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    Thread: MANN filter myth Debunked - OEM vs MANN vs Everyone

    1. n00b
      Join Date
      Sep 4th, 2014
      Location
      Chicago
      Posts
      5
      Vehicles
      2010 TIGUAN WOLFSBUGH
      11-22-2019 03:17 AM #1
      I usually do not write much in forums but i think i got some very important clue. I was thinking the only other filter i would use is the MANN. Most of the VW Audi peope i know do the same. Did you think the MANN oil filter is second best after the OEM filter?
      Looks like there are quite a lot of other brands the “outsource” their filter for the 2.0 engine directly from MANN. They basically have clone filters. And I found 2 better filter (there might be few more too)
      I made a little bit boring video but better than nothing. The video is long but if you watch you will see that for Example Purolator Or STP have improved filter with synthetic media while Carquest, Napa, Bosch, WIX, Microguard and few others have the Original oem filter inside. Never knew when going to oreily can get you oem filter. Or even better according to me.

      I will go over few brands here that I found to be exact oem filter and made in Germany

      STP S10600 and S10600XL sold at autozone – the regular and the medium grade are made in USA with ok quality.
      STP S10600ML – has oem made filter by MANN with improved “white” synthetic media

      Carquest (advance auto)the very regular one has been US made (same as stp regular) and then they switched to german made by MANN which is exact OEM filter

      NAPA - Proselect and gold are by now updated german made by MANN filter. Possibly the Gold is white synthetic media while the pro select is exact oem filter (exeption: some filters may be the Polish made which are updated by now but your store may still have the old one)

      Microguard sold at oreily – this is also an OEM filter made in germany
      WIX – Another oem filter. Wix does not make XP version of that filter.
      FRAM – Previously made in USA (same as STP and mobil1 EP) but now made in china with surprising quality and the “Ultra synthetic” series is white media and mesh backed (or fronted actually)

      K&N - USA made filter just like STP and Mobil1. K&N does not have the higher class "HP" series filter for this engine which is usaually the synthetic media for other cars.

      Mobil 1 -20 000 miles extended performance – Disappointment from mobil 1. This is same exact filter as STP and I doubt it’s the very best filter here. Although not a garbage they should not misadvertise it for 20000 miles. Or maybe the other companies misadvertise their filters instead.

      MANN – It’s a Mann filter lol
      OEM – It’s a Mann made filter and has 2 small differences, maybe so its not a direct clone and VW can say its actually different. The thread insert is tiny bit higher and made by different color steel. Also the plastic part on the bottom is different. Filtering media itself is 1:1

      BOSCH Premium – Its Chinese made and very good quality. According to the catalog and looking at their extended performance filter is made in Germany by Mann but no idea which version of it. Bosch makes "Distance plus" filters which are made in Germany by Mann but have no idea if it is the exact OEM or the improved white media. They do not make the "workshop" one

      Champ Labs – they have also updated their 2.0tsi filter to a German made MANN but no idea if it’s the exact oem or the “white” filter

      Penzzoil – I couldn’t find where to buy it but looks like it is german made filter by MANN but no idea which one of the 2 it is.

      There might be some other ones out there.
      Let me know if you guy have any other info or there is something wrong with the review

      https://youtu.be/4fmTeZMvzg4

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    3. 11-22-2019 12:18 PM #2
      Interesting video. All I can agree with you is that many of the filters appear to be made from the same factory and materials.

      The information that you showed are the facts today. Since all the companies appear to sublet the filter builds, who's to say that they will not change their sublet builder tomorrow? I will stick with MANN since they build their own filters.


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    5. 11-23-2019 10:09 AM #4
      I would not. Why? Several reasons.

      #1] I own a shop and my supplier does not supply Wix.
      #2] I honestly do not believe oil gets that dirty that you could plug up a stock oil filter [MANN filter].
      #3] So if a stock filter will last for 300k miles [with proper oil/filter services]. Do I feel that the 'better' filter will allow the engine to last longer? No. I honestly do not believe that engines wear out due to poor oil filter maintenance, it's poor oil quality/maintenance intervals. The engine will fail for other reasons [timing chains/guides/tensioners].
      #4] If I should be able to get a Wix filter AND there was an issue that the dealership had to fix, there would be an issue with a non OEM filter. I know that for a fact. I was the guy at the dealership that if I saw a non OEM oil filter with a warranty issue, I would flag it. It gets real ugly when the engineers get involved.

      I find your video informative. I'm surprised that MANN does not make a synthetic media [if that is indeed what the white filter is] under their name. MANN does not market for the DIY'ers and maybe that is why. Their main focus is to supply the manufacturers with oil filters and it seems their secondary focus is to supply oil filters for the aftermarket suppliers.

      Want to know something else that is weird with me? I like using MANN's W719/30 vs their W719/5 filter [that is what my engine uses]. What is the difference? The W719/30 uses a long life synthetic filter media and silicone seals. Why would I use a MANN product with better filters/seals than a MANN product sold under the Wix label? I do not know but would it matter what I think? I'm just a butcher that fixes cars for a living.

    6. n00b
      Join Date
      Sep 4th, 2014
      Location
      Chicago
      Posts
      5
      Vehicles
      2010 TIGUAN WOLFSBUGH
      11-24-2019 04:56 AM #5
      I totally agree but my point is when my car is already out of warranty i certainly dont want to use other questionable filters except the oem. But in this case there are like 5+ oems out there so for the freaks like me anything questionable has no room under the engine and unless i knew regular purolator is OEM i wouldnt put it. For many guys even the tire stem caps matter and some fancy purolator boss would fit in their cars and make them feel better somewhat, not the engine itself
      And also most times its true the problems come from the not regular maintenance rather than a particular filter.

    7. 11-24-2019 01:09 PM #6
      Again, I find your video very informative. Especially for the person that is trying to save a penny. You have proven that the main difference of the oil filter was the color of the can.

      In a nutshell, I'm not buying any of the parts I install. My client is. I'm selling a service. It does me no good to install something cheap because I will just have to do it over again AND the client will wonder if I'm any good. Most of the filters you have would not be sold thru my parts warehouse. They are made for the DIY'ers and if I was one, I would appreciate your video more.

      I mostly work on Mercedes. Mercedes has a belt tensioner that wears out around 100k. Gate's manufactures the Mercedes belt tensioner. If I purchase a Gates version, when I open the box, the factory Mercedes number is machined off. So it's a factory part in a Gates box. If I buy a Febi version, when I open the box, it's a Gates part with the factory Mercedes number machined off.

      So what is the difference? The Febi unit is about $40,the Gates is about $90, and the factory is $220. I think that is what you are trying to promote. Sometimes when you open the box [in your case the can] you find out it's just the same high quality part that the factory is using. My example is there is a $180 difference. Your example is maybe a dollar to two. Both examples are a great way of saving money.

    8. 11-25-2019 12:11 PM #7
      It isn't feasible for every manufacturer to produce every imaginable part number.

      Many brands don't produce any filters and contract production out to whoever makes what they want for the price they want.

      MannHummel now owns Wix, Purolator, Filtron(Poland) and bought various other filter manufacturing plants around the world over the years. Parts consolidation among MH brands has been happening.

      For some, it has nothing to do with price. Not everyone lives near a dealer or cares to bulk shop online. A 40-100 miles trip to a city dealership is not convenient when there are a 1/2 dozen major autopart stores in town 10 miles away. I have yet to see or have a failure caused by non-OE filters. I have seen plenty of user errors, like cross threading, overtorqued stripped nipples, improper PN's, engine mods that kill filter(GM and old Nissan filter bypass removals), undersized diameter hose for remote filters and improper hose flow routing, pre-damaged filters being installed....

      Concerning oil filtration, I've worked for two major filter manufacturers over the years and have no need to use OE filters or motor oil from ANY automaker.

      I am glad to see MH adapting to the synth medias developed and utilized for years by Wix and Purolator. Hope they expand the MH line with this premium filtration media. Since synth media has been available, I haven't purchased 'cellulose' media oil filters. Cellulose filtration and conventional oils are simply obsolete.

      From what I understand, cellulose media is cleaner to burn at the waste to energy plants in Europe and filter manufacturers in Europe wanted to avoid synth media.

      Well, since I have my made in Mexico Jetta S with Chinese, majority Central/South American, and a few German parts, I see no need for 'made in Germany' filters. My OE filter was made in Turkey. For those of you with Fram Derangement Syndrome, or blind fanboy MH syndrome, my last couple oil changes used Fram filters for their superior double layered synth media filtration. My other option that I'm considering is the remote filter with Baldwin, Fleetguard, or Donaldson filters.... true media pioneers. I'm glad that I don't have an annoying cartridge or pipe filter. Good ol' 3/4-16 engine block oil nipple that works with the common Ford/Mopar/Toyota and industry 3/4-16 filters.

    9. 11-26-2019 11:24 AM #8
      I have seen MANY failed oil filters that are not OEM. Most of them were installed from places that perform quick lubes. How do I know? When I take the cartridge filter out, the filter is in pieces. I have no doubt that the filter is all over the inside of the engine. I've seen filter media crumble like potato chips as I take them off the filter cover. I have seen Fram metal filters expand due to factory oil pressures. I've seen quick lube shops change the oil but use the original filter [they did not have one]. I've seen them not install filters too.

      Where the filter is made does not matter. It's the manufacturers goals that matter. Any good manufacturer can build any quality product anywhere in the world. It's the same as any poor manufacturer can build junk anywhere too.

      Without a doubt, a cartridge filter is by far the best way to filter oil and to prevent unwanted waste. It allows an average mechanic to simply check the filter for debris/issues without spending a massive amount of time. It's because of cartridge filters that I can say for certain non OEM filters are usually poorly made. You cannot say that with a canister filter. NOBODY cuts open a filter every time they swap it out. So if no one does, then how can anyone say the filter did not break down?

      Remote filters offer a larger chance of something happening. Less is more.

    10. 11-27-2019 10:25 PM #9
      I've cut open just about every spin-on filter I've use. Most cant use a dipstick or tire PSI gauge and I'd wager that most are not DIY either.

      I've never had a problem with remote filters. It just requires competence to do a good install. So, for me, less is not more.

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