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    Thread: The 2020 Toyota Supra Is Finally Here With 335 HP, Does Zero to 60 in 4.1 Seconds

    1. Member Disgruntled Ziemniak's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 11:18 AM #26
      I find it odd how the old one looks so damn big while the new one looks rather small (almost like a BRZ). I mean, sure, they're both about the same size, but it's just a weird divide. Regardless, I think this car will be great, I just wish it was sold with a 6spd is all.

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      01-14-2019 11:24 AM #27
      I expected it to be about ten grand more, so I'm not entirely surprised at the price. I think the biggest issue I'd have with it though is that if I'm buying a Toyota, I kinda want to have that feel-good Toyota reliability baked into the car. Not a Toyota that is expecting BMW levels of maintenance or pricing. It's not bad by any stretch, but I think with it being drawn out for so long before finally coming out, it's nothing surprising to me.

    4. 01-14-2019 11:27 AM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by troyguitar View Post
      Why are you comparing it to 1994? Compare it to its competition: 2019 Corvette. Same weight and size and price and form factor and lack of luxury badge - 2 more cylinders and over 100 more hp plus a manual option.
      Corvette may be going WAY upmarket if the Zora rumors are true. So it's competition will be Mustangs, Camaros and 370Z's I guess. EDIT: they benchmarked the Cayman so that's who they think their competition is . . .
      Last edited by Rob; 01-14-2019 at 11:33 AM.

    5. I got a poop emoji! CHEVY!! Time for an aSS's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 11:31 AM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by Hajduk View Post
      It's very ugly though.
      Looks kinda clown shoe'ish from the fender panel angle shot.
      Quote Originally Posted by @McMike View Post
      We can not be trusted.

    6. 01-14-2019 11:32 AM #30
      Quote Originally Posted by Turbo II View Post
      Again, I've compared it before and will do again, Mustang Ecoboost Premium w/Performance Package can be had for low 30s all day long giving 310HP and 350 lb-ft easily raised to Supra values by Ford Performance tune for less than $1k.
      I own the most potent Ecoboost 2.3 and it's a very good motor, but it isn't an all time great. I have driven a BMW 340i and there is no comparison in the motors. Sure they both offer a lot of power, but that's where similarities end. I'd take that straight 6 any day, anytime.

    7. Senior Member JustinCSVT's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 11:34 AM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by JackStraw79 View Post
      It wouldn't surprise me that Toyota desired a more reliable state of tune for the "base" Supra, and also room for improvement for future high perfromance versions.
      I highly doubt there’s any difference in reliability between engines only 50hp apart.

      I can see holding off for a higher performance version later. Doesn’t make sense me just given that the Z4 has the higher hp version standard. Why sell two different engines for this platform to the US market?

    8. Senior Member Mazda 3s's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 11:38 AM #32










































































































      "Of course that's just my opinion; I could be wrong."

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      01-14-2019 11:44 AM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by Rob View Post
      I own the most potent Ecoboost 2.3 and it's a very good motor, but it isn't an all time great. I have driven a BMW 340i and there is no comparison in the motors. Sure they both offer a lot of power, but that's where similarities end. I'd take that straight 6 any day, anytime.
      Yeah, you lose a lot of information when you magazine race against the I6 turbo BMW engines. They're some of my favorite engines bar none. Peak HP #s might not be far off, but only one offers mountains of torque all day long. I wonder what (if any) accessory changes Toyota made to promote reliability. the rotating assemblies for the N5X (and probably B58) are very robust. It's all the junk attached to them that goes out over time. I also wonder if the development cross pollination carried over to the BMW products with the same engine family (ie: will the new BMWs actually have cooling systems that last more than 60k miles?!).

      Also betting on the HP differences being down exclusively to state of tune and that we'll see a full-beans A90 down the road.

    10. 01-14-2019 11:48 AM #34
      A Toyota that looks like a BMW on the inside, and sounds like a BMW on the outside, is not a Toyota. No amount of badges will change that.
      Quote Originally Posted by Captain Picard, Hide and Q
      What he might say with irony, I say with conviction. What a piece of work is man, How noble in reason, how infinite in faculty, In form and moving how express and admirable, In action how like an Angel, In apprehension how like a god!

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      01-14-2019 11:55 AM #35
      Quote Originally Posted by troyguitar View Post
      $50k base hahaha yeah ok, let me go get my wallet. I'll be right back.
      Why not? It looks like it'll do the straight line stuff, as well as a Cayman. They also benchmarked the Cayman for handling. If it can run with a Cayman and starts at $10,000 less...it's worth a look. At least you're getting a straight 6 instead of the awful moan of the flat-4.

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      01-14-2019 12:00 PM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by JustinCSVT View Post
      I highly doubt there’s any difference in reliability between engines only 50hp apart.

      I can see holding off for a higher performance version later. Doesn’t make sense me just given that the Z4 has the higher hp version standard. Why sell two different engines for this platform to the US market?
      It was probably the cost of getting into bed with BMW. It wouldn't surprise me if BMW gets some time-limited exclusivity to keep the Supra from cannibalizing the Z4.
      Last edited by unhappymeal; 01-14-2019 at 12:03 PM.

    13. Member nyexx's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:09 PM #37
      Big mistake not offering a manual at launch

    14. 01-14-2019 12:09 PM #38
      Quote Originally Posted by ForTheWin View Post
      A Toyota that looks like a BMW on the inside, and sounds like a BMW on the outside, is not a Toyota. No amount of badges will change that.
      Or you can just be happy that in an era of endless pick up trucks and CUV's, there's a new sports car with a lot going for it. But why would you look on the bright side when it's easier to bitch and moan?

    15. I’m not a loser. I’m a winnah!! patrikman's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:10 PM #39
      Nope.
      this signature kills fascists.

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    16. Member Mike!'s Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:10 PM #40
      Quote Originally Posted by Lukec436 View Post
      I find it odd how the old one looks so damn big while the new one looks rather small (almost like a BRZ).
      After 4 generations with at least a "+2" rear seat,

      they've gone and made a Z4 coupe. So that's why and how it's shrunk.

      I guess it discourages comparisons to more affordable pony cars or M240i, etc., that way, but in the same breath it also highlights to me that you can buy a C7 Corvette for similar money.

    17. Moderator Oliver@triplezoom's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:14 PM #41
      Quote Originally Posted by unhappymeal View Post
      It was probably the cost of getting into bed with BMW. It wouldn't surprise me if BMW gets some time-limited exclusivity to keep the Supra from cannibalizing the Z4.
      Do you really think the two will be cross shopped by more than a handful of buyers?

    18. 01-14-2019 12:17 PM #42
      Quote Originally Posted by Rob View Post
      Or you can just be happy that in an era of endless pick up trucks and CUV's, there's a new sports car with a lot going for it. But why would you look on the bright side when it's easier to bitch and moan?
      Because we were promised a Supra, and were given an M240 lite.
      Quote Originally Posted by Captain Picard, Hide and Q
      What he might say with irony, I say with conviction. What a piece of work is man, How noble in reason, how infinite in faculty, In form and moving how express and admirable, In action how like an Angel, In apprehension how like a god!

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      01-14-2019 12:18 PM #43
      I think both look pretty fun. Wild, not super bloated, BMW and Toyota are both engineering super powers.

      The Z4 pics in the latest R&T are good too - the dark gray is a good color for the car.

      Price: to be expected
      Power: more than is really needed to have fun
      Interior/exterior styling: wild and fun
      Transmission: No manual is a bad idea. Why not just make 10% of them manual and charge a lot more?

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      01-14-2019 12:19 PM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      Do you really think the two will be cross shopped by more than a handful of buyers?
      Probably not, but what are the other business rationales? They are coming from the same factory. Why would you have the added complexity on the line for anything other than market place differentiation? I suppose the other explanation is that was the only engine they could offer to meet Toyota's target price points, but I'm not sure there is much mechanically different between the B58B30M1 and the B58B30O1.

      Edit: Weird. It seems from the Supra forum that the Z4 and the Supra are both getting the same B58, but the Supra has the EU a particulate filter on it that cuts output.
      Last edited by unhappymeal; 01-14-2019 at 12:28 PM.

    21. Member Icantdrive65's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:22 PM #45
      Quote Originally Posted by ForTheWin View Post
      A Toyota that looks like a BMW on the inside, and sounds like a BMW on the outside, is not a Toyota. No amount of badges will change that.
      I don't know about that. It has that distinctive Toyota really ugly exterior.

      Seriously, the more I look at it, the uglier it gets.
      Bought my old R32 back this year. IG @boomerang_r32

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      01-14-2019 12:23 PM #46
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      ...which was cancelled after its sales dropped because it was too expensive. Just saying that's a low bar
      To be fair, all sports coupe sales declined in North America in that era, at all price points. And most of them went away for good, not just the Supra, which in turbo form had a base of $39,900 25 yrs ago.

      You could drop $10K off the MSPR of this new one and it won't guarantee success. The market for this type of car will always be a limited sales niche one.

    23. Moderator Oliver@triplezoom's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:24 PM #47
      Quote Originally Posted by ForTheWin View Post
      Because we were promised a Supra, and were given an M240 lite.
      We've known for years that this was essentially going to be a BMW.

    24. Geriatric Member absoluteczech's Avatar
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      01-14-2019 12:25 PM #48
      Think the car looks great

    25. Member
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      01-14-2019 12:26 PM #49
      Looks great and it's good to know sports car are still being developed.

    26. 01-14-2019 12:27 PM #50
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      We've known for years that this was essentially going to be a BMW.
      Oh of course. How much of a BMW was up for grabs, but after seeing and hearing it, I'm not falling into the "thrilled" category.
      Quote Originally Posted by Captain Picard, Hide and Q
      What he might say with irony, I say with conviction. What a piece of work is man, How noble in reason, how infinite in faculty, In form and moving how express and admirable, In action how like an Angel, In apprehension how like a god!

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