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    Thread: ABS Brake bleed with scantool, help?!

    1. Member T3Bunny's Avatar
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      2001 Golf GL VR6. 1977 Rabbit
      06-12-2019 09:05 PM #1
      Okay I have a Jetta giving me nightmares. It is a 2001 TDI with the MK60 brake system on it. The master has been replaced and it had been run dry.

      My problem is simple, I am NOT using VCDS (and I don't have access to one, or time to buy one). Instead I am using a Launch. I can do the bleed with it, but nowhere in my 17 steps does it specifically say "open" or "close" the bleeder valves. Obviously I need to.

      Every resource I have found online simply says "Follow the scantool instructions step by step." Yeah well that isn't working.

      ABS pump activates first, then again at each wheel after a valve opens in the module and the pedal drops. So I have a tool that is working, just not telling me where I need to open the bleeders in the process. And it seems like only the fronts get opened???

      Any better directions or clarifications would be greatly helpful!

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    3. 06-12-2019 09:11 PM #2
      You dont need to. You bleed the brakes. ABS is done by the tool via its internal valves.

      Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
      Shade Tree Wrencher
      2010 Jetta Wolfsburg 2.0T

    4. Member T3Bunny's Avatar
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      2001 Golf GL VR6. 1977 Rabbit
      06-12-2019 11:09 PM #3
      -=sigh=- That wasn't the answer I was hoping for. I have put three master cylinders on this. I have rum 4-5 big bottles of DOT 4 through it, with a proper pressure bleeder. The brakes have been bled a dozen times or more. I have run it through its process with both scan tools a dozen times each. I am convinced there is air in the ABS system and it is not coming out.

      Powered off, the pedal is rock hard. Once it is started, it acts like a bad master. Pedal might go to the floor, it might not. Pop it, goes hard. Hold it and slowly sinks down to the floor, or pretty close to it.

      The car's owner is 19 and, well she is 19. Got in a accident because she claimed "The brakes stopped working." Nobody believed her. My boss and coworker drove the car and thought there was nothing wrong. I drove it, stopped fine too. I had a feeling though and I drove it a couple more times and FINALLY just once the pedal went to the floor for me and I had to pop it to stop.

      Maybe I didn't pay specific attention before, but after that I realized that I could, slowly, put the pedal to the floor. Every sign of a bad master.

      On the very first scan, I pulled some "Implausible signal" out of the ABS module. Cleared the codes and test drove 2-3 times since. Nothing has come back up.

      Cost for a new ABS module is ASTRONOMICAL. Our cost was $1400!!! That FAR exceeds what she can afford. And I do not want to put an ABS module on a car where I see tons of references to air in the ABS and these being a pain to bleed. I have just enough pedal left to think it is not bypassing in the module, but that there is air trapped somewhere in the module or maybe a line.

      The references I found online to bleeding the ABS were talking about opening up the front bleeders during the process...

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    6. 06-13-2019 12:30 AM #4
      Sorry man.

      Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
      Shade Tree Wrencher
      2010 Jetta Wolfsburg 2.0T

    7. Member
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      99.5 Jetta
      06-13-2019 01:03 AM #5
      As long as you have a tool that can activate the abs... or cycle that pump...


      I think the bently state some where for you to make sure the master cylinder is good, bench bleed or bleeded ... etc....

      bleed the clutch if you have it first then the master cylinder, activate the abs pump and proceed to the the procedure to bleed the brakes in orders of either the furthest to the closet or closest to furthest... dependents on the two version of the abs that MKIVs have.

      in reality... when my back line was corroded and needed replacing all the fluid drain out, after a couple of days waiting for parts.... I have the similar symptom I think... except I was using the two men method... now I got the pressure bleeder


      fill the fluids
      I have an auto so skipped clutch... and I didn't even bleed the MC, just fill fluid..

      use vcds or what ever tools you have.... to cycle the abs a few times (the pump just needed to run)

      and proceed to bleeding from furthest to closes line... a few times about 4 complete passenger rear, driver rear, driver front, passenger front... for mine it is that, the other abs is reverse....

      and repeat again with abs... took me about 2 big bottles 1.5 liter ones .... or what ever that big Valvoline dot3 dot4 combo ones was...

      Also about 2 hours of my time on my driveway... not sure mechanic time equivalent.
      Last edited by dogdog; 06-13-2019 at 01:06 AM.
      IHP is real.
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    8. Member T3Bunny's Avatar
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      2001 Golf GL VR6. 1977 Rabbit
      06-13-2019 08:42 PM #6
      I tried again for a solid hour today. No luck. I have about 5 hours into this now if not a little more. More annoying it is it taking up a bay and I have to keep telling the poor lady it isn't ready yet. But I refuse to put my stamp on work that I am not 100%, or at least 99% happy with.

      What I don't get is the pedal is ROCK HARD with the car off. Once you have the vacuum worked out of the booster obviously. No issues. Start car up and it acts like a bad master.

      Today I pulled my car right behind it and compared the two. A huge difference. Off the pedals feel the same. And running, mine goes down slightly further, but feels good. The Jetta, it can go almost to the floor.

      I have used both manual 2 person bleed, and a reverse power bleeder. It is a nice mityvac professional pressure bleeder (not the dinky hand pump crap) that I converted to air power. Today I went as far as to verify that it was less than the 14.5psi the Bentley says not to go over. It was set for 12psi.

      This one is the odd order with the front left first. I have tried bleeding it both directions though multiple times.

      In the morning, I will put another master cylinder on it I guess.
      Last edited by T3Bunny; 06-13-2019 at 08:48 PM.

    9. Member T3Bunny's Avatar
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      2001 Golf GL VR6. 1977 Rabbit
      Yesterday 06:40 PM #7
      Yeah I did go the extra mile on this one, but I refuse to let a car get the better of me. It has become personal now. I will win. Damnit.

      So the consensus is it needs another ABS module, and "ideally" all new soft lines and calipers. The old fluid had been contaminated with something, but nobody knows what. The girl claims she doesn't even know how to open the hood, so pretty sure she isn't guilty lol.

      So at this point either the car wins, or I pull a used module out of my parts horde. So looks like I will be pulling a used module out of my parts horde to put in this. If that doesn't do it, then the car just might win. Or loose, cause it will be hearing its own death knolls!

    10. Junior Member
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      91 Golf, 92 16V GTI, 2000 Jetta, 2000 Golf
      Yesterday 06:49 PM #8
      I hope it's not too late. You press and hold the pedal while the pump is activated. It stops pumping and you release the pedal and open the front bleed nipples. Activate the pump for 10 seconds and fluid flows out of the open bleed nipples. Pump the pedal 10 times then close the bleed nipples. Repeat.

    11. Member T3Bunny's Avatar
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      Today 12:02 AM #9
      Perfectly timed, thank you! Okay I will try that out very first thing when I tackle it tomorrow, then if still seeing the same thing I will pop the other module in.

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