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    Thread: Drove a Golf R the other day.

    1. Member J.Yossarian's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 10:46 AM #76
      Well, it appears I maybe shouldn't have asked the transmission question. To be honest, all of my cars have been manuals, but I feel like I need to at least drive the DSG to compare. I'm not opposed to either.

      The VW dealer in town is trying to sell a carbon copy of my car for $21K, and theirs has 18,000 more miles than mine. I feel like now might be a good time to see what kind of deal I can get.

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    3. Geriatric Member Hostile's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 10:54 AM #77
      Quote Originally Posted by Rudy_H View Post
      knowing too that I paid over $1,000 less then the DSG.
      LOL, really? Congrats, you saved $1000. Sorry you couldn't afford the DSG...I guess?

      If you're really worried about a $1k delta on a $42k car you're doing something wrong.
      iain

    4. Global Moderator MylesPH1's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:03 AM #78
      I love the debate here. I prefer three pedals in general, but this really is one of those cars where you can make a great case for either one.

      I’d wind up with the manual just because that gives me the most enjoyment, but if I knew I was going for more power, that changes things, right? We know the clutch doesn’t handle extra HP very well, and if I’m concerned with going faster, ANY auto transmission keeps turbos spooling, so that’s going to be the best combo.

      Eh. I love the R’s either way. If I didn’t just get a car, I would’ve ordered an Irish Green R in manual, just to reward VW for giving me those options in the first place.
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    5. Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:12 AM #79
      After having a GTI manual for eleven years, and now my RS3 with DSG, the choice on this is pretty clear for me. The last few years of driving my GTI I really started to hate the way it lost boost between shifts, it felt like driving a rubber band, or that the drivetrain mounts were just way too sloppy or something. In that regard I do kind of agree I would prefer a manual in an NA application. I was concerned going with DSG that I would lose the way the car feels, in terms of engine braking and just in the way the car feels going on and off throttle - Nope. It's identical. So short of an actual clutch pedal and moving a shifter the experience overall feel is exactly the same, without boost loss, with lightning shifts and the upshift BRAAAP which never gets old. Plus when I want to be lazy, I can be.

    6. Member Slipstream's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:16 AM #80
      Quote Originally Posted by J.Yossarian View Post
      Well, it appears I maybe shouldn't have asked the transmission question. To be honest, all of my cars have been manuals, but I feel like I need to at least drive the DSG to compare. I'm not opposed to either.

      The VW dealer in town is trying to sell a carbon copy of my car for $21K, and theirs has 18,000 more miles than mine. I feel like now might be a good time to see what kind of deal I can get.
      Don't get me wrong, I love my manual and will likely drive them until they're no longer available to buy... but if I did it all over again I would have at least test driven the DSG. I spend a lot more time in rush hour traffic than I used to, and there are days where the clutch-gas-clutch-gas dance gets old.

      The latest generation of DSG is supposedly light years ahead of the one in the MKV, so it might have been worth the trade-off at this stage in life.
      17 gti sport | 16 xc60 t5 | seventwosix

    7. Member Maximum_Download's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:43 AM #81
      Quote Originally Posted by Double-V View Post
      I love my Golf R. I'm at 75K km. I had some clutch-slipping issues in 5th and 6th gear a few months ago, but they've gone away.

      Just so you're aware, the R is designed around Lapiz Blue and Pretorias.
      False. I may be one of the few who love the Englishtowns.
      Matt
      2018 Toyota Highlander SE AWD, Midnight Black Metallic/Black
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      2018 Four Winns H210 / 5.3L Volvo Penta V8 300 / DPS-A Duoprop drive

    8. Member Maximum_Download's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:45 AM #82
      Quote Originally Posted by J.Yossarian View Post
      Well, it appears I maybe shouldn't have asked the transmission question. To be honest, all of my cars have been manuals, but I feel like I need to at least drive the DSG to compare. I'm not opposed to either.

      The VW dealer in town is trying to sell a carbon copy of my car for $21K, and theirs has 18,000 more miles than mine. I feel like now might be a good time to see what kind of deal I can get.
      The transmission question is an easy one to answer. Drive them both and see which one YOU like more.
      Matt
      2018 Toyota Highlander SE AWD, Midnight Black Metallic/Black
      2018 Volkswagen Golf R 6-speed, Lapiz Blue/Titan Black
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    9. Member Strange Mud's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 11:56 AM #83
      and then TCL will tell you why you made a poor decision.
      My glass is half-full of empty

    10. Member KevinC's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 12:39 PM #84
      Quote Originally Posted by Hostile View Post
      LOL, really? Congrats, you saved $1000. Sorry you couldn't afford the DSG...I guess?

      '16 Golf R 6MT
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    11. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 01:17 PM #85
      Quote Originally Posted by S1ack View Post
      6MT here.

      The good: what they ^ said.
      The bad: Suspension creaks, interior creaks when it's cold (well mine does and I cannot figure it out), turning radius.
      Yah, turning radius is shockingly bad. less than 2 turns lock to lock is shockingly good though

      I had my LCAs replaced under warranty at 27k because I didn't like the slight creaking sound. It was subtle, only happened on the first drive of the day, but bothered me, and having a car with a warranty was novel to me. Of course it didn't want to do it on the ride-along but finally got it to do it so the mechanic could just BARELY hear it (maybe 1/5th as loud as 'normal')... was left front but they replaced both.

      Quote Originally Posted by 300_munkeys View Post
      It was ok, but coming from the m3 it felt so light and thin in a bad way. Maybe I'm just too used to the big heavy steering wheel now.
      Wow. I don't know what to say. The R's steering wheel is so gloriously chunky and heavy, and the whole car feels like a bank vault.

      Good point on the warranty on the newer cars, too. I just missed that.

      Quote Originally Posted by Maximum_Download View Post
      I'd recommend driving a 7.5. The drive modes and dynamic dampers really do wonders to help the feel out.
      The 7s had both.

      I just had a Skoda Oktavia diesel wagon in Norway last week. It's an mk7.5 and had the new nav system though it did NOT have the digital dash (lower end car). Now there's a car 'designed' for DSG The powerband is so narrow. I think it has the same motor as the identical 2014 diesel oktavia i rented back in.. 2014... but it feels twice as fast with a DSG vs a manual.

      Arguing the R is 'designed' for the DSG based on holding boost is silly. Yes, it does that. That's no different from any other small motor with a relatively big turbo. The STI was designed for a DSG, too, it just doesn't have one
      Dash cam people suck. Don't be a dash cam person.

      Quote Originally Posted by Dravenport View Post
      this thread is a mess, I can't tell if it's full of trolls or idiots and I'm not sure it matters

    12. Member SCHWAB0's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 01:18 PM #86
      Nobody mentioned resale.... Manual Rs v DSG, DSG demands better resale.

      Vote with your wallet. But i might be they only one here that owned both back to back and saying it suits the car better isn't a biased opinion just an opinion backed by experience. I'm still a manual proponent.

      Personal preference is one thing, the way the car behaves is another.



      Sent from my mobile office.
      Previous: '95 Talon AWD 2.0T | '98 GTI 2.0 | '00 Jetta 2.0 | '02 GLI 2.8 | '07 GTI 2.0T | '09 GLI 2.0T | '00 A4 2.8 | '04 R32 3.2 | '12 R 2.0T | '01 S4 2.7TT | '14 ST 1.6T | '12 R 2.0T | '16 R 2.0T | '17 R 2.0T | '18 RS3 2.5T |
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    13. 07-12-2019 01:22 PM #87
      Bunch of guys in here defending how they like to pump their legs and play with a stick in traffic, bunch of guys arguing the purity of purpose of an automatic transmission.

      Just buy what you like and enjoy it.

      The 991 GT3 was “designed” for a PDK far more than the Golf R and when the manual came out we realized both were fantastic in their own right for their own respective audiences. I suspect the same is at play here.

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      07-12-2019 03:22 PM #88
      Quote Originally Posted by Hawk View Post
      LOL. Nope. DSG in sport manual mode is more fun than stabbing away at a clutch pedal in the Golf R. You control the shifts and it's just a seamless flow of power.
      Footplay is more fun than stabbing a throttle and clicking a paddle, but you're going to get used to a lot of seamless flow of power by simply pushing in on the accelerator once you get your EV. I'll hold out on EVs when they're 100% self driving so I can just take a nap if I'm not going to have to shift.

      Let's bring up the part where a $35k GTI comes with a beautiful, big sunroof and for $40k, you get to look at up at black fabric.
      Last edited by oidoglr; 07-12-2019 at 03:31 PM.

    15. 07-12-2019 03:40 PM #89
      Quote Originally Posted by oidoglr View Post
      Let's bring up the part where a $35k GTI comes with a beautiful, big sunroof and for $40k, you get to look at up at black fabric.
      Yes, a $50K 330i is better equipped than a $60K M3. That is how cars work

    16. 07-12-2019 03:44 PM #90
      Quote Originally Posted by oidoglr View Post
      Footplay is more fun than stabbing a throttle and clicking a paddle, but you're going to get used to a lot of seamless flow of power by simply pushing in on the accelerator once you get your EV. I'll hold out on EVs when they're 100% self driving so I can just take a nap if I'm not going to have to shift.

      Let's bring up the part where a $35k GTI comes with a beautiful, big sunroof and for $40k, you get to look at up at black fabric.
      I’d pay extra to get the sunroof deleted on most cars.

    17. Moderator Oliver@triplezoom's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 03:48 PM #91
      Quote Originally Posted by CTK View Post
      Yes, a $50K 330i is better equipped than a $60K M3. That is how cars work
      But this is a bit of a different situation. A $35k GTI is more or less loaded, as is a $40k Golf R. It's too bad that the R doesn't offer a sunroof, it's my one hangup about that car.

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      07-12-2019 03:54 PM #92
      Quote Originally Posted by MonsterM
      When I’m in a manual car, I can see what’s ahead of me and predict when and where I’ll need what. It’s a skill and the honing of that skill is what I enjoy. You don’t drive to go fast in the same way you don’t eat because you want to poop. Going fast is a result of the joys of driving, it’s not the joy.
      You can do all of that with the DSG in manual mode.

      I own A DSG R and can count on one hand all the times I've *not* driven it in manual mode.

      Around town, in bumper-to-bumper traffic on the 405 freeway, or driving from FL to LA (and back again in a couple weeks), that R stays in manual mode and I can honestly say I enjoy driving it more as a result.

      Yes, a true manual trans car is more fun in some situations (e.g. heel-and-toe opportunities), but VW's DSG isn't the party-pooping slush-box some people want to make it out to be.
      Last edited by [email protected]; 07-12-2019 at 03:57 PM.

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      07-12-2019 04:11 PM #93
      Quote Originally Posted by SCHWAB0 View Post
      Nobody mentioned resale.... Manual Rs v DSG, DSG demands better resale.
      While I don't doubt that's true now I wouldn't be surprised if it flips in a few years. I watch the 987.2 and 997.2 markets pretty lose and manual cars seem to sell faster and for more money than PDK cars. I'd bet that for the first few years of resale the pdk was holding its higher cost.

      Buy what you like. I've only driven an R with the 6MT and I thought it was a great match for the car. Shifts were good, clutch felt good, I was very happy with it. The car I drove is still on the lot. We couldn't make a deal that I was happy with, if it's still there in October I'll try again.

    20. 07-12-2019 04:12 PM #94
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      You can do all of that with the DSG in manual mode.

      I own A DSG R and can count on one hand all the times I've *not* driven it in manual mode.

      Around town, in bumper-to-bumper traffic on the 405 freeway, or driving from FL to LA (and back again in a couple weeks), that R stays in manual mode and I can honestly say I enjoy driving it more as a result.

      Yes, a true manual trans car is more fun in some situations (e.g. heel-and-toe opportunities), but VW's DSG isn't the party-pooping slush-box some people want to make it out to be.
      Felt like a gimmick to me, just like the paddle shifters. I never really bothered and I just let the automatic do what it was designed to do, shift the gears for me. I jumped on the DSG bandwagon because racecar, it got old within a week. Live and learn.

    21. 07-12-2019 04:15 PM #95
      Quote Originally Posted by SCHWAB0 View Post
      Nobody mentioned resale.... Manual Rs v DSG, DSG demands better resale.

      Vote with your wallet. But i might be they only one here that owned both back to back and saying it suits the car better isn't a biased opinion just an opinion backed by experience. I'm still a manual proponent.

      Personal preference is one thing, the way the car behaves is another.



      Sent from my mobile office.
      Manual is cheaper to begin with...That is why DSG holds resale a little better, it is more expensive to begin with. Manual will retain value better over the longer period of time. There is nothing special about the DSG. It is an obsolete technology next to ZF.

    22. Member
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      07-12-2019 04:18 PM #96
      Quote Originally Posted by MonsterM View Post
      Felt like a gimmick to me, just like the paddle shifters. I never really bothered and I just let the automatic do what it was designed to do, shift the gears for me. I jumped on the DSG bandwagon because racecar, it got old within a week. Live and learn.
      But the quote you posted kind of explains how it's not a gimmick... Changing gears manually in anticipation is fun, challenging, and the one thing an automatic trans - even a good one - can't really do very well.

      LA freeway traffic is a good example. Even when traffic is flowing there's absolutely no lane discipline, so "to make decent progress" you need to always be in the right gear at the right time, and use the brakes somewhat sparingly. I find the DSG in manual mode offers a point-to-point flexibility that even a good manual trans can't duplicate. It's both challenging and rewarding to pull off successfully time and time again.

    23. Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:22 PM #97
      Quote Originally Posted by MonsterM View Post
      Manual is cheaper to begin with...That is why DSG holds resale a little better, it is more expensive to begin with. Manual will retain value better over the longer period of time. There is nothing special about the DSG. It is an obsolete technology next to ZF.
      For transverse application, nothing comes close to the DSG yet. The ZF for that application is a steaming pile.

    24. Member Itgb's Avatar
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      07-12-2019 04:23 PM #98
      Quote Originally Posted by Slipstream View Post
      100% agree with this (for both the GTI and R). Yes, other cars are better, but you'll have to spend a lot more to match the GTI's dollar-to-value ratio.

      My MK7 is the first car in a long time where I have no answer for the question "what would I replace this thing with if it disappeared tomorrow?" Probably another one, TBH.
      I haven't driven a Golf R yet because I'm afraid I might take one home.

      On the other hand, I've already been in my MK7 GTI for 3.5yrs and the thought of spending a bunch more money to drive the same basic car for another 4+yrs makes me question what I'm looking for next. Some options I'm keeping on my short list for next DD:

      MK8 Golf R(hopefully manuel sticks around)
      Audi S3 or RS3(have to give up hatch and 3rd pedal)
      Giulia Ti(see above)
      2019 Subaru Ascent | 2016 VW GTI S | 2010 Audi A4 Avant S-Line | PAST: 2006 MB E55 AMG, 2006 Scion xB, 2005 Volvo S60 2.5T, 2003 BMW M3, 1986 MB 190E 2.3-16

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      07-12-2019 04:27 PM #99
      Quote Originally Posted by smoothsix View Post

      Wow. I don't know what to say. The R's steering wheel is so gloriously chunky and heavy, and the whole car feels like a bank vault.

      Good point on the warranty on the newer cars, too. I just missed that.
      Yeah it came off like a knock on the R but I didn't intend in that way. The M3 just has a thick wheel. When I test drove my first e9x m3 coming from my mk6 R I couldn't figure out why the hell it was so big haha. So it just depends on what you are used to. I loved the steering wheel in both my mk6 GTI and the R.

      I'm going to test drive a DSG too I think. I will have other cars to drive stick when I want, and one fun part of driving a DSG is being able to left foot brake everywhere. For those that like track driving it's a great opportunity to practice that skill - just like heel-toe is best practiced and learned on the street, left foot braking everywhere with an automatic should make it very easy to transition that sensitivity to the track. I do understand I'm talking about a very small audience here but still. A different type of fun than a manual. And of course you can left foot brake in a manual but in regular driving you just don't have many opportunities to do so.

    26. 07-12-2019 04:36 PM #100
      Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Russells View Post
      For transverse application, nothing comes close to the DSG yet. The ZF for that application is a steaming pile.
      Because nobody will waste money on FWD based performance applications at this point. RS/CTR/STI come with a manual only for a reason. VW already dumped extremely high amount money and resources into the DSG.

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