VWVortex.com - Smoke from exhaust
Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
    Results 1 to 25 of 38

    Thread: Smoke from exhaust

    1. 09-09-2019 08:37 PM #1
      Hi, so today I noticed my my R was making some smoke, smells like oil. It wasnt doing it a ton at idle, but taking off from a stop or revving the engine to about 3grand makes the smoke come out.

      A little about the car; it's got 58,000 miles, APR stage 2 High torque file, apr carted down pipe into a super sprint cat back. VWR catch can (which i checked today and is only about halfway full) and that's about it for engine mods.

      I don't track the car but I do drive it with "spirit".https://cloud.tapatalk.com/s/5d76eff9...909_195642.mp4

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk
      Last edited by bzujus12; 09-09-2019 at 08:48 PM.

    2. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    3. Member
      Join Date
      Dec 4th, 2016
      Location
      Marietta GA
      Posts
      229
      Vehicles
      16 VW Golf R MT
      09-09-2019 08:58 PM #2
      Did this just start?
      Do you ever have to add oil?
      If so at what mileage?
      What oil do you run ?

      I have the Racingline VWR catch can and I can’t catch any oil. I couldn’t catch any with a BMS catch can either.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      '16 Golf R MT, DP, BCS Exhaust, Unitronic Stage 2, JB4

    4. 09-09-2019 09:17 PM #3
      Quote Originally Posted by rodacollier View Post
      Did this just start?
      Do you ever have to add oil?
      If so at what mileage?
      What oil do you run ?

      I have the Racingline VWR catch can and I can’t catch any oil. I couldn’t catch any with a BMS catch can either.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      It's let a little smoke out upon start up before but I never looked into it, I just assumed it was condensation. I've never had to add oil, I always change it every 2500-5000 miles depending on how hard I've been driving it.
      I've always used LiquiMoly Leichtluft 5w-40 or LiquiMoly Molygen 5w-40. My catch can does fill up within a couple thousand miles but it's usually mostly water, and a small amount of oil.
      Also I should add that I did a carbon cleaning on the intake valves about 10,000 miles ago, and that was the same day I added the catch can. And ever since i did all that, the car has smelled a little bit like oil but I assumed that was just from the residual stank in the catch can itself making its way back into the turbo inlet.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    5. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    6. 09-09-2019 09:18 PM #4
      Quote Originally Posted by rodacollier View Post
      Did this just start?
      Do you ever have to add oil?
      If so at what mileage?
      What oil do you run ?

      I have the Racingline VWR catch can and I can’t catch any oil. I couldn’t catch any with a BMS catch can either.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      Forgot to mention that yes, as far as this noticeably smoke, this just started.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    7. 09-10-2019 11:33 AM #5
      Checked spark plug galleries for oil today, found one of the plugs was very loose and had so much carbon built up on it that I couldn't get a socket on it without scraping the carbon off the hex on the plug. And also checked turbo inlet, seemed pretty clean. And checked turbo exhaust, pretty white, but dry.

      Took all the plugs out to look at the piston heads, all dry from what I could tell with my crappy Milfukee M12 scope. Reinstalled plugs and torqued to factory spec of 30 Nm. Put everything else together, started the car, still smokey, went for a 20 miles drive, still smokey.

      It's only letting the smoke out when I accelerate, and only when I'm taking off from a stop or revving in neutral.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    8. 09-10-2019 11:48 AM #6
      Smoke on acceleration is typically a rings or cylinder issue. Smoke on start up or deceleration is typically worn valve guides. Could also be the start of a weepy head gasket. I would do a compression test.

    9. Member
      Join Date
      Dec 4th, 2016
      Location
      Marietta GA
      Posts
      229
      Vehicles
      16 VW Golf R MT
      09-10-2019 11:49 AM #7
      If it were my car I would critically assess the installation of the catch can to make sure it’s per their instructions. Might also reach out to them and explain your experience and ask for feedback. I doubt they would say that much collection in the can is normal. This sounds like it could be collecting more than normal and letting some pass through. Maybe take the return line off and run your finger on the inside to see if it is oily. You could do the same with the turbo inlet / outlet to check for oil to get to the area of root cause. Sorry, that’s all I can think of doing on your own, short of taking it to a tech who has the domain experience/ training to troubleshoot the cause.


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      '16 Golf R MT, DP, BCS Exhaust, Unitronic Stage 2, JB4

    10. 09-10-2019 10:28 PM #8
      I would swap the catch can out for the stock pcv unit and see what happens, given how recent the install was. Catch cans can be problematic, and this sounds like possibly a pcv issue.

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
      Last edited by McJaggleToes; 09-10-2019 at 10:34 PM.

    11. Member
      Join Date
      Feb 25th, 1999
      Location
      San Angelo, Texas
      Posts
      3,316
      Vehicles
      1999 Passat gone 2008 R32 gone -2016 Golf R
      09-10-2019 11:02 PM #9
      Quote Originally Posted by McJaggleToes View Post
      I would swap the catch can out for the stock pcv unit and see what happens, given how recent the install was. Catch cans can be problematic, and this sounds like possibly a pcv issue.

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
      I like this idea.

    12. 09-12-2019 08:28 PM #10
      Car went to the shop today, so far this is what they've found;

      "Spark plugs in cylinders 1-3 are dry upon removal. Cylinder 4 was wet with out, the spark plug bore has signs of oil seepage through upper camshaft cover but minimal signs of that oil trickling down on the plug upon removal.

      All cylinders have a strange pattern in the crosshatching that isn't common after machining. The "swoop" marks are what I am referring to, it almost looks like the cylinders were honed by hand. Has this engine ever been re-ringed or rebuilt?

      Compression test results:
      Cylinder 1 - 100/104
      Cylinder 2 - 103/105
      Cylinder 3 - 110/110
      Cylinder 4 - 97/115

      The first picture shows cylinder 4 after the compression test, the second picture shows cylinder 3 after the compression test. The oil in cylinder 4 may have contributed to the jump in compression between the first and second tests. The tests were done in immediate succession.

      Leakdown results
      Cylinder 1 - 3%
      Cylinder 2 - 3%
      Cylinder 3 - 3%
      Cylinder 4 - 2%"



      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    13. 09-12-2019 11:27 PM #11
      They took a video of the "'swooping"' on the cylinder walls but it's a .avi file and idk how to upload that, so here are some screen shots of the video.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    14. Member
      Join Date
      Dec 4th, 2016
      Location
      Marietta GA
      Posts
      229
      Vehicles
      16 VW Golf R MT
      09-12-2019 11:45 PM #12
      Is the shop that is working on it the one that cleaned the valves?

      Suppose the valve cleaning left some blasting material inside the head & cylinder ?


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      '16 Golf R MT, DP, BCS Exhaust, Unitronic Stage 2, JB4

    15. 09-13-2019 12:06 AM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by rodacollier View Post
      Is the shop that is working on it the one that cleaned the valves?

      Suppose the valve cleaning left some blasting material inside the head & cylinder ?


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      I actually cleaned the valves myself, I made sure to get the valves in the closes position before blasting and was extremely meticulous with taping any open hole with painter's tape to prevent any blasting media in the block, and I vacuumed everything out as well when I was done.
      I also used walnut shell, I don't think that's abrasive enough to score the cylinder walls?

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    16. 09-13-2019 12:08 AM #14
      This is the write up I did on my carbon cleaning
      https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/top...ink_source=app

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    17. Member Rocket88's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 4th, 2015
      Location
      Colorado Springs, CO
      Posts
      433
      Vehicles
      '17 Golf R 6MT, '15 Touareg Exec TDI, 2011 GTI DSG
      09-13-2019 08:42 AM #15
      EA888 Gen3 Golf R compression ratio is 9.6:1

      9.6 x 14.7 (ambient air pressure at sea level) = 141.12 psi

      Your compression test values are incredibly low. The leakdown % does not correlate to the missing psi values in each cylinder.




      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

    18. 09-13-2019 05:29 PM #16
      Quote Originally Posted by Rocket88 View Post
      EA888 Gen3 Golf R compression ratio is 9.6:1

      9.6 x 14.7 (ambient air pressure at sea level) = 141.12 psi

      Your compression test values are incredibly low. The leakdown % does not correlate to the missing psi values in each cylinder.




      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
      It's still even across the cylinders. Am I incorrect to think that scoring would result in more variation in compression?

      OP, have you ruled out the catch can yet? What you're describing is a possible symptom of pcv failure, which catch cans can imitate. This is an easy thing to rule out before you start trying to dig into the motor.

      I very seriously doubt that the slight amount of texturing in the cylinders is responsible for enough blowby to see it in your exhaust unless, again, crankcase pressures are dorked up because of a faulty pcv. However, I'm well practiced at being wrong.

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
      Last edited by McJaggleToes; 09-13-2019 at 05:45 PM.

    19. Member Rocket88's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 4th, 2015
      Location
      Colorado Springs, CO
      Posts
      433
      Vehicles
      '17 Golf R 6MT, '15 Touareg Exec TDI, 2011 GTI DSG
      09-13-2019 07:08 PM #17
      Even, but significantly below spec. Leak down % does not explain or correlate to those comp readings. I’m not sure I’d trust the test. Do it again with another GGE perhaps.

      The hatch mark pics are low res, and taken with a bore scope with a 45° mirror attachment, utilizing a single point LED = does not render the same “picture” one would see with their eyes.

      The hot side of the turbo appears have a fair amount of ash- telltale of burning oil. If the plugs do not have this same ash deposit, then the only thing to assume would be the turbo is leaking oil into the exhaust side?





      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
      Last edited by Rocket88; 09-13-2019 at 07:18 PM.

    20. Senior Member Vegeta Gti's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 12th, 2003
      Location
      konoha village, hawaii
      Posts
      21,438
      Vehicles
      1984 GLi 20v, '16 M3, '85 Golf, '17 R
      09-14-2019 07:39 AM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by Rocket88 View Post
      EA888 Gen3 Golf R compression ratio is 9.6:1

      9.6 x 14.7 (ambient air pressure at sea level) = 141.12 psi

      Your compression test values are incredibly low. The leakdown % does not correlate to the missing psi values in each cylinder.




      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
      At 9.6:1 I'd be looking for 180psi not 141. The commission ratio isn't direct for Volkswagen.

      A 9.5:1 1.8t 20v is 145 minimum, 170 nominal for instance, per VW.

      Regardless, you have very compression. The cross hatching pictures are terrible but it looks fine. Definitely put the pcv back to stock, but it seems like the blasting may not have gone well.

      Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
      :HOMEGROWN MOTORSPORTS..SingerVehicleDesign...1:4.9 SuaSponte #13Dead Rabbits. Ungluck on IG. MKIforLife
      Quote Originally Posted by .Ant View Post
      What vegeta said.

    21. 09-14-2019 07:41 AM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by McJaggleToes View Post
      It's still even across the cylinders. Am I incorrect to think that scoring would result in more variation in compression?

      OP, have you ruled out the catch can yet? What you're describing is a possible symptom of pcv failure, which catch cans can imitate. This is an easy thing to rule out before you start trying to dig into the motor.

      I very seriously doubt that the slight amount of texturing in the cylinders is responsible for enough blowby to see it in your exhaust unless, again, crankcase pressures are dorked up because of a faulty pcv. However, I'm well practiced at being wrong.

      Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
      The cars still at the shop, they won't be able to look at it again until monday. I'll probably bring by the stock pcv for them to throw on and test.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    22. 09-14-2019 07:45 AM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by Vegeta Gti View Post
      At 9.6:1 I'd be looking for 180psi not 141. The commission ratio isn't direct for Volkswagen.

      A 9.5:1 1.8t 20v is 145 minimum, 170 nominal for instance, per VW.

      Regardless, you have very compression. The cross hatching pictures are terrible but it looks fine. Definitely put the pcv back to stock, but it seems like the blasting may not have gone well.

      Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
      I should add the blasting was done 10,000 miles before the car started burning oil

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    23. 09-14-2019 07:56 AM #21
      Quote Originally Posted by Rocket88 View Post
      Even, but significantly below spec. Leak down % does not explain or correlate to those comp readings. I’m not sure I’d trust the test. Do it again with another GGE perhaps.

      The hatch mark pics are low res, and taken with a bore scope with a 45° mirror attachment, utilizing a single point LED = does not render the same “picture” one would see with their eyes.

      The hot side of the turbo appears have a fair amount of ash- telltale of burning oil. If the plugs do not have this same ash deposit, then the only thing to assume would be the turbo is leaking oil into the exhaust side?





      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
      This is a better picture of the plugs, similar ash deposit on them.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    24. Member Rocket88's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 4th, 2015
      Location
      Colorado Springs, CO
      Posts
      433
      Vehicles
      '17 Golf R 6MT, '15 Touareg Exec TDI, 2011 GTI DSG
      09-14-2019 08:55 AM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by bzujus12 View Post
      This is a better picture of the plugs, similar ash deposit on them.

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk
      Ah, whoops- my apologies (for missing the ash on plugs and also for not diving deeper into static CR discussion vs what a GGE might show).


      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

    25. 09-17-2019 12:32 PM #23
      The shop got back to me today;
      "Cylinder 4 has the wettest valves compared to the other three cylinders. This was the cylinder that always had oil in it during testing.
      Cylinder 1 is the middle picture, cylinders 2 and 3 are the cleanest and driest cylinders.

      Final Thoughts: There is a possibility that cylinder 4 has a valve guide/seal issue that causes an oil leak under vacuum and introduces oil into the cylinder. The compression test results and extremely odd scoring patterns on the cylinder walls do not induce confidence in this engine. I cannot find any references that would outline the cause of the "Swoop" markings present in this engine. As a last resort, I would try installing a new PCV (Or the customers old PCV, preferably new as it will be the lastest revision) and see if the smoking goes away after a period of time. There is a small amount of oil that came out of the charge pipe upon removal, and the ports on the catch can are restricted by buildup of the moisture infused oil (The coffee with cream colored substance).

      The smoking looks to potentially be bad valve seals as mentioned by the Tech, but the compression numbers are low (at what VW calls the "wear limit") but leakdown is OK and there is not excessive buildup on the valve seating surface. As mentioned we can install your old PCV to see if it helps with the smoking, or install a new one of the latest revision... or keep the Catch can in place. Either way, the compression numbers and the strange marks in the cylinders lead me to believe the primary issue is in the bottom end and even if the smoking stops with the new PCV the low compression will very likely persist. Advise if you would like the car put together as-is, if you would like to bring the old PCV or have us install a new one. You can provide the part # of the one you removed and I can advise if it is the latest revision."

      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    26. Member Rocket88's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 4th, 2015
      Location
      Colorado Springs, CO
      Posts
      433
      Vehicles
      '17 Golf R 6MT, '15 Touareg Exec TDI, 2011 GTI DSG
      09-17-2019 08:04 PM #24
      The only way to have incredibly low compression numbers and good leak down % is cam timing. If your rings were so hammered as to cause 50 psi of compression to blow by, during the leak down test you should be able to levitate the oil cap (and the result on the GGE face would not be 3%).

      Something is not adding up here.


      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

    27. 09-17-2019 08:10 PM #25
      Quote Originally Posted by Rocket88 View Post
      The only way to have incredibly low compression numbers and good leak down % is cam timing. If your rings were so hammered as to cause 50 psi of compression to blow by, during the leak down test you should be able to levitate the oil cap (and the result on the GGE face would not be 3%).

      Something is not adding up here.


      Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
      What is GGE?
      I've been thinking about it non stop and that's pretty much all I can think of too, timing.. I went down to the shop today to talk to them, they think there may be a bad valve seal on cylinder 4 but they said unless I want to get into tearing the whole engine down for a full rebuild it wouldn't be worth doing a valve seal. They're main concern is that strange swooping pattern on the cross hatching of the cylinder walls. For now we're putting the most updated OEM PCV on the car to see what happens. The VWR catch can had a decent amount of schmoo built up in the ports of the can itself, restricting the flow.


      Sent from my SM-G977U using Tapatalk

    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •