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    Thread: The 2020 Toyota Supra Is Finally Here With 335 HP, Does Zero to 60 in 4.1 Seconds

    1. Member
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      05-15-2019 12:37 PM #926
      Quote Originally Posted by Seabird View Post
      See, again. I don't understand what that means. I don't really follow BMW so the reference is lost on me.
      Each year of production the M2 got better and made the old one look old. But M2 owners seem to be enjoying their cars too much to care.

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    3. Member Smigelski's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 12:44 PM #927
      Quote Originally Posted by ND40oz View Post
      The 385 hp variants are already in production, I would not buy a launch edition car at this point. This is a 2020 model year vin:

      Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that say '285' under Power?

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      05-15-2019 12:50 PM #928
      Quote Originally Posted by Smigelski View Post
      Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that say '285' under Power?
      I believe that's in kW.

    5. Member Smigelski's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 12:51 PM #929
      Quote Originally Posted by ghost03 View Post
      I believe that's in kW.
      Brain fart on my part. Thanks.

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      05-15-2019 12:55 PM #930
      Quote Originally Posted by ghost03 View Post
      The B58 motor is in a bunch of different vehicles marketed at different levels, (340i=320hp, M240i=335hp, X3 M40i = 355hp, Z4 M40i = 382hp, Supra = 335hp), but it's not really clear that they're power levels are that different as opposed to just marketing specs. Indeed, based on performance it seems plausible that all of them make somewhere around 370-380hp, but we'll have a better idea if the Z4 is actually more powerful once we see some instrumented tests. Maybe it will be closer to 400 in reality--tbh I hope so--and that the Supra gets that config too.
      Ah, okay. That makes more sense.
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    7. Member andlf's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 12:59 PM #931
      Long time no see.

      These numbers were from an early test car though.






      These acceleration numbers were more representative for stock.

      The 300 ft skidpad numbers vary wildly here though. .88 t0 .95.



      Carz: allpic My 3 C's- Challenger, Camaro & Corrado -*Dusk Edition SS-*Group-*Challenger RT
      Quote Originally Posted by 20aeman View Post
      Yep, when I see andlf as the thread starter, it's a mandatory click now.
      G stands for GRENADE, 60 stands for what the tach says when it happens!.."Here"

    8. 05-15-2019 01:04 PM #932
      Bimmerpost insider said the Supra will come with two I6s. Kinda like the old E89.

      https://g29.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...01686&page=101

      Quote Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
      So, I have a request for whoever has connections in the Supra circles. Please tell those guys that all that BS by Toyota engineers about 335hp being just the right amount of power for the car was just that - BS. The 385hp version (matching the US Z4 M40i) is coming. It will be sold in the U.S. and the countries not subject to Euro emissions regulations: Korea, Japan, Russia, Gulf states.
      Quote Originally Posted by ynguldyn View Post
      Yeah, this jives really well with what I see. Toyota is likely planning to sell the two versions alongside each other, and they'll need to give the higher powered version some distinguishing label. "Track" would work for the purpose.

      I truly believe (translation: I'm speculating here, not reporting facts) this whole mess was caused by WLTP. If not for that, all Z4 M40i's would've had B58O1 so that all M Performance 3/4 series cars (as of right now, X3 M40i, M340i, and Z4 M40i) would have had the same power in all world markets. Something (mostly likely packaging) prevented BMW engineers from installing the same emissions hardware in Z4 as they could in M340i. That resulted in the European Z4 M40i that got its wings kinda clipped with B58M1. Naturally the same had to happen to the Supra (because it's a freaking BMW, people! enough with that "Tada-san this, Tada-san that" kool-aid, OK?) for the WLTP markets, and Toyota just went with this for all other markets, probably for simplicity and cost savings. And then they had a change of heart - very recently. From what I can see, this likely happened in 2018, no earlier than that, so it could well be in response to the early feedback when the 335hp figure leaked and everyone and their mother started talking about it being a ridiculously low number for a Supra.

      And while we're on the subject - how did you guys at suprakmv arrive at the idea that the difference between B58M1 and B58O1 is just the manifold? You never had to deal with BMW engineering solutions, have you? Observe:

      https://bimmercat.com/bmw/EN/search/...8D/ECE/11_7972
      https://bimmercat.com/bmw/EN/search/...8C/ECE/11_7809

      Yeah, the engine blocks are different. And then the cylinder heads and the pistons are different, and the turbochargers are not even close. And that's only the obvious things I bothered to compare.

      So sure you can mod the M1 to get it to O1's output and beyond. But that will never get you an OEM equivalent.

    9. Senior Member Ryukein's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 06:57 PM #933
      Okay, so I drove the Supra today. Not for very long—I'll hopefully get a couple hours in it on really great roads tomorrow—but it was enough for good first impressions...

      Holy **** is it good to drive.

      Quote Originally Posted by andlf View Post
      Long time no see.

      These numbers were from an early test car though.

      These acceleration numbers were more representative for stock.

      The 300 ft skidpad numbers vary wildly here though. .88 t0 .95.
      Yeah, I'm aware. I used that 1993 first test partially because it's the only one on our site, and partially because it was our first test of the car. Plus the 2020 Supra we have is a prototype, too. We tested probably five or six Mark IV Turbos over the years and the numbers varied for all of them.
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    10. Member andlf's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 08:47 PM #934
      Quote Originally Posted by Ryukein View Post
      Okay, so I drove the Supra today. Not for very long—I'll hopefully get a couple hours in it on really great roads tomorrow—but it was enough for good first impressions...

      Holy **** is it good to drive.



      Yeah, I'm aware. I used that 1993 first test partially because it's the only one on our site, and partially because it was our first test of the car. Plus the 2020 Supra we have is a prototype, too. We tested probably five or six Mark IV Turbos over the years and the numbers varied for all of them.

      Ok, gotcha!
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      Quote Originally Posted by 20aeman View Post
      Yep, when I see andlf as the thread starter, it's a mandatory click now.
      G stands for GRENADE, 60 stands for what the tach says when it happens!.."Here"

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      05-15-2019 09:09 PM #935
      Quote Originally Posted by Ryukein View Post
      Okay, so I drove the Supra today. Not for very long—I'll hopefully get a couple hours in it on really great roads tomorrow—but it was enough for good first impressions...

      Holy **** is it good to drive.
      Glad to hear it. Have fun!
      You look nice today.

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      05-15-2019 09:52 PM #936
      Quote Originally Posted by Ryukein View Post
      Okay, so I drove the Supra today. Not for very long—I'll hopefully get a couple hours in it on really great roads tomorrow—but it was enough for good first impressions...

      Holy **** is it good to drive.



      Yeah, I'm aware. I used that 1993 first test partially because it's the only one on our site, and partially because it was our first test of the car. Plus the 2020 Supra we have is a prototype, too. We tested probably five or six Mark IV Turbos over the years and the numbers varied for all of them.
      Wow! Looking forward to more impressions, and seeing these on the road. I was dubious about this Zupra thing, I must admit.

    13. Member vwpiloto's Avatar
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      05-15-2019 10:56 PM #937
      Probably a good time to revisit this article from Jalopnik.

      How BMW and Toyota Overcame a Culture Clash to Design the New Supra

    14. 05-16-2019 06:42 AM #938
      thats in kw, its 385 hp

      Quote Originally Posted by Smigelski View Post
      Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't that say '285' under Power?

    15. 05-16-2019 02:00 PM #939



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      05-16-2019 02:54 PM #940


      What the hell is going on with the tach @ 4-5 seconds?


      Also sounds pretty boring. Thank god the US version is louder.
      Last edited by Quinn1.8t; 05-16-2019 at 02:57 PM.

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      05-16-2019 02:57 PM #941
      Quote Originally Posted by vb22 View Post
      It does bother me a little bit that they have their own font for the numbers on the tach/speedo but use the BMW font for the odometer/clock/temp/etc.

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      05-16-2019 03:23 PM #942
      Quote Originally Posted by ghost03 View Post
      It does bother me a little bit that they have their own font for the numbers on the tach/speedo but use the BMW font for the odometer/clock/temp/etc.
      What bothers me is that they didn't just use the BMW gauges and just program them differently. The full digital cluster looks so much better than whatever that is. They could have used the older non-virtual cockpit that the 5er and X3/X4 currently have if they wanted to further differentiate from the Z4.
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    19. Member andlf's Avatar
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      05-16-2019 04:42 PM #943
      Quote Originally Posted by Quinn1.8t View Post


      What the hell is going on with the tach @ 4-5 seconds?


      Also sounds pretty boring. Thank god the US version is louder.
      yeah, that's strange.
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      Quote Originally Posted by 20aeman View Post
      Yep, when I see andlf as the thread starter, it's a mandatory click now.
      G stands for GRENADE, 60 stands for what the tach says when it happens!.."Here"

    20. 05-16-2019 04:45 PM #944
      Quote Originally Posted by Quinn1.8t View Post


      What the hell is going on with the tach @ 4-5 seconds?


      Also sounds pretty boring. Thank god the US version is louder.
      Shifting. Look at the gear indicator just above "Sport traction". It changes with each drop in the tach.
      Last edited by ForTheWin; 05-16-2019 at 04:48 PM.
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      05-16-2019 04:45 PM #945
      Quote Originally Posted by andlf View Post
      yeah, that's strange.
      Maybe this Toyota also comes with a torque dip.

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      05-16-2019 05:03 PM #946
      Quote Originally Posted by ForTheWin View Post
      Shifting. Look at the gear indicator just above "Sport traction". It changes with each drop in the tach.
      There's an extra "jump" in the tach during the 1-2 shift though. But I just realized that it's probably traction control.

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      05-16-2019 05:09 PM #947
      Quote Originally Posted by Quinn1.8t View Post
      There's an extra "jump" in the tach during the 1-2 shift though. But I just realized that it's probably traction control.
      Electronic tach can't keep up with the revs. No change in engine sound so it was still accelerating hard.

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      05-16-2019 05:20 PM #948
      Quote Originally Posted by JustinCSVT View Post
      No change in engine sound so it was still accelerating hard.
      Good point.

      Quote Originally Posted by JustinCSVT View Post
      Electronic tach can't keep up with the revs.
      Is this really the explanation though? Plenty of faster-revving vehicles/bikes use electronic tachs without this issue?

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      05-16-2019 05:46 PM #949
      If you look at the speedo, it's showing nearly 5.5k rpm at 60kph (37.2 mph) in 2nd gear. That doesn't make sense to me if the converter is locked, but 4k might. So, I think it went to second, locked the torque converter, bogged a little down to 4k, and unlocked it shooting up to 5k.

      If so, I wouldn't read too much into it. All the testing with different drivers these press cars get probably drives the adaptations crazy.

    26. Member Meroving1an's Avatar
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      05-16-2019 05:47 PM #950
      Quote Originally Posted by vb22 View Post
      This instrument cluster design looks like belong on the MK4 Supra. I appreciate the center tach, but it really doesn't look good. Numbers too big, needle too tiny.

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