VWVortex.com - Petro-Canada gas stations adding coast to coast quick charging. Any US gas stations doing this?
Username or Email Address
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    VWVortex


    The Car Lounge
    Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
    Results 26 to 50 of 62

    Thread: Petro-Canada gas stations adding coast to coast quick charging. Any US gas stations doing this?

    1. Senior Member LT1M21Stingray's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 13th, 2006
      Location
      Not in Europe. Boo.
      Posts
      22,337
      Vehicles
      SR71 C30 t53a/b/b
      10-17-2019 08:15 PM #26
      Quote Originally Posted by The_Real_Stack View Post
      I love me some Wawa, taking a Tour de Wawa down the coast would be just fine. Some Wawa lemonde here, a cream-cheese pretzel there, maybe a meatball hoagie at the third stop, etc.
      And you don't even need an electric car to do so.
      Quote Originally Posted by Mk1Madness
      Back when making your car faster and better handling was the big thing.
      Quote Originally Posted by Tavarish
      The car's best safety feature includes ejecting you in the moment of impact and wishing you the best of luck.
      Buy my couch!

    2. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    3. Member Jimmy Russells's Avatar
      Join Date
      Feb 4th, 2007
      Location
      Vancouver
      Posts
      16,129
      Vehicles
      RS3, JKU
      10-17-2019 08:16 PM #27
      Quote Originally Posted by LT1M21Stingray View Post
      So it takes two months to drive from coast to coast instead of five days?

      A few weeks ago the news said Elizabeth May only goes places in a Tesla but one day she was on Vancouver Island and the next day she was in the Maritimes. Now I know how she did it.

    4. Senior Member LT1M21Stingray's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 13th, 2006
      Location
      Not in Europe. Boo.
      Posts
      22,337
      Vehicles
      SR71 C30 t53a/b/b
      10-17-2019 08:52 PM #28
      Quote Originally Posted by Jimmy Russells View Post
      A few weeks ago the news said Elizabeth May only goes places in a Tesla but one day she was on Vancouver Island and the next day she was in the Maritimes. Now I know how she did it.
      2 airplanes.
      Quote Originally Posted by Mk1Madness
      Back when making your car faster and better handling was the big thing.
      Quote Originally Posted by Tavarish
      The car's best safety feature includes ejecting you in the moment of impact and wishing you the best of luck.
      Buy my couch!

    5. Member
      Join Date
      Aug 4th, 2005
      Posts
      1,357
      Vehicles
      20 years of German cars led to this: 2016 RAV4 hybrid, 2020 Prius Prime
      10-17-2019 08:59 PM #29
      Quote Originally Posted by LT1M21Stingray View Post
      So it takes two months to drive from coast to coast instead of five days?
      Nice try but let me throw some numbers at you.

      If you're in a Tesla 3 LR. You'll need around 900kwh to cover 5900km/3700 miles from Vancouver to Nova Scotia.

      Assuming you're leaving with a full charge.

      And assuming you'd be charging from 10-80% (so 52.5kwh at a time) to play it safe.

      You'd have to stop every 220 miles for a quick 15 minute charge.

      You would spend around 4 hours charging for the trip.

      Just as a comparison, if you're doing the same trip in a 2019 330i, with a 13 gallon tank at 36mpg, and assuming you'll be stopping to fill when there's only 2 gallons left, you would have to stop for fuel every 396 miles. You'd have to stop around 10 times for fuel so around 2.5 hours total if you're stopping 15 minutes each time.

      Oh and minor footnote, with premium at over 5$/gallon here, it would cost over 500$ in fuel in a 330i, and it would be free in a Tesla.

    6. Member MGQ's Avatar
      Join Date
      Apr 16th, 2002
      Location
      The City (:-l)
      Posts
      10,589
      Vehicles
      Fusion Hybrid
      10-17-2019 11:04 PM #30
      There are some pretty remote places along the Trans Canada, where the PetroCan may also be the only repair shop/bait shop/restaurant in town. It will be interesting to see how EV chargers are implemented in the bush.
      This is only temporary, unless it works. - Red Green

    7. Senior Member LT1M21Stingray's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 13th, 2006
      Location
      Not in Europe. Boo.
      Posts
      22,337
      Vehicles
      SR71 C30 t53a/b/b
      10-17-2019 11:40 PM #31
      Quote Originally Posted by Dubveiser View Post
      Nice try but let me throw some numbers at you.
      Meh...

      Quote Originally Posted by Mk1Madness
      Back when making your car faster and better handling was the big thing.
      Quote Originally Posted by Tavarish
      The car's best safety feature includes ejecting you in the moment of impact and wishing you the best of luck.
      Buy my couch!

    8. Member
      Join Date
      May 15th, 2007
      Location
      Wilmington, DE
      Posts
      16,714
      Vehicles
      2015 VW GTI SE
      10-18-2019 08:49 AM #32
      Quote Originally Posted by MGQ View Post
      There are some pretty remote places along the Trans Canada, where the PetroCan may also be the only repair shop/bait shop/restaurant in town. It will be interesting to see how EV chargers are implemented in the bush.
      I assume there are EV refueling trucks these days, similar to AAA emergency roadside repairs/refueling?
      It is possible for ICE cars to also run out of fuel on long road trips and miles away from gas stations.

    9. Senior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 23rd, 2000
      Location
      Shepherdstown, WV
      Posts
      23,207
      10-18-2019 09:23 AM #33
      Quote Originally Posted by MGQ View Post
      There are some pretty remote places along the Trans Canada, where the PetroCan may also be the only repair shop/bait shop/restaurant in town. It will be interesting to see how EV chargers are implemented in the bush.

      I assume these places aren't getting high on their on supply running generators out back and have electricity run to them? So it's actually easier to implement charging than it is to deliver fuel.

      I realize there are some very remote places that don't have electricity, but that's not what is being discussed here.

    10. 10-18-2019 09:35 AM #34
      Quote Originally Posted by LT1M21Stingray View Post
      Meh...

      I live in Alberta and all these stickers and banners are everywhere. It so obnoxious.

    11. Member MGQ's Avatar
      Join Date
      Apr 16th, 2002
      Location
      The City (:-l)
      Posts
      10,589
      Vehicles
      Fusion Hybrid
      10-18-2019 10:47 AM #35
      Quote Originally Posted by chris86vw View Post
      I assume these places aren't getting high on their on supply running generators out back and have electricity run to them? So it's actually easier to implement charging than it is to deliver fuel.

      I realize there are some very remote places that don't have electricity, but that's not what is being discussed here.

      Obviously that's not what we're discussing here. implementing charging due to infrastructure may be 'easy' compared to delivering fuel, I'm talking about the total lack of any kind of services for many miles along this route, where the planned PetroCan stop may be your only option. Its kind of illustrated in this thread with all the wawa talk. In some of this route it's not "oh gee I wanted wawa but I'll have to settle for 7-11", there just isn't much of anything. I'm not talking about what ifs here, I'm just curious to see how it will be implemented and maintained in remote areas.

      Quote Originally Posted by whitejeep1989 View Post
      I assume there are EV refueling trucks these days, similar to AAA emergency roadside repairs/refueling?
      It is possible for ICE cars to also run out of fuel on long road trips and miles away from gas stations.
      I see both posts quoting me start with "I assume", but I think the people who live in these areas do their beset not to run out of fuel and rely on roadside service, or even cell service. The stretch between Nipigon and Wawa, ON, on the planned route is 225 miles. There is the town of White River between them. Average high daily temp there is 72.5 F, in July. avg low in January -11 F. and -40 is not unheard of during the winter for much of the route. Lots of places where stopping and waiting for help aren't great options.
      This is only temporary, unless it works. - Red Green

    12. Member
      Join Date
      May 16th, 2010
      Location
      Michigan
      Posts
      1,044
      Vehicles
      19 GLI Autobahn
      10-18-2019 11:08 AM #36
      Quote Originally Posted by mtb_jeremy View Post
      It amazes me that other businesses (besides gas stations) are jumping on this in a big way. If Starbucks offered this, then it would be another way to get people into their stores. What about Target, restaurant chains,...
      Exactly. electric cars do not need to be built around petro station refilling models. It actually makes more sense for a retailer like Walmart/Target to have charging slots since people will spend 30+ min plus in those places. They can do simple pay-charging models and capture that market. I really wish Walmart would adopt this, it would force others to do so.

      Starbucks is a good idea but most folks are either driving-through or stopping for just a few minutes. Their 'hardcore' crowd that stays and studies/works will enjoy that, but how many of those folks are driving there as opposed to walking? I see the college-town starbucks always filled with people studying, but not many in the non-college suburban places - and those often have very small seating areas, though the starbucks crowd is likely pro-e car generally.

      With so many restaurants built into strip malls, would be cool to see the owners of the malls install a few strips to start the process.

    13. Senior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 23rd, 2000
      Location
      Shepherdstown, WV
      Posts
      23,207
      10-18-2019 11:16 AM #37
      Quote Originally Posted by MGQ View Post
      about the total lack of any kind of services for many miles along this route, where the planned PetroCan stop may be your only option.
      Quite literally any open 110volt outlet and a few hours of your time is your option for charging an EV. In regards to being remote and cut off from services it is easier to find electricity than it is fuel. Since also any fuel station will have electricity, but random closed business on a sunday night with an outside outlet but no fuel cans laying around can get you back on the road in an EV.


      I see both posts quoting me start with "I assume",

      Sorry for us wording uncertainty slightly different then you did...


      I can confirm for a fact according to google maps that there is not one but 2 fuel stations in white river a mere 100/60 (km/miles) from Wawa. There are another dozen or so between White river and Nipigon..


      So what exactly were you ASSUMING the problem would be?




      but I think the people who live in these areas do their beset not to run out of fuel and rely on roadside service, or even cell service.
      And what part of EV ownership exactly makes being irresponsible about making sure you are "fueled" enough something that these same people can't handle?





      My experience road tripping around North east Canada, in populated areas even, is getting a fkn tire is impossible, not fuel or electricity. There are thousands of things that can go wrong on a car that are outside of the control of the vehicle operator that can take days or weeks to resolve if in a remote area.. electricity is not one of them.

    14. Senior Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      20,100
      Vehicles
      2015 Fusion Wagon Allroad Turbo
      10-18-2019 11:26 AM #38
      It's always funny seeing all the interest and discussion road-trip EV charging gets when 80% of people would fly if a trip is over x hours. The idea of a coast-to-coast EV highway for Canada is presented as a point of pride, but very few people have or are willing to drive the vast stretch of trees & moose between Sudbury/North Bay and Winnipeg, much less through the prairies.

      When PetroCan/CT are done with their network, there'll be people doing this just to say they did, but that's about that. EV adoption is going to continue to be led by Quebec and Lower Mainland residents whose farthest trips are Burlington and Bellingham.

    15. Member
      Join Date
      Aug 4th, 2005
      Posts
      1,357
      Vehicles
      20 years of German cars led to this: 2016 RAV4 hybrid, 2020 Prius Prime
      10-18-2019 11:40 AM #39
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post
      It's always funny seeing all the interest and discussion road-trip EV charging gets when 80% of people would fly if a trip is over x hours. The idea of a coast-to-coast EV highway for Canada is presented as a point of pride, but very few people have or are willing to drive the vast stretch of trees & moose between Sudbury/North Bay and Winnipeg, much less through the prairies.

      When PetroCan/CT are done with their network, there'll be people doing this just to say they did, but that's about that. EV adoption is going to continue to be led by Quebec and Lower Mainland residents whose farthest trips are Burlington and Bellingham.
      I agree that not alot of people are going to drive coast to coast.

      But it will be a huge convenience leap in inter-provincial travelling. Driving from Montreal to Toronto, or Calgary to Vancouver for example, will be so much easier in an EV.

    16. 10-18-2019 11:45 AM #40
      Quote Originally Posted by Venom21 View Post
      I live in Alberta and all these stickers and banners are everywhere. It so obnoxious.
      No it's not. It's appropriate. I'd MUCH rather buy Canadian gasoline than I would from anywhere else in the world. I don't have that option, but if I did, I would absolutely support it.

    17. Senior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 23rd, 2000
      Location
      Shepherdstown, WV
      Posts
      23,207
      10-18-2019 11:46 AM #41
      Quote Originally Posted by Mike! View Post

      When PetroCan/CT are done with their network, there'll be people doing this just to say they did, but that's about that.
      So the same as people with ICE vehicles? Or does fuel source dictate desire to see moose?

      I agree that most people discussing it won't actually do this even in an ICE vehicle so when they look for problems with doing it in an EV it is rather amusing.



      I fall in the 20% though, and doing this trip isn't necessarily near the top of the list but has been discussed. Likely won't be in an EV though.

    18. Member Unilateral Phase Detractor's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 23rd, 2005
      Location
      Columbus, Ohio
      Posts
      13,596
      Vehicles
      2016 Mazda CX-5  2013 Ford Focus Electric
      10-18-2019 11:48 AM #42
      Quote Originally Posted by Lawrider View Post
      I really wish Walmart would adopt this, it would force others to do so.
      I guess you've been out of the loop...
      https://corporate.walmart.com/newsro...ther-expansion

    19. Senior Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      20,100
      Vehicles
      2015 Fusion Wagon Allroad Turbo
      10-18-2019 12:22 PM #43
      Quote Originally Posted by Dubveiser View Post
      I agree that not alot of people are going to drive coast to coast.

      But it will be a huge convenience leap in inter-provincial travelling. Driving from Montreal to Toronto, or Calgary to Vancouver for example, will be so much easier in an EV.
      You can do those right now though. Today. No PetroCan/CT stops needed. Quebec's got a whole electric corridor built out already so Southern ON all the way to the NB border is totally workable.

      I do think it's great someone's willing to put up the capital to fill in the middle-of-nowhere gaps, but realistically it's something that's not going to get a lot of use.

    20. 10-18-2019 12:41 PM #44
      Quote Originally Posted by Rob View Post
      No it's not. It's appropriate. I'd MUCH rather buy Canadian gasoline than I would from anywhere else in the world. I don't have that option, but if I did, I would absolutely support it.
      I'd rather slowly start the transition to renewables than build all these new refineries which would take years to become fully operational and most likely get stuck in regulatory hell (indigenous groups/B.C). I think there is a good middle ground that can be obtained without fully going backwards in time. If that makes me a Canada hating eco hippy then so be it.
      Last edited by Venom21; 10-18-2019 at 12:44 PM.

    21. Member MGQ's Avatar
      Join Date
      Apr 16th, 2002
      Location
      The City (:-l)
      Posts
      10,589
      Vehicles
      Fusion Hybrid
      10-18-2019 12:48 PM #45
      Quite literally any open 110volt outlet and a few hours of your time is your option for charging an EV.
      It really makes you wonder why anyone’s wasting their time with charging stations when literally any plug will do. Problem solved!
      This is only temporary, unless it works. - Red Green

    22. 10-18-2019 12:55 PM #46
      Sorry if I missed this or TLDR; but what is the charging rate and you do you think it will fluctuate daily like gas/diesel prices?

      What would it charge to full or half charge a Model X?

    23. Senior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 23rd, 2000
      Location
      Shepherdstown, WV
      Posts
      23,207
      10-18-2019 01:00 PM #47
      Quote Originally Posted by MGQ View Post
      It really makes you wonder why anyone’s wasting their time with charging stations when literally any plug will do. Problem solved!
      The problem with emergency situations, which is what you brought up, is easily solved with any open 110volt outlet.

      Having to wait a day for your EV to charge on that kind of power source is not any different than needing to wait a day for them to get you a serpentine belt for a GTI to a remote area. Or Candian tire wanting 300 bucks to "overnight" a 200 buck tire to Nova Scotia and overnight meant hopefully 3 days so you just double plug your sidewall puncture and drive another 1000+ miles until you can get back to a country that actually has decent tire distribution infrastructure..

      If the discussion is on people responsibly making sure that the fuel source for their vehicle is topped off before hitting a desolate stretch of road and being able to refuel on either end whether that be gasoline, diesel, or electrons then the infrastructure that this thread is about is relevant.

    24. Senior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 23rd, 2000
      Location
      Shepherdstown, WV
      Posts
      23,207
      10-18-2019 01:05 PM #48
      Quote Originally Posted by AdrockMK2 View Post
      Sorry if I missed this or TLDR; but what is the charging rate and you do you think it will fluctuate daily like gas/diesel prices?

      What would it charge to full or half charge a Model X?
      The first post is barely longer than your post...

      It is currently free.


      Does your electric rate at home fluctuate daily like gas prices?

    25. Member
      Join Date
      Aug 4th, 2005
      Posts
      1,357
      Vehicles
      20 years of German cars led to this: 2016 RAV4 hybrid, 2020 Prius Prime
      10-18-2019 01:21 PM #49
      Quote Originally Posted by MGQ View Post
      It really makes you wonder why anyone’s wasting their time with charging stations when literally any plug will do. Problem solved!
      Honestly, I think we're wasting our time with L2 charging infrastructure.

      Just a regular old 110v could work for almost everyone. We should stop installing L2 insfrastructure and spend that money on L3 for the occasional longer trip or quick top off.

      I think L2 was necessary a few years ago, for range anxiety when the first EV's had smaller packs and range, you absolutely had to leave with a full charge every morning. But with the bigger packs and range available now, I don't see the point in L2 charging.

      Personally my car spends almost 22-23 hours per day parked at work or at home. If I had an EV with a large pack like a Model X/Model 3 LR, it would spend most of the day charging on a regular 110v outlet, which works out to 11000kwh per year. That's 70000km, or 43000 miles of driving per year, on a regular old standard outlet charging at 1.4kw. If one can't plug in at work, and only overnight that still works out to over 6000kwh per year, 40000km per year or 25000 miles.

      Even if you're driving a ''thirsty'' Model X at 40kwh/100miles, you could drive 15000 miles per year exclusively on 110V power if you charge 12hours overnight each night, or over 25000 miles if you can also charge it up at work.

      I really think a more viable setup would be public charging should become L1 and L3 only. Charge slowly on L1 most of the time, and pop onto L3 when you're doing a road trip.

    26. Senior Member Mike!'s Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 17th, 2002
      Location
      Ontario & Ohio
      Posts
      20,100
      Vehicles
      2015 Fusion Wagon Allroad Turbo
      10-18-2019 01:51 PM #50
      Quote Originally Posted by Dubveiser View Post
      Honestly, I think we're wasting our time with L2 charging infrastructure.

      Just a regular old 110v could work for almost everyone. We should stop installing L2 insfrastructure and spend that money on L3 for the occasional longer trip or quick top off.

      I think L2 was necessary a few years ago, for range anxiety when the first EV's had smaller packs and range, you absolutely had to leave with a full charge every morning. But with the bigger packs and range available now, I don't see the point in L2 charging.

      Personally my car spends almost 22-23 hours per day parked at work or at home. If I had an EV with a large pack like a Model X/Model 3 LR, it would spend most of the day charging on a regular 110v outlet, which works out to 11000kwh per year. That's 70000km, or 43000 miles of driving per year, on a regular old standard outlet charging at 1.4kw. If one can't plug in at work, and only overnight that still works out to over 6000kwh per year, 40000km per year or 25000 miles.

      Even if you're driving a ''thirsty'' Model X at 40kwh/100miles, you could drive 15000 miles per year exclusively on 110V power if you charge 12hours overnight each night, or over 25000 miles if you can also charge it up at work.

      I really think a more viable setup would be public charging should become L1 and L3 only. Charge slowly on L1 most of the time, and pop onto L3 when you're doing a road trip.
      There's someone around this forum (Unilateral Phase Detractor?) who actually works in this kind of thing. Apparently you can install and power a whole bunch of L2 chargers for less than the cost of a single L3.

      That being said, I agree with you that installing a whole bunch of L1 plugs at hotel/office/apartment/condo parking garages, or even street parking spots, basically places where people will be plugged in a long time, makes a lot of sense. You're talking less than 5 miles per hour of charging, but for around town that's probably plenty to cover people's commutes and errands.

    Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •