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New Head Gasket install

3K views 11 replies 4 participants last post by  Rocket88 
#1 ·
Well it came time for my 90 G60 to have the head gasket replaced. I have been lurking and studying forums about head gasket replacement and figured I have the tools and ability to tackle this task. I ordered a victor reinz gasket kit and began taking things apart. All the intake manifold and exhaust bolts came out without issue. Amazed after the car sat for over 13 yrs. Took the head to have it decked and was bead blasted to take off grime and such. I bought new head bolts just standard stretch bolts. Placed the head gasket on put all 10 bolts in finger tight and then realized I forgot to put on the alternator bracket. I took the head back off and put the bracket on and then placed the head back on. Put all 10 head bolts back in and torqued in sequence per Bently manual. Put everything back together, rolled the engine over by hand and everything seemed ok. So now its time to start the car. car fired up and sounded wonderful. I walked around to the front to admire my hard work and I see water bubbles and a small oil leak start between the 3rd and 4th piston. I don't know where to start and I am extremely disappointed. I am sure there are a lot of variables in the but I am looking for feedback positive and negative both and what to do next other then put this thing in the Vortex classifieds.
 
#2 ·
That is extremely disappointing as I am sure you know.. First thing is to take it back apart and carefully find the reason for this.

Typical causes are a small piece of the factory paper gasket left behind on the block. Multi Layer metal gaskets are great, but have little sympathy for gross imperfections like a piece of gasket material, too course of head deck cuts, etc.

Leave the manifolds and such on the head as a unit and pull it apart. Then we can recommend how to resolve if other than say a piece of gasket material left behind.
 
#3 ·
How did you clean the block? Did you use any air powered tools to clean the surface? If you did, then the block was probably damaged and needs to be shaved. The block would need to be removed and disassembled so the machine shop can shave it.

If you cleaned it by hand, then you may have missed something. You can try using a knife sharpening stone to see where the high/low spots are. Watch where the debris of the stone goes too. You do not want it in the cylinder bores.

If you did use air tools to clean the surface, do not do that any more. Even professionals have issues with them. I did when I was younger. One time is all it takes.
 
#4 ·
I should have added a picture of the head before it was installed. The old gasket came off easily as a whole but i could see where the failure was initially on the old gasket. I took a wood block and lightly sanded the block making sure the old gasket and any residue was gone. i am wondering now if you are right in saying the cut marks after having it machined are too deep. The machine shop is a very reputable place for my area and has done many VW gas and diesel heads both. What am I looking for when I take the head back off?
 
#5 · (Edited)
... What am I looking for when I take the head back off?
Before we assume anything, you are just looking for evidence of where it is leaking and why. Look for small piece of paper gasket, piece of carbon, etc left on the block. Look for any deep or significant scratches on both the block and head.

If nothing indicates any issue, you may need to take a straight edge to the Block and or head. Less inclined to think it is head, but you never know...

Did the car overheat originally? If so, there could be a crack or warpage some where.
 
#6 ·
The area you describe is shown in the attached picture. The oil galley at 4 o’clock to the head stud, and the water jacket at 9 o’clock. I’d be looking at the block and head in that area for trapped debris, or tool marks.



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#7 ·
Took the head back off and here are pictures.

I believe some of the problem was that I was told to dupe head bolts in oil before I put them in. I'm afraid I use too much and possibly got too much in the bolt hole and almost hydroloced the bolt and it torqued before it was fully seated? I'm at a loss now.


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#8 · (Edited)
Your idea has merit in principle. A light coating of oil on the head bolt threads, just enough to not have a dry fastener interface produce a false TQ reading. Oil running out of the bolt hole over and into the gasket surface could have been enough to cause a leak.


Time to get a straight edge on the block and head. Lay it across the head the long way, from corner to corner, and use feeler gauges to measure any variance. I suspect you will find very little on both the head and the block- the allowable value is .1mm (.003"). Is it possible you just deformed the head gasket by placing the head down unevenly? How did you come across the gasket? Any evidence the packaging was squeezed etc? Ive gotten head gaskets from World Pac at the shop that have been ruined by packing them in a box (bent, cracks, fissures, compression evidence etc).
 
#9 ·
Head gasket was from AutohauzAZ. It was a complete victor reinz set. Came in a large box. I saw no reason that the gasket would have been compromised. The head was just machined within days of putting it all back together. I will straight edge both and see if i can find any issues. At this point is the gasket reusable? or Do I need to purchase another along with new head bolts of course.
 
#12 ·
On the subject of head bolts: I have been turning wrenches as a vocation for 30+ years. Back in the 80s we NEVER bough new head bolts for VWs. EVER. Most of the factory training materials of the day said you could reuse them once. Some made no mention what soever. YMMV but Id say if you used new bolts last go round, use them again.
 
#10 ·
Many newer metal headgaskets have silicone printed on the edges to be the final protection against fluids leaking out. I do not believe yours has this technology. I'm not a fan of sealers. Sealers should not be used on a gasket or seal surfaces. There are exceptions. If there is a 3 way joint, a small dab of silicone has it's merit. Aviation form a gasket was also used around the shop for those stubborn areas or areas where you knew there may be an issue.

I would not have an issue recommending a small amount of sealer around the edge of the head gasket as well as the oil port. Buy some sealer, paint it on with an acid brush/applicator on both sides of the gasket and you should be fine. DO NOT put anything around the combustion chambers. Just around the entire perimeter of the gasket and the oil feed line to the head [both sides of the gasket].

As someone mentioned above, metal headgaskets are great, but they do not like imperfections like an old school fiber head gasket.

https://www.permatex.com/products/g...x-aviation-form-a-gasket-no-3-sealant-liquid/
 
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