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    Thread: 2020 Land Rover Defender finally officially revealed — The rebirth of an icon, coming to the US

    1. Member stevevr6's Avatar
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      09-11-2019 02:12 PM #126
      This is the only Defender I can afford



      On a serious note. I think this new Defender looks good and is priced reasonable within it's market segment.
      @VRBOY666

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    3. Member The_Real_Stack's Avatar
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      09-11-2019 02:55 PM #127
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      Base price of a Defender 90 in 1997: $34,500
      In today's dollars: $55,000
      Base price of a 2020 Defender: $50,000.
      That's true, but there wasn't much in the way of options on the original D90, was there? Plus for that $34k you got a V8 (though admittedly slower than the 4cyl on the new one). The new Defender it's easy to double the price in options, which I do think is a little different.
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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      09-11-2019 03:06 PM #128
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      That's true, but there wasn't much in the way of options on the original D90, was there? Plus for that $34k you got a V8 (though admittedly slower than the 4cyl on the new one). The new Defender it's easy to double the price in options, which I do think is a little different.
      Original "Wrangler" didn't have much in the way of options.

      You could easily double them in price with options today.


      both vehicles in civilian trim have always been utilities vehicles that were also bought as fashion accessories.


      This isn't a Defender specific thing.

    5. Moderator Oliver@triplezoom's Avatar
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      09-11-2019 03:13 PM #129
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      That's true, but there wasn't much in the way of options on the original D90, was there? Plus for that $34k you got a V8 (though admittedly slower than the 4cyl on the new one). The new Defender it's easy to double the price in options, which I do think is a little different.
      There wasn't much standard equipment either. Air conditioning was optional. A base zero-option 2020 Defender is still way, way nicer, more comfortable, safer, etc. than a 1997 model. So while of course a new Defender can be optioned out to double the price, it doesn't have to be.

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      09-11-2019 06:25 PM #130
      Quote Originally Posted by mikegilbert View Post
      The UK configurator has both diesels available now, but nothing in the US yet. I'm not 100% sold on the soft looks, but when the suspension is raised, it's definitely carrying some Defender DNA.
      I want to see one with some real tires on it. They don't have to be 38s but something with some proper tread on it.

      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      BUT BUT BUT... TCL told me the OG Defender was an honest to goodness utilitarian truck for every man and affordable to all!

      Not the vain mall crawling and starbucks sipping elitist model that LR is trying to make it into!

      *** adjusts rose classes to better stare you down with ***
      Go spend some time in the UK if you want to see them used as intended. They are all over the place there in hundreds of different configurations doing real work. The image in the US is completely different because so few were legitimately sold here and that makes the survivors really valuble. The fact that a 35 year old import looks exactly like the US spec models means those are also expensive.

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      09-11-2019 06:43 PM #131
      Quote Originally Posted by Sonderwunsch View Post
      I want to see one with some real tires on it. They don't have to be 38s but something with some proper tread on it.



      Go spend some time in the UK if you want to see them used as intended. They are all over the place there in hundreds of different configurations doing real work. The image in the US is completely different because so few were legitimately sold here and that makes the survivors really valuble. The fact that a 35 year old import looks exactly like the US spec models means those are also expensive.
      Many former British colonies still use Land Rover Defenders as their ideal choice for their military fleet.

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      09-11-2019 07:09 PM #132
      Wow, me likey! They did a great job with the interior. The price? Well, I'll probably get a nice one year old CPO for $20k when my new Jetta gets old.

    9. 09-12-2019 02:23 AM #133
      The only kind of clientelle for these things are ultra-rich who just like the quirkiness of it and buy it as a toy. Probably British royal family will be seen going in these for their annual duck hunting endeavor. And maybe one seen in some Qatar's king's 200-car garage lost among Lambos and Bugattis.

      Can't imagine any sane ordinary person with less than 7-figure income spending this much money on a tarded looking Rubik's Cube with zero practicality or ... anything for that matter. Don't even know what's the point in these. Although I appreciate they exist.

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      09-12-2019 02:54 AM #134
      Quote Originally Posted by 2.0T_Convert View Post
      BUT BUT BUT... TCL told me the OG Defender was an honest to goodness utilitarian truck for every man and affordable to all!

      Not the vain mall crawling and starbucks sipping elitist model that LR is trying to make it into!

      *** adjusts rose classes to better stare you down with ***
      The commercial model is coming with new options such as 2 seat configuration with a center pass-through to get directly into the back from the front seat. I haven't seen anything about the US market getting it but it's going to start around ฃ35,000 in the UK.
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    11. 09-12-2019 05:06 AM #135
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      Can't believe they chose these tires.

      Yeah not a great tyre from my limited offroading experience, I had these on a Jimny and they didn't seem to grip very well at all.

      For those saying that there's no market for a new Defender that's more in line with what Defenders are supposed to be then they need look no further than something like the Suzuki Jimny which is for all intents and purposes still very utilitarian and a terrible car unless it's being used offroad (solid axles, a shortwheelbase and a high revving, low powered engine do not a great daily make). The Land Cruiser 70 is another great example of a very basic vehicle that remains popular.

      The original Defender sold just fine in its basic state for decades, that was in fact its major selling point and it certainly didn't prevent mall-crawling poser and overlanders alike from buying them in droves. Posers loved them too and many a wealthy person can still be seen cruising around in the basic Defenders just for the image even though they must be a chore to daily drive.

      I'm not a fan of the new Defender because it's supposed to be the basic, utilitarian workhorse of the Land Rover stable. The new model seems overly complex and that doesn't make sense given that LR already has the Discovery and Range Rover models to fill these role. There is far too much overlap between all these models. I shudder to think of the troubles one might run into when trying to do some serious offroading in one of these given the complexity.

      Perhaps none of these factors will hamper its popularity for those driven by trends for the latest fads but it is somewhat disappointing to see yet another overly complex offroader although the thought of a hybrid overlander that has amazing range and instant torque when required is tempting, however Land Rover is not known for their electronic competence.

      Now a Toyota Land Cruiser 70 hybrid on the other hand....
      Last edited by chopWet; 09-12-2019 at 05:47 AM.

    12. 09-12-2019 07:10 AM #136
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      Yeah not a great tyre from my limited offroading experience, I had these on a Jimny and they didn't seem to grip very well at all.

      For those saying that there's no market for a new Defender that's more in line with what Defenders are supposed to be then they need look no further than something like the Suzuki Jimny which is for all intents and purposes still very utilitarian and a terrible car unless it's being used offroad (solid axles, a shortwheelbase and a high revving, low powered engine do not a great daily make). The Land Cruiser 70 is another great example of a very basic vehicle that remains popular.

      The original Defender sold just fine in its basic state for decades, that was in fact its major selling point and it certainly didn't prevent mall-crawling poser and overlanders alike from buying them in droves. Posers loved them too and many a wealthy person can still be seen cruising around in the basic Defenders just for the image even though they must be a chore to daily drive.

      I'm not a fan of the new Defender because it's supposed to be the basic, utilitarian workhorse of the Land Rover stable. The new model seems overly complex and that doesn't make sense given that LR already has the Discovery and Range Rover models to fill these role. There is far too much overlap between all these models. I shudder to think of the troubles one might run into when trying to do some serious offroading in one of these given the complexity.

      Perhaps none of these factors will hamper its popularity for those driven by trends for the latest fads but it is somewhat disappointing to see yet another overly complex offroader although the thought of a hybrid overlander that has amazing range and instant torque when required is tempting, however Land Rover is not known for their electronic competence.

      Now a Toyota Land Cruiser 70 hybrid on the other hand....
      That's the confusing part about it. Are you gonna take your $80,000 Defender and trash it over bumps and holes and scratch with tree branches driving through vegetation and all kind of off-road crap?

      It should've been very basic. They made it an off-road Rolls Royce instead.

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      09-12-2019 07:29 AM #137
      Quote Originally Posted by chocofrappe55 View Post
      That's the confusing part about it. Are you gonna take your $80,000 Defender and trash it over bumps and holes and scratch with tree branches driving through vegetation and all kind of off-road crap?

      It should've been very basic. They made it an off-road Rolls Royce instead.
      You can ask the same question about the M-B G-Wagen, or the nearly $60K top of the line Wrangler/Gladiator.
      Hell, Ford Raptors or GMC Sierra AT-4s/Denalis are also over $60K off-road oriented machines.
      The upcoming Ford Bronco certainly will follow the Jeep example and chase the $$$.
      If you really want an off-road rig to safely abuse, buy a use JK Wrangler.
      New car manufacturers really aren't in the business of selling off-road trucks for the poor.

    14. Member Galrot's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 07:34 AM #138
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      ]
      The original Defender sold just fine in its basic state for decades, that was in fact its major selling point and it certainly didn't prevent mall-crawling poser and overlanders alike from buying them in droves. Posers loved them too and many a wealthy person can still be seen cruising around in the basic Defenders just for the image even though they must be a chore to daily drive.
      Yes, and it would probably continue that way if it wasn't for new safety standards rendering the old thing obsolete in the Eu (something which had already happened in the USA in 1997).

    15. Senior Member Sporin's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 08:03 AM #139
      Quote Originally Posted by whitejeep1989 View Post
      You can ask the same question about the M-B G-Wagen, or the nearly $60K top of the line Wrangler/Gladiator.
      Hell, Ford Raptors or GMC Sierra AT-4s/Denalis are also over $60K off-road oriented machines.
      The upcoming Ford Bronco certainly will follow the Jeep example and chase the $$$.
      If you really want an off-road rig to safely abuse, buy a use JK Wrangler.
      New car manufacturers really aren't in the business of selling off-road trucks for the poor.

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      09-12-2019 08:07 AM #140
      Quote Originally Posted by chocofrappe55 View Post
      That's the confusing part about it. Are you gonna take your $80,000 Defender and trash it over bumps and holes and scratch with tree branches driving through vegetation and all kind of off-road crap?

      It should've been very basic. They made it an off-road Rolls Royce instead.

      You suck at reading price guides.




      Quote Originally Posted by whitejeep1989 View Post
      You can ask the same question about the M-B G-Wagen, or the nearly $60K top of the line Wrangler/Gladiator.
      Hell, Ford Raptors or GMC Sierra AT-4s/Denalis are also over $60K off-road oriented machines.
      Lets not forget the 6 figure adventure rigs that get built and only used for beating the snot out of them.

      Spending this kind of money and then offroading is not new.. or rare.

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      09-12-2019 08:25 AM #141
      Quote Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
      Can't believe they chose these tires.
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      Yeah not a great tyre from my limited offroading experience, I had these on a Jimny and they didn't seem to grip very well at all.
      I think he was making a joke because it says WRANGLER in huge letters on a Land Rover

    18. 09-12-2019 09:17 AM #142
      Quote Originally Posted by chris86vw View Post
      You suck at reading price guides.






      Lets not forget the 6 figure adventure rigs that get built and only used for beating the snot out of them.

      Spending this kind of money and then offroading is not new.. or rare.
      Yes of course but we are talking about the LR Defender here, one of the few vehicles that many would have originally considered for serious offroading and overlanding trips.

      LR already has rather plush vehicles in its stable, the Discovery is certainly too complex to be taken seriously.

      Isn't there too much overlap between Land Rover and Range Rover?

      Quote Originally Posted by Quinn1.8t View Post
      I think he was making a joke because it says WRANGLER in huge letters on a Land Rover


      I thought Michelins were the only acceptable tyre on anything around these parts these days?

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      09-12-2019 09:40 AM #143
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      Yes of course but we are talking about the LR Defender here, one of the few vehicles that many would have originally considered for serious offroading and overlanding trips.
      What is stopping this new one from being considered for that?

      LR already has rather plush vehicles in its stable, the Discovery is certainly too complex to be taken seriously.
      Right, this isn't rather plush.


      Isn't there too much overlap between Land Rover and Range Rover?
      what now?

    20. Member The_Real_Stack's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 09:42 AM #144
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      I thought Michelins were the only acceptable tyre on anything around these parts these days?
      The two main offroad/on road tires I see reference most often are BF Goodrich (K02) and Goodyear (DuraTrac)
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

    21. Member The_Real_Stack's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 09:44 AM #145
      Quote Originally Posted by chocofrappe55 View Post
      That's the confusing part about it. Are you gonna take your $80,000 Defender and trash it over bumps and holes and scratch with tree branches driving through vegetation and all kind of off-road crap?
      People who offroad regularly don't necessarily believe things like pinstripes from trees and branches are the end of the world. Nor do they consider that "trashing it".
      Quote Originally Posted by Volkl View Post
      My wife wanted a SUV with a manual transmission. I suggested a Wrangler, she said no way, too masculine

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      09-12-2019 09:58 AM #146
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      The two main offroad/on road tires I see reference most often are BF Goodrich (K02) and Goodyear (DuraTrac)
      pssst.. one of those is Michellin

    23. 09-12-2019 10:09 AM #147
      Quote Originally Posted by chris86vw View Post
      What is stopping this new one from being considered for that? Overly complex for a Defender, LR's poor record when it comes to electronics and reliability?

      Right, this isn't rather plush. Arguable but consider the template, perhaps 'unnecessarily complex' is a better description although it's certainly not basic in the true spirit of the Defender's go-anywhere, rough and tumble image, at least not in the current forms on offer

      what now? Outside of the USA the pricing really isn't very much different when comparing the Discovery and the lower end of the RR stable
      If Suzuki and Toyota can make stripper models surely LR can too?

      Hopefully they release a manual, simple version in the future.
      Last edited by chopWet; 09-12-2019 at 10:16 AM.

    24. Member adrew's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 10:27 AM #148
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      I thought Michelins were the only acceptable tyre on anything around these parts these days?
      I mean...

      Improving the signal-to-noise ratio

    25. Senior Member Sporin's Avatar
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      09-12-2019 10:29 AM #149
      An owner of a Classic Defender weighs in.



      SPOILERS... he loves it, pricing and capability included.

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      09-12-2019 10:29 AM #150
      Quote Originally Posted by chopWet View Post
      If Suzuki and Toyota can make stripper models surely LR can too?

      Hopefully they release a manual, simple version in the future.
      Why exactly is it that just because one company does something that everyone thinks all others are required? It has never worked that way ever.

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