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    View Poll Results: Help!

    Voters
    84. You may not vote on this poll
    • Gen 1 Volt

      22 26.19%
    • Gen 2 Volt

      19 22.62%
    • Tesla

      6 7.14%
    • Keep the GTI

      25 29.76%
    • Go away, VadGTI. Please.

      12 14.29%
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    Thread: TCL, I need your help. I think I'm going electric but I am somewhat lost.

    1. Senior Member VadGTI's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:20 PM #1
      After driving the $1,600 (net) Volt (see previous thread) for a couple of weeks, I've fallen in love with the no-gas silent propulsion of these things. The car did not visit a gas station once during my time with it. Since this Volt was for my girlfriend to replace her Saab, I now want an EV for myself... I think. For anyone wondering just how much I drive and how much I spend on gas, my Fuelly (which has been going since day 1 of ownership) has me at 64.8k miles in 6.5 years with $10,900 spent on gas in that time period.

      Some background: In mid-December, I ran my GTI through Carvana's car-buying calculator for the hell of it. The calculator came back with $10,980 for my '13 64.9k mile Wolfsburg Edition, which seemed quite good even for private party value. The quote was good for 7 days and I didn't act on it. On January 3, I ran the calculator again. This time it spit out a buy price of $9,100, a drop of nearly $2k over a couple of weeks. I decided to see what would happen if I went back to the old Carvana email and accepted the previous quote. I clicked and was immediately presented with a message that my nearly $11k quote had been revived for 24 hours. I uploaded all the paperwork and have a pick-up scheduled for this Sunday (which I can delay for up to two weeks).

      I have now arrived at what seem to be three options. Well, four if you count keeping the GTI.

      Here they are and here are how they play out financially:

      Option 1: 2013 Volt Premium (nav, collision alert, blind spot monitors, reversing camera)
      Cost: $8,000



      Benefits/cons:
      - 82k miles, so CARB/PZEV warranty on the battery is good for 10 years/150k (so, based on the car's in-service date, it would run out at the end of 2023). Voltec warranty is 15 years/150k miles, so all the EV components aside from the battery would be warrantied until 2028.
      - I would be using zero gas 90% of the time (I sometimes need to drive a couple of hundred miles per day for work, so the gas engine would kick in then), as my commute is 12 miles round trip. I'd charge at work most of the time.
      - $3k in my pocket + $1,500 utility rebate
      Cons:
      - Insurance goes up by $250/year
      - Have to buy TCLer titleist1976 lunch since he's going to inspect it for me on Friday .

      Option 2: 2016 Volt Premier (has all of the above plus adaptive cruise and self parking)
      Cost: $17,000



      Benefits/cons:
      - 30k miles, so lots of warranty left
      - longer range (53 miles vs. 40 on the Gen 1 volt)
      - Still gets the $1,500 rebate
      Cons:
      - Have to pony up $5-6k, which somewhat negates any real or perceived gas savings.
      - Insurance goes up by $388 per year, further negating any savings
      -Looks like a terrible, weirdly-stretched Cruise. Gen 1 looks so much better.


      Option 3: Used Tesla Model S 85
      Price: $29k (give or take)



      Benefits/cons:
      - 62k miles, ex-CPO car with some warranty left on the battery. Many things that go wrong have been replaced (MCU, sunroof, backup camera).
      - It's a Tesla!
      - Lifetime supercharging!
      - 265 miles of range

      Cons:
      - Insurance goes up by a whopping $1,562/year.
      - Idiot, it's an early model Tesla! Are you insane?
      - Some things that do fail have not failed and maybe they're due for failure (drive motor/door handles, etc.)
      - I don't have Level 2 at home and 110v charging for these is unworkable. If the chargers at work are full, I'd have to drive to the nearest Supercharger station, which is about 8 miles away and hang out there for a bit while charging
      - Would rather not pony up that much extra cash so some portion of this would likely be financed and I'd be financing a 2013 Tesla, which just sounds insane.

      Option 4: Keep the GTI, which has long been paid off and which, as a PZEV car, has a 15 year/150k mile warranty on "emissions" components (many things qualify as an "emissions" component in a CARB state).

      This morning:


      Pros:
      - This thing is still able to put a smile on my face and, but for the EV stuff, nothing else currently on the market really speaks to me.
      - Paid off
      - Lots of things have recently been repaired under warranty and extended warranty including: a seal that allowed the #3 spark plug to drown in oil, the AC compressor, the intake manifold, the HPFP, and the water pump (multiple water pumps, actually)

      Cons:
      - There are lots of things left to fail (it's a VW, after all) that are not covered by the PZEV warranty.
      - It'll keep depreciating and I'll lose $2k in Carvana cash if I don't move now.
      - It'll probably need a clutch soon-ish. I can feel it doing weird things at WOT in 6th. Then again, it's been doing that for the last 10k
      - There is an element of boredom creeping in, which will only get worse.

      So, TCL, what do I do? I am genuinely lost. On the one hand, I've loved this EV thing over the last two weeks. Really, truly loved it. On the other hand, I love the GTI and really don't want to let it go. There's always the 993 to drive as a fun car but I'm concerned a certain element of fun will be missing day to day. Then again, 96% of my day-to-day driving is very mundane (aside from on-ramps/off-ramps, etc.), and, truth be told, any commuter car would be fine for the job.

      Help, TCL. Please. Am I missing other reasonable EV options that I should be considering? Will I be bored of this EV stuff soon and stuck driving a soul-sucking appliance day to day?

      The Volt this morning, fresh from a 3.5 hour detail. The detailers did an excellent job.

      Last edited by VadGTI; 01-08-2020 at 05:39 PM.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Jrod511 View Post
      If I could do one thing with a DeLorean it would be to give Vad's parents a condom.
      Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
      Do you want to be known as the guy who makes worse automotive decisions than VadGTI?

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    3. Member smoothsix's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:25 PM #2
      One of the Volts, I guess. I'm not sure keeping the GTI is much of an option because you seem to have your eye out for a 'new' car; I know how that goes.

      Haven't driven a second gen so I don't have much of an opinion on 1st vs 2nd

      Gotta be nuts to buy an EV with no charging at home.
      Dash cam people suck. Don't be a dash cam person.

      Quote Originally Posted by Dravenport View Post
      this thread is a mess, I can't tell if it's full of trolls or idiots and I'm not sure it matters

    4. Member vwpiloto's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:26 PM #3
      How about a standard range Model 3 for $33K with the credits applied? I think it's a better choice than a used Tesla, and I'd be afraid on any non-CPO used Tesla, even if it has a little warranty left on the batteries. With your 10K mile/year average, I don't think you'll lose much in deprecation with a Model 3, so your total cost of ownership may not be so different than your Option 2 (the better equipped Volt).

      Of your options, I'd say the cheapest is Option 4, but between the others, I'd get the nicer Volt with the goodies, especially adaptive cruise.

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      01-08-2020 05:29 PM #4
      I voted keep the GTI; from what you've described it seems like the EV thing is more of a novelty than a rationality. My 2nd choice from these would be the 2nd Gen Volt. Personally I wouldn't consider the other options, if you're going to all the work of trading dailies, the odometer ought to go down.

      Another thing to consider is a Mk7 GTI. Have you driven one? The fit and finish is down slightly but they drive quite a bit better than Mk5/6.

    6. Senior Member VadGTI's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:32 PM #5
      Quote Originally Posted by smoothsix View Post
      Gotta be nuts to buy an EV with no charging at home.
      The 110v has been working fine for the Volt. In fact, I was able to squeeze out two back-and-forth trips to work without charging overnight. Obviously wouldn't really work for a Tesla. There will be Level 2 installed at a new place if everything falls into place, but that won't be for several months at least.

      Quote Originally Posted by vwpiloto View Post
      How about a standard range Model 3 for $33K with the credits applied? I think it's a better choice than a used Tesla, and I'd be afraid on any non-CPO used Tesla, even if it has a little warranty left on the batteries. With your 10K mile/year average, I don't think you'll lose much in deprecation with a Model 3, so your total cost of ownership may not be so different than your Option 2 (the better equipped Volt).

      Of your options, I'd say the cheapest is Option 4, but between the others, I'd get the nicer Volt with the goodies, especially adaptive cruise.
      My understanding was the credits for the Model 3 have all been wiped out and there isn't a $33k model anymore? And no lifetime supercharging on these, right?
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      Quote Originally Posted by Jrod511 View Post
      If I could do one thing with a DeLorean it would be to give Vad's parents a condom.
      Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
      Do you want to be known as the guy who makes worse automotive decisions than VadGTI?

    7. Senior Member VadGTI's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:38 PM #6
      Quote Originally Posted by ghost03 View Post
      I voted keep the GTI; from what you've described it seems like the EV thing is more of a novelty than a rationality. My 2nd choice from these would be the 2nd Gen Volt. Personally I wouldn't consider the other options, if you're going to all the work of trading dailies, the odometer ought to go down.

      Another thing to consider is a Mk7 GTI. Have you driven one? The fit and finish is down slightly but they drive quite a bit better than Mk5/6.
      I haven't driven one. That's probably what I should have added to my original post. The only new reasonably-priced car on the market that really speaks to me is the Mk7/Mk7.5 GTI. It just feels like there's not enough of a difference in the two cars to justify ponying up another $12-13k for a Mk7.5 SE.

      And yes, you're right. I am concerned that it's a novelty that I'd quickly get over. It would save me about $1,600-1,800 a year in gas, however, based on 6.5 years of tracking. And then there's that looming clutch replacement on the Mk6...
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      Quote Originally Posted by Jrod511 View Post
      If I could do one thing with a DeLorean it would be to give Vad's parents a condom.
      Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
      Do you want to be known as the guy who makes worse automotive decisions than VadGTI?

    8. Member CostcoPizza's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:45 PM #7
      I'm usually a proponent of keep the car, but it sounds like yours has bucked the MK6 general reliability trend.

      I vote Volt, though what about eGolf? And on your longer commute days trade with GF.

    9. 01-08-2020 05:46 PM #8
      Because of my experience with and admiration for our loaded '15 Volt, I'd have to suggest you go for the first choice, with the added incentive of money in your pocket. Teslas are fine and good, but with the inability to cross vast swaths of interstate without some drama, the added expenses of a suitable home charger installation, and the absurd insurance premiums, I'd be kicking myself every time I got in it (there's a mental image for you). The first Volt was truly a moonshot for GM, and it shows with long-term ownership, plus you can plug it in overnight to any 120v plug and you're all good to go by morning. The G2 Volts were slightly decontented and to my aging eyes not even as handsome, plus more money out of pocket? Nahhh...

      Or keep the VW, you Luddite, and stay the course...

    10. Member Crispyfritter's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:51 PM #9
      I'd go with the 2016. But do you actually buy anything in your threads?

      Chris
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      01-08-2020 05:53 PM #10
      1st gen Volt for sure.

    12. Member Dirty Hatch's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 05:54 PM #11
      Is a clutch replacement on the MK6 and Mk7 really that expensive? I keep hearing people bring that up with these cars. To answer your question Vad:

      Option1 sounds like the cheapest option since you get to pocket $3K, but that could bit you in the ass later on with repairs. I have no idea how durable the 1st gen volts are, but a car with 82K is going to start needing repairs such as suspension, tires, brakes and other annoying things.

      Option2 is probably a better option than Option1 since you are getting a newer car with a warranty, but it will cost you more to insure and the purchase price is higher than your current car, so there is that to consider as well.

      Option3 Could be fun, but could be a pain at the same time. Definatly the riskiest of all the options.

      Option4 May not be the cheapest option, but might be the best option. You seem to like the car, just concerned it's going to start costing you money in repairs. Plus, you have had it for awhile now and just want a different dash to look at.

      If I were in your shoes, I would probably hold on the the git for another year and see if you still have that love with the no gas silent thing and not just a phase you are going through.

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      01-08-2020 05:57 PM #12
      I don't know how important blind spot warning is to you; IIRC the first generation Volt did not have BSW. It arrived in the 2nd gen. I don't think early Model S's had it either.

      I pretty much hate Elon Musk, and thus would not buy a Tesla. But I also think the Model S is a pretty special car to drive (I've put a good number of miles on them.)

      Also, judging by your annual miles, are your trips short enough that you could buy a used eGolf? 2017 is a good year for those, as they gained around 40 more miles of range compared to earlier versions.

      Tom

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      01-08-2020 06:00 PM #13
      Quote Originally Posted by CostcoPizza View Post
      I vote Volt, though what about eGolf?
      This. I hella miss my eGolf.

      Since you like Volt, what about Bolt?

    15. Member t_white's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:00 PM #14
      1. Sell the GTI. I still don't understand the $11k offer you got, but I would take it and run.
      2. Drive the 993 (or the gf's SAAB for a little while).
      3. Profit?!?

    16. Senior Member Mike!'s Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:02 PM #15
      I like the Gen 2 Volt looks over the Gen 1 (just not in that weird Breige color) so I'd consider springing the difference for the Gen 2. If you like the Gen 1 and are okay having two of them though, go for it. $8k vs. $11k leaves a bit left over.

      "Want" would lean towards the cheap Model 3 suggestion, but that is significantly more money.

    17. 01-08-2020 06:04 PM #16
      Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Hatch View Post
      Is a clutch replacement on the MK6 and Mk7 really that expensive? I keep hearing people bring that up with these cars. To answer your question Vad:
      It's probably a 1k to 2k repair job depending where he gets it done, cheaper if its DIY'ed or you have someone giving you a decent discount, but there are a lot of "while you are in there" things with the clutch

    18. Senior Member chucchinchilla's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:05 PM #17
      I've learned when it comes to stuff like this the most cost effective, logical solution is always the least sexy. Therefore Option 1 or keep GTI.

      That said you're bored of the GTI and having two of the exact same car is also boring. Newer Volt would at least mix things up and while adaptive cruise is great, it really shines in stop/go traffic. If that system can do stop/go (i.e. not cut out below 20mph or something) then I'd call that a big win and get the car.. If it doesn't then I'd look at something else as there are a fair number of EV/PHEVs out there. Personally I'd look at the i3. Funky design and cool materials would keep me from getting bored and these cars can be easily had in the mid teens w/low mileage. Of course you really love your GTI (I loved my MK6 as well) so perhaps an E-Golf would be the best of both worlds? What would really be cool is to make it a DIY Golf GTE by bolting on GTI stuff.
      Last edited by chucchinchilla; 01-08-2020 at 06:07 PM.
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    19. Senior Member VadGTI's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:06 PM #18
      Quote Originally Posted by Crispyfritter View Post
      I'd go with the 2016. But do you actually buy anything in your threads?

      Chris
      Hey, I bought the M3 and the Saab and the 993. Those all had threads .

      Quote Originally Posted by mutcth View Post
      I don't know how important blind spot warning is to you; IIRC the first generation Volt did not have BSW. It arrived in the 2nd gen. I don't think early Model S's had it either.

      I pretty much hate Elon Musk, and thus would not buy a Tesla. But I also think the Model S is a pretty special car to drive (I've put a good number of miles on them.)

      Also, judging by your annual miles, are your trips short enough that you could buy a used eGolf? 2017 is a good year for those, as they gained around 40 more miles of range compared to earlier versions.

      Tom
      You're right, I misspoke (mistyped?) and meant to say lane-keeper assistance or whatever that tech is called.

      It seems that most of the 2017 eGolfs are still on lease and there isn't a very good selection of used ones. The one issue with the eGolf that the used Tesla doesn't have is the nearby supercharger. If I didn't get to charge at work, I'd need to plug it into a public charging station, since a 110v charge just wouldn't cut it with an eGolf. This is where the Volt excels, with that gas backup.

      Quote Originally Posted by 2000JettaGLXVR6 View Post
      This. I hella miss my eGolf.

      Since you like Volt, what about Bolt?
      Same as above with the eGolf.

      Quote Originally Posted by t_white View Post
      1. Sell the GTI. I still don't understand the $11k offer you got, but I would take it and run.
      2. Drive the 993 (or the gf's SAAB for a little while).
      3. Profit?!?
      Good, I actually wanted some confirmation that it was a crazy good offer and I guess I have it now . The 993 is on collector car insurance, so no dailying that. I guess I could drive the Saab, since it's just sitting there unloved now .
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      Quote Originally Posted by Jrod511 View Post
      If I could do one thing with a DeLorean it would be to give Vad's parents a condom.
      Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
      Do you want to be known as the guy who makes worse automotive decisions than VadGTI?

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      01-08-2020 06:09 PM #19
      Quote Originally Posted by VadGTI View Post
      It just feels like there's not enough of a difference in the two cars to justify ponying up another $12-13k for a Mk7.5 SE.
      My best advice is to go drive one. I can't tell you what $12-13k is worth, but overall Mk7 is a huge upgrade over Mk5/6. Be warned: I think Sign-Then-Drive is on right now, so you may end up taking home the car you test drive.

    21. Senior Member VadGTI's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:12 PM #20
      Quote Originally Posted by ghost03 View Post
      My best advice is to go drive one. I can't tell you what $12-13k is worth, but overall Mk7 is a huge upgrade over Mk5/6. Be warned: I think Sign-Then-Drive is on right now, so you may end up taking home the car you test drive.
      I'm not falling for that trick! That's how I ended up with this GTI. Went to the dealership because SoCalDubber convinced me to come by and drive a GLI he just got in. I told him I didn't want a GLI, but he wanted my opinion post-drive. I was right, I didn't want a GLI...





      ... so I ended up leaving with a GTI.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Jrod511 View Post
      If I could do one thing with a DeLorean it would be to give Vad's parents a condom.
      Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
      Do you want to be known as the guy who makes worse automotive decisions than VadGTI?

    22. Geriatric Member absoluteczech's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:12 PM #21
      Arent eGolf's selling for like 11-13k? x3 on the eGolf. Has 100 mile range iirc and it will all still feel familiar to your GTI

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      01-08-2020 06:17 PM #22
      Quote Originally Posted by Dirty Hatch View Post
      Is a clutch replacement on the MK6 and Mk7 really that expensive? I keep hearing people bring that up with these cars. To answer your question Vad:
      It's not tremendous but it's definitely not small. I've done it twice, both times it was a weekend-level job for me; there's not a whole lot of room to work in there. IIRC to leave the front clip on you have to spin the trans a little as it goes in/out. And then a stock clutch is probably a $600 part or so.

    24. Member chois's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:24 PM #23
      In this case my buddy Dave's advice is best:

      "There's no such thing as the last deal"

      Squeeze another 2-3 years out of the GTI and your electrified options will be nicer, more reliable and more affordable.
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    25. Senior Member Lwize's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:34 PM #24
      The Volt honeymoon will fade.

      Keep the GTI.
      Epstein is alive.

    26. Member Surf Green's Avatar
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      01-08-2020 06:41 PM #25
      I said keep the GTI until it becomes problematic, and then look around at electrics.

      ....but figured I'd drop this on the last post of the page. If you leave your GF, you can keep that $1,600 Volt for yourself.
      I keep up with traffic with only 90 hp. What's your superpower?
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