also why this situation frustrates me. Everything looks good on the radiator fan harness until I get to the fuse block and run into the situation as noted above. I'm somewhat of a perfectionist so I will figure it out eventually and get it all corrected.

    19. Member sdezego's Avatar
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      08-20-2013 12:28 AM #17
      I wonder if that red wire was from the Alarn that someone removed or bypassed. If I recall, one if the starter lockout wires on the 93 are Red and the other is Red with a Green stripe (pictured in one of your above pictures). Either that or it is a +12v source to the Fuse panel from the batt as mentioned.

      Track it back and see where it goes. That is an important one, but may have been hacked, bypassed, etc.

    20. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-20-2013 08:09 PM #18
      That big red wire is the only thing confusing me at this point. It goes only to a vw factory wire weld point (see pic) and splits to the battery and the fan control module. This is similar to what a bunch of diagrams show with that wire going to the mysterious fuse 23 of the AC system. No such fuse exists anywhere though.

      This site has helped some and confused me some
      http://www.autolib.diakom.ru/CAR/Vol...GRAMS/7387.pdf

      The black/yellow jumper wire should not exist unless you look at some early Passat diagrams but then those AC systems are not wired anything like mine. Mine is 100% following the 1993 Corrado diagram. So for now I am leaving this jumper alone and dealing with the large red wire above. That is my priority.

      Also I noticed the fan control module has a big blue wire in it going to the radiator fan. After staring at diagrams for days I knew that color was odd. NO diagrams I have seen show a blue wire. It's correct in what it does but I was hoping this might shed some light on where this fan harness originated. You can also clearly see the large red wire here
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-20-2013 at 08:29 PM.

    21. Member Lysholmrado's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 01:37 AM #19
      my fan harness had the blue wire as well. just reference to the blue wire like it is the red green wire the bentley. The blue wire goes from the fan connector #4 position to the fan control module T4/1. Bentley has it correct but there was a change to the color of this wire for some reason on the later SLC's. My car is a 92 so I would guess that you have a early 93 car

    22. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 06:15 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by Lysholmrado View Post
      my fan harness had the blue wire as well. just reference to the blue wire like it is the red green wire the bentley. The blue wire goes from the fan connector #4 position to the fan control module T4/1. Bentley has it correct but there was a change to the color of this wire for some reason on the later SLC's. My car is a 92 so I would guess that you have a early 93 car
      Correct on blue wiring and correct on early 93 model. On your harness where does the large red wire go once inside the firewall??

    23. Member mateok's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 07:24 AM #21
      That depends on his wiring. He appears to have a hybrid '92 AAA and after Aug '93 setup. On early VR's that wire went from the battery to the FCM, into the cabin, into T2a/2, into the S23 (30A), and terminating at N3.

      Later VR's are wired completely different. They don't have the S23 fuse, which according to every wiring diagram I have, is part of a relay setup. This is an auxiliary mounted fuse.
      Last edited by mateok; 08-21-2013 at 07:29 AM.

    24. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 09:37 AM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by mateok View Post
      That depends on his wiring. He appears to have a hybrid '92 AAA and after Aug '93 setup. On early VR's that wire went from the battery to the FCM, into the cabin, into T2a/2, into the S23 (30A), and terminating at N3.

      Later VR's are wired completely different. They don't have the S23 fuse, which according to every wiring diagram I have, is part of a relay setup.
      Yeah it sounds like his car is like mine that made me ask the question. I have no fuse 23. Nor does my N harness have all of the connections as shown in the diagram you have shown. If my big red wire went to T2a/2 it would go where the black/yellow jumper wire from D is going now. That then feeds over to Q and not to N3. Thus a whole circuit that is hot only when the ignition is on would be hot all the time. That can't be correct.

      Best I can tell at this point is that I may just need to completely remove this red wire.
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-21-2013 at 11:13 AM.

    25. Member bunkkaws's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 11:33 AM #23
      Quote Originally Posted by weaselwhy7 View Post
      Yeah it sounds like his car is like mine that made me ask the question. I have no fuse 23. Nor does my N harness have all of the connections as shown in the diagram you have shown. If my big red wire went to T2a/2 it would go where the black/yellow jumper wire from D is going now. That then feeds over to Q and not to N3. Thus a whole circuit that is hot only when the ignition is on would be hot all the time. That can't be correct.

      Best I can tell at this point is that I may just need to completely remove this red wire.

      I believe mateok meant by auxiliary is that it's not on the fusebox. I have a few wires as well in my C that have a factory inline fuse separate from the fuse box. They are suppose to clip on top of the fuse box but sometimes the connectors break with age.

      If you look at the wiring diagrams the "gray box" is suppose to be the fuse box, and if the fuse is on the fuse box it's listed inside the gray box.

      Now look at S23, it's outside the fuse box, which should mean that's it's a separate inline fuse.

      So if I were you I would just literally run an inline fuse yourself, I think they sell them at the local auto store.

      Here is a pic I found for reference

      Last edited by bunkkaws; 08-21-2013 at 11:48 AM.

    26. Member weaselwhy7's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 11:57 AM #24
      Quote Originally Posted by bunkkaws View Post
      I believe mateok meant by auxiliary is that it's not on the fusebox. I have a few wires as well in my C that have a factory inline fuse separate from the fuse box. They are suppose to clip on top of the fuse box but sometimes the connectors break with age.

      If you look at the wiring diagrams the "gray box" is suppose to be the fuse box, and if the fuse is on the fuse box it's listed inside the gray box.

      Now look at S23, it's outside the fuse box, which should mean that's it's an separate inline fuse.

      So if I were you I would just literally run an inline fuse yourself, I think they sell them at the local auto store.
      ]
      I thought about doing this as well. But the question remains lol. What do I do with the wire coming out if that fuse? It cannot go to the AC harness which for the reasons I list in my last post would tie it in to the black/yellow circuit. I am heavily leaning towards chopping it out at this point and leaving the odd jumper from D in place.
      As best I can tell the red wire was butt connected/hacked to tie into the ABS system. It definitely should have never been like that. I think it was just making a loop back to the battery even. What likely happened is one of these harnesses got fried at some point, likely the AC system, and a PO put in the later 1993 AC harness. This left the red wire not being used so they just tied it to another red wire lol. There is no rhyme or reason for any of it but since I have deleted the ABS system I can just toss this too.

      My car s like a giant puzzle. It's actually a lot of fun trying to figure this stuff out
      Last edited by weaselwhy7; 08-21-2013 at 12:06 PM.

    27. Member mateok's Avatar
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      08-21-2013 01:15 PM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by weaselwhy7 View Post
      My car s like a giant puzzle. It's actually a lot of fun trying to figure this stuff out
      I find it interesting myself. It can be quite challenging at times, which makes the reward that much sweeter.

      What VW changed between the two wiring harnesses is the way the power is delivered. Early VR's used S6 (20A) and ran all the power through the A/C switch. I think we've all seen melted HVAC controls.

      They soon realized their mistake and changed it. Later VR's used S6 (30A) and ran power through the fresh air blower switch instead.

      Power and ground no longer went through the fusebox for the FCM. Those two were connected directly to the battery. There was no need for S23 to exist anymore so, it was deleted.

      The original design looks forced. Like they ran out of time and had to make it work. Late '90's fusebox's started looking like Lego's with all the aux fuses stacked up. Obviously, the more complicated electronics became meant a single central electronics was no longer viable. Newer VW are a breeze compared to ours

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