The Arteon doesn't fare any better
...so this is a good thing? seems like both cars did just fine. oversteer is much easier to correct than understeer, especially in a front-wheel drive car. hats off to Volkswagen to making their cars rotate again.
Any car which holds together for a whole race is too heavy.
Normal ordinary cars designed to be driven by everyone are designed to understeer. But ... unless it is calibrated to understeer like a pig, oversteer can still be induced by certain driver actions under the right conditions. Evidently the moose test is what those conditions are for these cars.
ESP has allowed suspension calibrations that would have been trouble in the old days, and many ESP calibrations nowadays will let the car get a little bit loose before intervening. That's probably what is happening here. The car never actually spun, it never actually left the road, in one of the slo-mo shots you could see front wheels momentarily starting to lock due to ESP intervention. Not a big deal.
Oh, the US exclusive XDS is interesting. If (and it’s a big if) XDS works under decelerations I could see where it may help slightly; just as a RWD car with a spool limits movement at the front. That said, if this is indeed market specific I would be looking more at the suspension.Originally Posted by ice4life
The test video stated it was a TDI 4mo. However, I have a really hard time believing that is normal behavior having been behind the wheel of one for 6 months. Like I said the only other factor would be XDS which absolutely effects stability. It is standard in the US and optional overseas.
the typical reaction to understeer is more wheel, turning in more, which only makes it worse. if there is braking invovled, they also push harder on the brakes, which again, makes the whole problem worse. training that out of people is hard to do.
oversteer the counter steering comes naturally, it the throttle input that will screw you here. but the real reason we see cars tuned for understeer is that the front of the car is way safer to crash, rather than the sides or rear.
The problem with requiring a driver to actively steer out of an oversteer situation is that most drivers won't give the correct amount of opposite correction and do it quickly enough - and 99+% of cars, especially nowadays, don't transmit enough feel through the steering to give the driver a hope of feeling the correct amount. And lots of drivers will simply panic and do nothing.
Sure, if you have something with quick, direct steering and good steering geometry, you can feel it (and not all drivers will know what to do with that road feel even if they are provided with it). Otherwise ...
its actually kind of amazing to watch in-car of drivers. the hands are rarely the issue in oversteer. because it makes intuitive sense, as the car starts to over-rotate, the brain is just like ... ummm, i dont want to be pointing this way, i want to be over there, and the hands just naturally do it. now, sometimes the hands lag when the car catches itself, but most of the time that issue is actually a foot one ... lifting.
if you think of the intuitive reaction to understeer, which is "ummmm car isn't turning, i want to be over there, there, now ive added more steering to get over there" you can see where its a problem. how many students cars have you been in watching them continuously adding steering while the car understeers off the track? lots is my answer. training someone to freeze or reduce steering input in understeer is a tough one. its very counter intuitive.
but we digress, the main reason for setting up a street car with understeer bias is so that all that nice crash structure and safety features hits first, like its designed to. not because untrained drivers are better at dealing with it.
Finally got to watch the video.... I think the driver reacted slowly in the Arteon test. In the final "turn" he seemed slow to turn the wheel. But maybe that's just a viewer expecting too much.
None of this looks dangerous to me. Crazy inputs result in (somewhat) crazy response from the car. Would you prefer it to ignore the driver instead?
And I'm not some kind of extreme libertarian who would recommend to just leave a one-star review on yelp if a product is poorly designed and kills you and your whole family ... Like I don't think cars should threaten to flip over when you punch the brakes (e.g.)
OMG that was a while ago!Originally Posted by patrikman
Could easily be; any number of subtle differences could explain a difference. This test transfers forward on decel and then loads up the right side of the car hard, with a complete/sudden transfer from full right to full left just after. It's a rather specific test and could be as simple as the euro version having a stiffer rear end. Which maybe they do; these cars have a tow rating in Europe.Originally Posted by ice4life